“Criticizing lawyers for lawsuits is like criticizing linebackers for knocking people down.” Dale Dauten
There was money to be made, and it appears Ramsey made it.
The Washington Post posted Dave Ramsey promoted a timeshare quick-fix. His listeners called fraud. Ramsey, in his bombastic on-air persona, said about this company, Timeshare Exit Team:
“I never could find anything until I found this company called Timeshare Exit Team about three years ago,” he said in a December 2018 segment. “We started endorsing them, and I’ve had so much fun” bothering timeshare companies, he said.
And so, his listeners probably based their hopes on a Ramsey “certified” solution. I have listened to his show, and he sure believes he can solve one’s “money” problems. As always, Ramsey profits from his show, his programs for churches, and his endorsed products. I’m talking big money. His net worth is estimated to be $200 million. I would not be shocked if he were worth more.
17 of the podcast and radio host’s listeners have filed a $150 million lawsuit against him, alleging that he played a role in defrauding them of millions of dollars when he promoted a timeshare-exit company that did not get them out of their contracts.
Ramsey was allegedly paid as much as $30 million from 2015 to 2021 to endorse Timeshare Exit Team, which collected $200 million from clients — many of whom were his listeners
And now, a group of 17 listeners has sued him.
The lawsuit from 17 listeners in Washington state and California, which was filed April 28 in U.S. District Court for the Western District of Washington, is seeking $150 million in damages. The Ramsey listeners said the host engaged in negligent misrepresentation, unjust enrichment and violation of consumer protection laws when he promoted the company that cost his listeners while he profited from their financial heartacheI
Religion News Services posted Dave Ramsey sued for $150 million by former fans who followed his timeshare exit advice. There was a promise that the advice worked; if not, there was a money-back guarantee! I love money-back guarantees when they are in writing. There is a problem. The company didn’t appear prepared to make good on its guarantee.
It promised customers a 100% money-back guarantee, but how was it going to pay that?” Albert said. “There was no trust account. No reserve account.
Ramsey alleged a grand conspiracy.
WaPo said:
Ramsey stuck by the company, despite its legal troubles and allegations it had defrauded customers — claiming government officials, reporters and the timeshare industry had conspired against them.“Instead of acknowledging the deception, Ramsey recorded a nine-minute radio segment in which he lashed out at anyone he felt to be responsible for Reed Hein’s woes,” the complaint alleges.
In 2018, he was still endorsing the company. The vidoe is still up and running.
One story of fraud.
ClutchPoints posted that listeners sued Dave Ramsey for $150M due to poor financial advice. Here is what is alleged to have happened to one older couple.
Roseanne, a devoted listener of Ramsey’s Christian financial advice show, heard him discussing the pitfalls of timeshares. Ramsey offered a solution: the Timeshare Exit Team, promising a full refund if they couldn’t help them escape their financial obligations.
Following Ramsey’s endorsement, the Morrills contacted the Bellevue-based company and paid a hefty $40,000 for its services. However, they never managed to cancel their timeshare contract nor receive the promised refund.
Timeshare Exit Team is now kaput, and that’s bad news for those who trusted Ramsey and his endorsed company.
According to Planner at Heart in Dave Ramsey Endorsed Timeshare Exit Team Closed After Lawsuit; Don’t Fall Prey to Similar Companies
After a lawsuit by the State of Washington, an Inside Edition investigation, a Better Business Bureau “F” rating, and hoards of complaints, the Timeshare Exit Team has closed, taking outstanding cases and people’s hard-earned money with them.
…according to Washington State’s lawsuit, since 2012, they have “unfairly and deceptively contracted with more than 32,000 consumers looking to be rid of their unwanted timeshares, and have collected millions of dollars in upfront fees from consumers in the process.”
…Despite their advertisements, Reed Hein had no expertise in ending timeshare contracts, and customers eventually figured this out. But, according to Washington State’s lawsuit, since 2012, they have “unfairly and deceptively contracted with more than 32,000 consumers looking to be rid of their unwanted timeshares, and have collected millions of dollars in upfront fees from consumers in the process.”
