Welcome to Our Gathering of EChurch@Wartburg
Enhanced Rainbow by Barb Ver Sluis
Here is our order of worship
Jeff Reid recently spoke at Emmanuel for Wade Burleson, and we are honored to feature his inspirational message.
Jeff and his wife, Bethany, live in South Africa where they are raising their three boys — Elijah (12), Carter (5) and Riah (1). Their mission in life is all about seeing communities transformed and Jesus being glorified. Together they lead Community Transformations based out of South Africa. There they lead a community of people and work to see the township of Masiphumelele transformed. They work in the drug slums of South Africa, taking the gospel of Jesus Christ to the men and women of that country. Jeff was converted in a San Diego prison and part of his story will be shared in today's message of encouragement.
Join us in The Lord's Prayer
Our Father, which art in heaven,
Hallowed be thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come.
Thy will be done in earth,
As it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
As we forgive them that trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
But deliver us from evil.
For thine is the kingdom,
The power, and the glory,
For ever and ever.
Amen.
The next two songs feature the African Children's Choir, and we dedicate them to the Reid family for their faithfulness in reaching out to the continent of Africa with the love of Jesus Christ.
A New Hallelujah with Michael W. Smith was performed in Houston in 2008.
Light of the World was performed in Vancouver, British Columbia in 2009.
A prayer of the Ashanti People of Africa Link
Ashanti Prayer for Blessing
O Lord, O God,
creator Of Our land, our earth, the trees,
the animals and humans, all is for your honor
The drums beat it out, and people sing about it,
and they dance with noisy joy that you are the Lord.
You also have pulled the other continents out of the sea.
What a wonderful world you have made out of the wet mud,
and what beautiful men and women!
We thank you for the beauty of this earth.
The grace of your creation is like a cool day between rainy seasons.
We drink in your creation with our eyes.
We listen to the birds' jubilee with our ears.
How strong and good and sure your earth smells, and everything that grows there.
The sky above us is like a warm, soft Kente cloth, because you are behind it,
else it would be cold and rough and uncomfortable.
We drink in your creation and cannot get enough of it.
But in doing this we forget the evil we have done.
Lord, we call you, we beg you:
tear us away from our sins and our death.
This wonderful world fades away.
And one day our eyes snap shut, and all is over and dead that is not from you.
We are still slaves of the demons and the fetishes of this earth.
When we are not saved by you.
Bless us.
Bless our land and people.
Bless our forests with mahogany, wawa, and cacao.
Bless our fields with cassava and peanuts.
Bless the waters that flow through our land.
Fill them with fish and drive great schools of fish to our seacoast,
so that the fishermen in their unsteady boats do not need to go out too far.
Be with us youth in our countries, and in all Africa, and in the whole world.
Prepare us for the service that we should render.
In the name of Jesus
Amen
If you are new to EChurch, please click on this link for an explanation
"Look upon us, O Lord,
and let all the darkness of our souls vanish
before the beams of your brightness.
Fill us with holy love,
and open to us the treasures of your wisdom.
All our desire is known to you,
therefore perfect what you have begin,
and what your Spirit has awakened us to ask in prayer.
We seek your face,
turn your face unto us and show us your glory.
Then shall our longings be satisfied,
and our peace shall be perfect.
Augustine, 354-430"
The Complete Book of Christian Prayer, p.4
May the Lord bless you and keep you.
May the Lord make his face to shine upon you,
and be gracious to you.
May the Lord lift up his countenance upon you,
and give you peace.
Thank you for spending your precious time worshipping the Lord.
Hello dee, deb, everyone.
I’m writing this here because I don’t really have anyone in the flesh that I can talk to. I don’t attend a regular church, don’t have any close Christian friends around here and hell, it’s hard to talk to my (believing) parents without them a) not understanding or b) getting annoyed at what I say. So TWW and E-church seems like the perfect place I can ask for help.
I’m having some trouble with my relationship with God. Not in a ‘losing the faith’ kind of way but a ‘view of God is deeply distorted and I don’t know what to do’ kind of way. As a result I’m frightened to get really close to His heart. So I’m asking people here to give me as many Bible verses as you can that altogether give the full picture of God. Including what he wants for me and from me, how he’d interact with me, His character and what a proper relationship (not a neutral, half-functioning one like mine) with Him is like.