Ramsey was known for his disdain for the Timeshare business.
Church Leaders posted Dave Ramsey declares war on timeshare industry: ‘You done pissed off the wrong hillbilly.‘
In a recent episode of his talk show titled “Timeshare Companies Are The Last Legal Fraud in America,” the Christian financial guru and radio host spent an hour ranting about what he called the “scummy” timeshare industry and berating anyone “stupid” enough to buy into the real estate ventures, which allow consumers to buy several weeks’ annual residence in a home, usually in vacation spots
In my opinion, it was his bombastic, “I’ll get you,” finger waving and pointing that led his many followers to believe he would do something about this. I share his disdaind for timeshares but have great empathy for those who were talked into this “deal of a lifetime.”
…Reporters from the television newsmagazine “Inside Edition” have also earned Ramsey’s ire by attempting to interview him during a recent event about his ties to the company. Ramsey claimed the reporters had “ambushed him.”
“I’ll answer your question, why did I endorse Timeshare Exit Team?” he said. “Because they were doing the right thing and getting people out of timeshares after companies like Mikey’s had screwed them. That’s why I endorsed that company and I did it with great pride.”
Then Ramsey issued a warning.
Saying that he was broadcasting from a paid-off building worth hundreds of millions of dollars and is “neck-deep in cash,” Ramsey seemed to promise to fight back against Diamond and other timeshare companies.
“You have done poked the wrong bear,” he said. “You done pissed off the wrong hillbilly.”
The “hillbilly” changes his tune.
I hate it when rich guys living large try to pretend they are just one of the boys. He had to hide behind his momma’s skirts and say, “They did it. Not my fault!”Planner at Heart presents this later non-mea culpa by Ramsey
“I have had no direct insight into Reed Hein’s operations, representations to its customers, or any other aspects of its business,” Ramsey said in court documents. “Again, others on my team are responsible for the details of the endorsement relationship, and I act based on their recommendations and advice.”
Pro advice: Never, ever work for a guy who claims he is a big authority and then blames the problem on his team, the little guys.
So here is my warning:
If he screwed this up, what else does he screw up? Some of his financial advice is fine. Some of it isn’t, in my opinion. Be smart and get a second point of view. Never buy a Timeshare unless you have plenty of money and want to do so. If so, seek a mental health opinion before signing.
#SwitchfromRamseytoClarkHoward
Finally, Clark Howard was the nicest financial advisor I had ever heard of. I loved the way he answered the call.” How can I serve you?” As far as I know, he is not an evangelical, but maybe I’m wrong. He works building homes with Habitat for Humanity and raising money to fight cancer in children. Here is a link to Wikipedia. I think I’ll start a new meme, “SwitchfromRamseyto Clark Howard.
PS Keep an eye out for the Title Lock thing.
Maybe Ramsey will someday find financial peace.
A classic tale of white collar crime.
MOD: You misspelled your email address. GBTC
I use Dave Ramsey’s “debt snowball” method to tackle vacuuming my house. Works like a charm.
I took his FPU class after having taken a couple of personal finance/investing classes at a local community college (taught by a certified financial planner). Ramsey’s get-out-of-debt advice and budgeting information struck me as useful for people in a specific set of circumstances, but (like many pastors) he also offered black-and-white advice that was completely out of his area of expertise and probably did his listeners a disservice, like on the topic of how to pay for college. I also think his investing advice is questionable.
Though I did appreciate, the times I used to listen to his show, how he’d sometimes tell an individual, “You don’t have a debt problem, you have a marriage [communication, misaligned goals, etc.] problem.” It often struck me as spot-on.
I’m reading a book about hillbillies right now, “Garden Sass: A Catalog of Arkansas Folkways.” It is absolutely delightful. Unlike Dave Ramsey’s on-air temper tantrums and treatment of Melissa Hogan.
Overreach in the overrated land of church in a freedom of religion society. Many manifestations.
Sarah (aka Wild Honey),
I agree with you about Ramsey’s advice: sometimes spot-on, sometimes way over his head. I took his FPU at church. I was in my 40’s then, and there was nothing useful to me that I didn’t already know. I laughed because I was very sick, between jobs, and already practicing some of what he preached.
A lot of that stuff was just “does not apply” stuff.
These past few years, I think Ramsey has really gone off the rails, though. Or maybe he’s just showing his true self.
Dee nailed it..
If you want to be Mr.Big Shot, tough guy, bully, then when the poopoo hits the fan, be a man and stand up…. Blaming your “minions” is not that…
Love of money will do that. Every time. Pick your best values. Then stick with your good pick. Ramsey obviously values money and power; vice completes the trifecta.
Jesus presents a completely different trifecta: Love God, and your neighbor as yourself. Those who love God don’t self-indulge. When there’s extra, they share with their neighbor. God promotes leveling, not accumulating. Including with wealth.
A friend put well over $100K into her new kitchen/dining/entertaining areas of her very average home. Then Covid happened, and she and her husband sat alone in their fancy showy newly done place. Post Covid she now says the friends she was trying to impress and entertain for 21 years are not really her friends – no need to impress them anymore. And she’s now depressed over the whole deal. There’s light at the end of the tunnel but she would have to change her values, and reach for loving God & neighbor as self rather than social climbing.
Every time we put money first, we shortchange God’s love. Jesus is our role model.
In Ramsey’s world, money is overrated. Good luck with money in Eternity.
Clark Howard is a gem of the Atlanta area. He’s Jewish Reformed – definitely not an evangelical! I’m glad to see people learn about him as a good alternative.
Several years old, but here’s a good article on him if you want to get a better handle on him.
https://www.atlantamagazine.com/great-reads/clark-howard-mayor-city-hall/
“How can he be so cheap and so happy? Sure, Howard earned his parsimonious image with tales of prying quarters out of the asphalt in front of oncoming traffic, buying seven-dollar secondhand shirts, naming his slightly irregular pugs QuikTrip and Costco, and planning to leave his body to science to eliminate the expense of a funeral (‘they pay for everything!’).” – from the article
…
“We know a lot of very wealthy people who are miserable, so money is not the wealth that really matters. You have to have a certain amount, at least enough to deal with the basics, but as long as you have that, what makes people happy or unhappy is what’s in their hearts. Not what’s in their wallets,” says Howard. “I think that surprises people about me.” – from the article
…
He [Clark Howard] had been a nationally syndicated radio host since 1989, teaching consumers ways to “save more, spend less, and avoid rip-offs.” – wikipedia
So, avoid Dave Ramsey. Rip-off; Ramsey charges for his Financial Peace stuff promoted in churches. Quite the scheme. Ramsey’s advice is to then tithe to the churches. The customers pay up front everyone promoting this scheme, from the jump, and the customer is the one suffering financially. Ramsey is obviously not cheap and not happy.
Every time this Financial Peace stuff has been offered at churches, we saved money by not enrolling. We could not afford to pay someone up front so we could supposedly save money. What a joke. Promoted at churches. Churches have more than one type of predator lurking in plain sight.
The man made a fortune off of common sense money management. It sometimes takes a hillbilly to tell us what we should have known already … things like don’t live beyond your means, save money for a rainy day, get out of debt, etc.
Moral of the story: don’t trust your money with a fake Evangelical from Tennessee … listen to the wisdom of a reformed Jew from Georgia.
I dare say that Southern Baptists have fallen victim to his snare more than any other religious group. Apparently, there’s not enough discernment in the denomination these days to keep the wolf out of the fold … false teachers, rogue “pastors”, pedophiles, New Calvinists, and assorted other whackos have walked in unhindered.