The following fears are based on very twisted lies, I know, but they’ve managed to creep into my heart nonetheless:
1) Getting close to God and letting Him work in me will lead to a loss of my autonomy and loss of my self. God will control and manipulate my heart and invade/violate me with thoughts, feelings, desires etc. that aren’t a part of me. I might even be brainwashed in a way. Imagine a voodoo doll on puppet strings.
2) Getting close to God and partnering Him will lead to a severe loss of control/freedom over my life, where I HAVE to do the things he says because He Is God, whether I like it or not. For He Is Always Watching And Judging, and failure to comply will lead to negative consequences or a withdrawing of His love. OR I’ll be compelled/brainwashed into obeying.
3) Submitting to God and following His plan for me will lead to painful events in my future, because y’know, God disciplines his children and wants to refine us etc. But the point is that life under God will be difficult and little else. Oh yeah, and the nasty shocks will come totally out of the blue. He’s not really gonna do me much good. He’ll probably just use me for his plan, stringing me along, regardless of my thoughts and feelings.
4) God Can’t Love Me Unconditionally. I don’t understand how. Isn’t love usually based on something, even if it’s your personality, but if you screw up you put a big and perhaps permanent dent in the relationship?
5) If I let God heal me I owe him something (he doesn’t work for free) and He’ll use that to his advantage.
Out of all of these the biggest block I have is number 1. I don’t want any part of myself to be changed against my will, defiled, taken away, controlled or used in any way through his Spirit. I know I need work on the inside, including spiritual deliverance, but if I let God in to the full how do I know he won’t control me or do me harm, even if it’s in the name of love? In a way I’m rejecting the Holy Spirit because everything it has to bring seems foreign, even unnatural. I want myself for myself and I’m afraid to trust God and what he’ll do if I really hand over all of my heart to him. Will he respect my me-ness, or ‘ruin’ me? Will he let me be myself as He created, or insist/force me to change everything?
I’m sure that to anyone with a proper knowledge of God the above sounds insane. But it is the pit of my soul pouring out up there. I don’t know the truth and I want to, which is why I’m asking for verses.
Thanks,
Anne.
Anne,
Thank you so much for sharing your heart with us. I’m going to give your comment some serious thought, and I’ll be back in touch with some Bible verses.
God loves you! Have a wonderful Saturday! 🙂
Anne –
Thanks for sharing your heart. It IS hard to conceive God in relationship with us “outside” of what our own experiences have been with others; us toward them and them toward us. I do know that perfect love casts out all fear (1 Jn. 4:18). My Christian walk has been a process; a continual unfolding of God to me as I read scripture and ask the help of the HS. Very much like an earthly friendship. The relationship grows as I trust in God’s love for me. His love cannot be seen perfectly anywhere except in Jesus who said when you see me you have seen My Father. Peace to you!
Anne,
I look forward to reading Dee’s comment in response to yours. I respect Dee a great deal, and I know she will be both wise and encouraging in her response. I saw your comment and was moved by your honesty and transparency. I do not wish to ‘fix’ you. Frankly, I’m not so sure you are not in a pretty good place right now, precisely where God intends for you to be at this moment in your life. I thought I might offer some brief thoughts in response to your statements or fear.
(1). You write: “Getting close to God and letting Him work in me will lead to a loss of my autonomy and loss of my self. God will control and manipulate my heart and invade/violate me with thoughts, feelings, desires etc. that aren’t a part of me. I might even be brainwashed in a way. Imagine a voodoo doll on puppet strings.”
If what you write were true, I would renounce Christianity too! Voodoo dolls on puppet strings are foreign to biblical Christianity. Fatalism and other philosophies may support such thinking, but a relationship with God is a love relationship based on goodness and grace.
(2). You write: “Getting close to God and partnering Him will lead to a severe loss of control/freedom over my life, where I HAVE to do the things he says because He Is God, whether I like it or not. For He Is Always Watching And Judging, and failure to comply will lead to negative consequences or a withdrawing of His love. OR I’ll be compelled/brainwashed into obeying.”
It sounds as if you have been taught that a relationship with God is more like Master/Slave rather than Parent/Child or Husband/Wife. All I know is I am completely free from feeling I HAVE to do anything for God, am excited every day to discover His incredible and unconditional goodness and love toward me, and I have zero fear that He is always watching me to judge me–and I am a bible-believing Christian. I agree with Bridget2 that too often our view of God’s relationship with us is shaped by our relationships with other people. His relationship with us is altogether different.