Exactly. And I believe I made a similar comment a while back when something about him was featured here on TWW. But I don’t undertand his followers. This quote from ‘Church Leaders’ struck me – “In my opinion, it was his bombastic, “I’ll get you,” finger waving and pointing that led his many followers to believe he would do something about this. I share his disdaind for timeshares but have great empathy for those who were talked into this “deal of a lifetime.” I would say that I also share his disdain for timeshares but when he insults his followers by saying “berating anyone “stupid” enough to buy into the real estate ventures, which allow consumers to buy several weeks’ annual residence in a home, usually in vacation spots” and they STILL want to follow his advice??? They won’t get my sympathy
Sarah (aka Wild Honey),
The interesting thing about Ramsey is that he is not saying anything new. Any financial planner with some training can say the same thing. Also, for some, waiting forever to buy a him can put them in a spiral of paying increasingly high rental rates. The other thing that bothers me is that he says to gross tithe 10% when in debt to creditors. So, God needs that money more than the creditors?
I as surprised that many outlets didn’t mention this. Character shows when the going gets tough and I think he will end this with a huge payout and an NDA like the weenie he is.
Since I don’t want them to get into trouble with Ramsey, it was my quote. I’m sorry if that wasn’t clear. I am dealing with a new pug with giardia, and there are messes everywhere!
dee,
yup… then will continue as business as usual… if one “studies” these types, this caught, wash, repeat, is quite common… we see it in politics all the time..
I took his classes as well. Not really anything I did not know. Even my teen kids in the class knew the stuff. But I was very surprised at how many others in the class did not know any of the “common sense” principles. So there is a place for this type of thing. Even if it is black and white. Those who don’t know this stuff need to start somewhere and he provides a very good, clear starting point.
I don’t agree with all of his stuff – but it works for man.
The debt snowball is an example – would be better to pay off the high interest cards first. But for those who are bad money managers, his method works.
Pay off you mortgage? I have a rate of 2.7%. Seems foolish to pay off when I could earn more investing. But again, poor money managers will not invest the difference. So good advice for many – not all.
No credit cards? Yet he takes CC for payment on his website.
Back in the day, Larry Burkett (crown financial, I think) started much of this – very similar advice to Ramsey. But without as much cost and very little hype. Ramsey is good at marketing. Burkett seemed to have much more of a heart for ministering to people with his advice.
When someone gets squeezed, the real stuff oozes out.
I remember when Ramsey got his start. I was pastoring my first church near Chapel Hill, NC and I kept getting mailings about buying and offering his video course “Financial Peace University” in my church.
His “pitch” was for me to buy his course and teach it, and as families in the church had more money, they would tithe and the church would get more money. I took it as a backhanded way of being self serving.
Max,
In my opinion, and experience, “evangelicals and fundamentails” are just as “ethically compromised”, or more so, than Joe “pagan”, or any other “religious” type..
In fact, anyone that is “sold out” on their “brand” of religion, or politics, is suspect to me..
As HUG might say, “idiological purity at all costs”..
That’s been my experience too.
I’d trust Peggy the pagan before I’d let fundagelical Fred anywhere near my money.
Beware of any religious group that talks more about their brand and its icons, than Jesus.
100%. “Accountability for thee and not for me” yet again.
dee,
Yes, Ramsey just has (had?) better packaging.
And God may not need the tithe more than creditors do, but apparently His church does. (Or at least thinks it does.)
This doesn’t surprise me AT ALL.
I’ve been a member of two churches that taught FPU. One of them, in my opinion, did it out of a genuine desire to help people; they also had seminars on grief, emotional intelligence, hosted AA and NA meetings, etc.
The other church did NOTHING outside of theology or Bible study. Except FPU. And yes, that would be the church that nearly became financially insolvent, ironically: https://www.whyhavewefasted.org/the-apple-doesnt-fall-far-from-the-acts-29-tree/
I think that is why many pastors have opted to bring Ramsey alongside … focusing on boosting the tithe to get more money in the offering plate, not so much achieving financial freedom for church members … a symbiotic relationship between Ramsey and the pastor that increases revenue flow in two directions.
I believe God would rather one’s kids be fed and have a safe place to sleep.
So is tithing in the Body of Christ “Biblical”? The tithe was required for the Jews under Mosaic law … Christians are not under the Mosaic covenant. Tithes were given to the Levitical priesthood … there are no Levites and priests in the new covenant. There’s a lot in the New Testament about giving to those in need, but not much written about giving to the church. Christians are commanded to support those who preach the Gospel … but are not commanded to “tithe” 10%. We are to give generously and freely as God leads without pressure to tithe. To some people that might mean giving much more than 10% of their income. We talk about no longer being under the law, but there are still remnants of the law in the institutional church … tithing is purely a tradition, but you won’t hear preachers preaching that sermon!
“Most of all, everyone should take care of their own family. If they don’t, they have left the faith. They are worse than someone who doesn’t believe.” (1 Timothy 5:8)
Yes, indeed, any boss who blames the staff, the people HE hired, when the buck (pun intended) stops with him, is not much of a man, let alone a leader.
I have followed Mary Hunt for almost 30 years and hubby and I, except for our mortgage, have remained debt free. Ramsey is nothing new. But what a reputation he could have if he sacrificed it all and made good on these followers hard earned money. If he showed how to trust God, and do good with your money, to be a man of your word, (Matthew 5:37) instead of just talking about it.
HA! Funny!
No mistaking what they’re full of.
Jelly donuts, adolescent acne, or a tube of toothpaste?
Ava Aaronson,
and me
Yeah, or he could just blame someone else … as Flip Wilson used to say “The devil made me do it!”
This was the implication from his literature . . .
All from people struggling with finances. Sadistic grift. In the name of God.
Dee–off topic at hand, but noticed the comment about the pug with beaver fever. Having had it ourselves, will be praying you can tend the messes without contracting the disease!
When you put it that way, it’s a pretty sick venture indeed. Just teach them the principles without charging for it, for God’s sake! Merchandising the Gospel doesn’t sit well with me.
Detailed and thoughtful discussion of this case:
https://untangledfaithpodcast.com/2023/06/07/83-dave-ramseys-legal-nightmare-time-share-exit-team-class-action-lawsuit-deep-dive-with-melissa-hogan/
The host of the podcast, Amy Fritz, is the spouse of a former Ramsey employee. She has episodes in prior seasons discussing various issues with the company’s culture and actions. It’s eye opening.
“Pro advice: Never, ever work for a guy who claims he is a big authority and then blames the problem on his team, the little guys.”
Any guy in Church or politics . . . .
Well, does it sit well with Jesus? The question. If it doesn’t, then it has nothing to do with God and everything to do with the other guy. Big oops for Gospel merchandisers. Guessing that Jesus has neither pimps nor whores. That would be the other guy’s game.
“Pimp: A person who controls and financially benefits from the commercial [spiritual] exploitation of another person.”
So, commercial exploitation in their practice of religion – without the sex. Although in the news, it seems that some leaders go there, too.
CMT,
Thanks for the link. Listening now.
Love the share factor at TWW – and it’s FREE! No charge for all of these great links and insights. Today, we’ve already looked at Mary Hunt and Clark Howard. Great websites!!! At no charge. God love you all. We ordered two things we needed that were featured on Clark Howard’s website.
In the podcast, they are discussing how the “We will get you out of your Timeshare contract” Business is taking advantage of vulnerable people – as they don’t deliver. They are not able to, in fact, get them out of their Timeshare contracts. So vulnerable people paid for services not rendered.
Taking advantage of vulnerable people seems to be a thing among some Christian ministries.
IMHO, using churches to sell a program to supposedly help people in dire financial situations is just off. It’s sales to people who need to not spend. Add to that the tithe teaching included, so now the financially needy people owe their church 10%. All wrong.
Fortunately, we can never afford any of these programs. We simply cannot pay to be Christians. We can serve, somewhat. But we cannot pay. Moreover, Jesus neither asks for nor needs our money.
There is a time and a place, however. In 1 Kings 17, the widow shared her last meal with the prophet Elijah, and she was then blessed with provisions for life. It was not a tithe, but she knew when and to whom to give. Godly woman.