(3). You write: “Submitting to God and following His plan for me will lead to painful events in my future, because y’know, God disciplines his children and wants to refine us etc. But the point is that life under God will be difficult and little else. Oh yeah, and the nasty shocks will come totally out of the blue. He’s not really gonna do me much good. He’ll probably just use me for his plan, stringing me along, regardless of my thoughts and feelings.”
The Bible teaches just the opposite. God does immeasurably more than you could ever ask or think in terms of His goodness toward you. His plan for you is only best, and whether you ever ‘submit’ to it or not makes no difference–He is always and only good to you. He is faithful, even when we are not.
(4). You write: “God Can’t Love Me Unconditionally. I don’t understand how. Isn’t love usually based on something, even if it’s your personality, but if you screw up you put a big and perhaps permanent dent in the relationship?”
Listen to the prayer Paul prayed for the Philippian Christians. It is the same prayer I am praying for you: “And I pray that you Anne, might be rooted and established in God’s love. I pray that you may have power, together with all the Lord’s people, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep the love of Christ is for you. I pray that you, Anne, may come to experientially know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God” (Ephesians 3:17-19).
(5). You write: “If I let God heal me I owe him something (he doesn’t work for free) and He’ll use that to his advantage.”
Anne, it is refreshing to visit with someone who is honest about their feelings and perceptions of God. All I can say in response to this last statement of fear is the following:
HE DOES WORK FOR FREE…
Because He needs nothing.
Because He has everything.
Because He is loving toward those with nothing.
Because He brings those with nothing to Himself.
Blessings, Anne. I do hope EChurch will be helpful to you. I hope you can go back and listen to a few of the messages from Hebrews 10. They might help you in your journey.
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Thank you Wade, for dropping by and giving your very helpful words. I realise I seem to have fallen for a view of God as some sort of manipulating, careless sociopath even though my head says that it’s the LAST thing He is. And of course, there are absolutely no Bible verses to back up any of the above.
I’m not in a place where I would renounce Christianity, simply because of the tear between head and heart. My mind believes that God works all things together for my good, provides for me and won’t let me go under in life etc. but wounds in my spirit say otherwise. I choose to believe what my mind says, but of course its beliefs haven’t struck where they need to which is why I’ve been asking for scripture and praying for God to reveal himself to me. I’m pretty sure a relationship with Him is worth it, when everything’s in check and according to truth. 🙂
Thank you everyone for helping me tackle the soul-spill. As horribly distorted as it is, I needed to get it out.
Anne
I have been thinking about your questions for the last few hours. I am so glad Wade answered you.He was right in everything he said. So let me put a different spin on it. Years ago, I was asked to teach a video series by Ray vander Laan. It took us through the Bible, teaching us customs and history. One day it hit me. The Bible is a story of God and His people over the millennia. Sometimes, when we focus on specific verses, we can forget the big picture. Yet, the Bible is a story that is constantly pointing forward and also pointing back.
When I find myself getting bogged down in a disagreement over what a particular verse means, I sometimes find I need to take a step back and look at the big picture. Max Lucado published a book called The Story. It takes a broad view of the story of the entire Bible. This might help you as you think through some of the difficult, yet very reasonable and understandable questions that you have.
As I thought about you, a few things came to mind. I am a mother although my children are grown. When one of my daughters was three, she had a malignant brain tumor. It was a horrible time in my life. I wanted to take that pain from her and I would gladly have changed places with her. I had a hard time sleeping at night, I was so consumed with worry for her well being. She survived and is now a nurse. But, that experience taught me a lot about God. He is our Father, He created us out of love and He wants to share His love with us. He is consumed with us. He loves us even more than I love my children although it is hard to imagine how much love that is.
And He sacrificed Himself because he wanted to save us. Just like I wanted to save my daughter and take her place, He wanted to save us and take our place. And He did on Calvary, ensuring that He and we would be in an eternal, loving relationship.
Thinking of my children, yes I disciplined them growing up but they seem to recall the good times. The discipline was not so bad. And the love and fun was so much more. They remember the Disney trip and have a hard time remembering when they couldn’t go to the movies because they didn’t do their homework. As I look at my life, I see far more of God teaching me and walking with me, even in hard times.He has a wonderful sense of humor. We had been through several hard years with my daughter’s illness and some other trials. I remember one day stomping my foot on the kitchen floor and telling God that i wanted a “cruise” year, just an easy year when things weren’t so gosh darn hard. That night my husband came home and told me he had gotten bonus and asked me if i thought it might be fun to take the kids on a Disney cruise. I laughed so hard I was crying. And we did take the cruise and i thought of God the entire time.And it was an easier year.