“Jesus went into the temple and drove out all who bought and sold in the sacred place, and He turned over the tables of the money changers … He said to them, The Scripture says, My house shall be called a house of prayer; but you have made it a den of robbers.” (Matthew 21 AMPC)
In terms of advice, Ramsey’s advice for a couple to get out of debt is pretty good advice though a one size fits all approach. I think it is best geared towards a young couple or person that is in debt.
Not so sure his telling people to always buy a used car vs. a modest new car is always the best way to go.
Sadly, his retirement advice leaves a lot to be desired. As I remember he claimed you could withdraw 10% from your savings in retirement where most financial advisers would say more like 4%. Ramsey claims the stock market’s rate of return averages 12% but if you look at what is called the compound annual growth rate it is lower.
I am sadly familiar with so many stories about how he runs his organization in how a number of people call a cult like manner. Also, how he chose to fire one low ranking employee for getting pregnant while not being married but had no problem excusing Chris Hogan’s multiple affairs apparently due to Hogan being a money maker for Dave Ramsey.
Sad his continued endorsement of this company after he apparently knew that they weren’t delivering on promises.
Speaking of $$$,
https://religionnews.com/2023/06/08/southwestern-baptist-seminary-ran-up-140-million-in-deficit-spending-since-2002-patterson-greenway-expresso/
“According to an overview of the seminary’s finances released Wednesday (June 7), Southwestern ran an average deficit of $6.67 million per year from 2002 to 2022. During that time, the number of full-time Southern Baptist students at the school dropped by two-thirds (67%) while expenses went up by a third (35%).”
“Much of the overspending occurred during the tenure of Paige Patterson, who was president of Southwestern from 2003 to 2018, when he was fired for allegedly mishandling sexual abuse. The report, however, does not detail any of the spending patterns during Patterson’s tenure. Instead, the report included a few select details about former President Adam Greenway, who resigned in 2022”.
“According to the report, more than $1.5 million was spent on the on-campus presidential home…an espresso machine costing more than $11,000, about $60,000 for Christmas decorations and more than $25,000 for artwork…These expenditures were made at a time when the seminary was making significant budget cuts, including the reduction of faculty personnel and positions”
“The seminary did not release the entire task force report and has no plans to do so, according to board chair Danny Roberts.”
Ava Aaronson,
Why, you’re welcome. I can’t recall now if it was you or another commenter who shared a link to Laura Robinson’s excellent Substack the other day. So yes I agree the sharing of ideas and conversations around here is great.
Fake expertise.
Even the name is fake. University? Not. What a joke, except all of the scamming in churches is not funny.
Walk into a church and witness the off-the-rails outright lying – a scam to make money off of people struggling financially and call it a “university”.
First on the agenda of those struggling to support their families should be DO NOT PAY FOR CHURCH, OR ANYTHING ASSOCIATED WITH CHURCH. (We also use guidelines in our family like: do not pay for entertainment but frequent the parks, the zoo on the free days, and use the library. Our taxes pay for these so do not pay twice. Malcolm Gladwell said his summers consisted of his best friend, his library card, and his bicycle. Happy childhood.)
“But the hour comes, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father seeks such to be his worshipers.” John 4.23 World English Bible, Public Domain
Moreover, our body is the temple of the Holy Spirit. We don’t support a brick and mortar temple with Levitical workers. Jesus ripped that up, ending that era, when he died and rose.
Rich people can pay for church stuff. They can afford it. So no judgment and have at it. Maybe they don’t even care about worshipping in spirit and truth but would rather have what money can buy anyway.
The rank and file of the Body of Christ can follow Jesus without the accoutrements that money can buy, bypassing the scams, the moneychanger tables in the temple. Spirit and truth surpasses money. The anawim are those who know God best, such as Mary and Joseph. They were anawim.
Saw this. Note the expenditures off the backs of rank and file donors, participants, and seekers. Evil. Using wage-earners as a gravy train for the elite. Nothing to do with Jesus here. This is in the realm of the other guy.
It wasn’t me. However, I found Laura Robinson’s Substack and it is excellent. So, thanks, again.
Ava–spot on!
Ava Aaronson,
Oh, thanks! I agree with the sharing. And I just read some of Laura Robinson and loved it. I am also currently reading Rachel Held Evans “Searching for Sunday” and have been identifying so much with her point of view.
Thanks for this blog, Dee
That big abscess deep inside my left middle finger that got lanced & drained yesterday afternoon.
The ManaGAWD sure does.
Must keep up with the Copelands. “TITHE! TITHE! TITHE!”
P.S. That’s Dave Ramsey, CHRISTIAN(TM)>
“And you’ll only drink milk
If it comes from a CHRISTIAN cow…”
— Steve Taylor, “Guilty by Association”
There’s gold in them thar SBC hills! Thank you to all the faithful Southern Baptists across America, who drop your hard-earned bucks into the offering plate to make this happen!
Bottom-line for many of the who’s-who in the Christian Industrial Complex.
“Cheap grace means grace sold on the market like cheapjacks’ wares.” (Dietrich Bonhoeffer)
I’m a country girl. I was thinking more along the lines of the sweet aromas emitted by 3-day old roadkill …….. animals in the rodent family.
Or, maybe when a child hugs a new puppy a little too tight at the wrong moment…… cuz they’re really full of it.
linda,
Thinking of you when I wrote those comments. It’s reassuring to see the Holy Spirit work in the Body of Christ, in agreement.
If being in the lower economic strata, worshipping God in spirit and truth, was good enough for Mary and Joseph to bring Jesus into this world, then it’s good enough for us, too. One would think.
The Dominionists don’t see it that way, however.
“Christian Dominionists believe that God desires Christians to rise to power through civil systems so that His Word might then govern the nation.”
It’s not that Christians can’t have things, or can’t have notoriety, or can’t have position. It’s a question of: at what cost?
“But seek first God’s Kingdom and his righteousness; and all these things will be given to you as well.” Matthew 6.33. (Details: In due time? Or, what “things” – what is actually needed, not what is unnecessarily desired?)
“God gives people money to see how you’re going to handle it,” she said. And she intended to prove she knew how to handle it. Leigh Anne Touhy, “The Blind Side”.
Scam.
It would be as brutal a dictatorship as any the world has seen.
That.
And thank you for providing the comment, Ava Aaronson, that gives me the opportunity to add something that is off topic to Dee’s post….
I’m add the link to what I feel is a very informative website with a ton of information.
The website is Culture Reformed: Building Resilience & Resistance to Hypersexualized Media & Porn….and the link is:
https://www.culturereframed.org/
From their website:
Ron Blue is another Christian financial planner from back in the day who gave excellent advice, wrote several books. At one time I had 3 of his books.
Muff Potter,
Jesus himself was/is not a Christian Dominionist. He couldn’t even control the Jewish religious leaders of his day.
“How to Win Friends and Influence People”, Stephen Covey’s stuff about highly effective people, as well as the John C. Maxwell stuff, were not available to Jesus. Bill Bright was not around either.
And since Rick Warren is in the news, what about “The Purpose Driven Life” … I see a lot of those books at yard sales now. He must have made a bundle off of that.
They see themselves at the top, where their Righteousness, Piety, and Faithfuness entitels them.
Holding the Whip.
“GAWD HATH SAID! GAWD HATH SAID! GAWD HATH SAID!”
“LORD LORD, Did We Not Do Mighty Things in Thy Holy Name?
LORD LORD, Did We Not Cleanse the Land of Heathens like Thou Commanded in Joahua?
LORD LORD, Did We Not Fill Mass Graves with Heretics and Apostates?
LORD LORD, Did We Not Make Everyone Praise and Adore and Worship Thee Without Ceasing?
LORD LORD, Was Not Thy SCRIPTURE on Everyone’s Lips?”
Headless Unicorn Guy,
“And what about the blood that cries out to Me from those mass graves?
Your frenzy to be the only one to sit at My right and left hand?
The Praise and Adoration given only because your guns were against their heads?
The blind hatred of Me in your laity that wasn’t there before?
The destroyed lives, the destroyed dreams?
The widows and orphans?
All done in MY Name?
All done because YOU claimed I Told You To?”