You said “Getting close to God and partnering Him will lead to a severe loss of control/freedom over my life, where I HAVE to do the things he says because He Is God, whether I like it or not. For He Is Always Watching And Judging, and failure to comply will lead to negative consequences or a withdrawing of His love. OR I’ll be compelled/brainwashed into obeying.” When I was in my 20s, I met with my pastor and asked him what things I should do with my life to please God. Should I be a missionary, etc.? He asked me “What do you like to do?” I said that this wasn’t about me, it was about what God wanted. He smiled and said that God had created me to be exactly who I am, with passions and talent and likes and dislikes.Those things are programmed into me so that i would follow my heart into the things that God had laid out for me. He told me that i should like what I was doing because God made me to like those things. In fact, the more I follow my desires and talents, the more I see God in what I do.So, it is a win/win. I’m happy when I do what I am programmed and talented to do and God is happy as well.
God wants me to be the person He created me to be. When i do those things I am happy and fulfilled. When I try to the other things, I am frustrated. Do you watch American Idol? I always laugh at the people who try out who have terrible voices because I do not have a good singing voice. I would love to get up on stage and sing like Adele. but, I can’t. No amount of training will make me be able to sing like Adele. I am always surprised at the people who sing terribly and yet insist that they are “great”singers. They become angry at the judges when they tell then that they can’t sing and they vow to pursue their career in spite of being told they shouldn’t. It also makes me sad for them because they are pushing to be something that they are not and they are missing out on another gift that I know they have been given. The consequences for not following through on the cool things that we have been created to do is frustration and a sense on missing out on something.God doesn’t have to punish us. We do a good job at punishing ourselves.
God loves you and He has created you to be precisely who you are. That means He wants you do do the things that you are good at and the things that you enjoy. And He is quite proud of you when you do. He is a loving Father who delights in you.
I hope this helps you. Please ask me more questions, and I will do my best to answer you. I really, really appreciate that you would share your thoughts with us. Thank you. Know that I am praying for you.
Anne, I absolutely love the way you articulated your thoughts and fears on giving all to God. I used to feel the same way. I didn’t have it all figured out yet on the day that I decided to trust God completely without reserve. It felt like I was jumping off a cliff. It was 20 years ago and I was actually quite scared that all what you just said would be true. I thought for sure that God would make me be a missionary to Africa and my biggest fear about that was my fear of their spiders. I know that fear started in grade school when we would have missionaries speak at our school chapel meetings. The missionaries all looked so unhappy they always told us that God would call some of us to do what they were doing. I know that can sound corny to some people but that was my fear. Somehow I had the strength to tell God that whatever this surrendering all was going to cost me I surrender all. I mean literally almost I felt like I was jumping off a cliff and trusting God to catch me. I was alone in my living room. All I can say is that instead of God controlling me and changing my personality or sending me where I did not want to go, I found just the opposite to be true. I have discovered that that kind of control is from Satan. I have discovered that the verses ‘he whom the Son sets free is free indeed’ and ‘where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom’ and ‘if you abide in Me you will know the truth and the truth will set you free ‘ and ‘the life I now live I live in Christ’ hear that? Paul said that he himself still lives. The Bible never suggests that we lose our separate personalities. Your relationship with God doesn’t have to look like anyone else’s. Do I have a specific verse? No, but when I study the Bible people who knew Jesus, not a one seems like the other. I believe that what you fear is not God, but what people have led you to believe about God.
I have never been one to just say a bunch of positive Christian stuff. I don’t really have the gift of encouragement. So I just speak honestly. And honestly, I can never read the verses like what Wade just quoted to you from Philippians and Ephesians without a welling up of wonderful emotion, not because they are such beautiful prayers but because ever since I ‘jumped off that cliff’ into trusting God I continually discover deeper and wider the depths of God’s love for me …it’s simply too hard to explain but it happens. And you will have your own stories of how God proves His love for you. That is His love for YOU, not you as in just because you are his creation, a human being but YOU, I bet that whatever you like about yourself God likes it too. But of course these are all just words until you find out for yourself.
Patti
Beautiful answer.
Anne,
Stand fast therefore in the liberty with which Christ has made us free, and do not again be held with the yoke of bondage. Gal 5:1
Dee and Deb,
Thank you once again for this wonderful service! Jeff Reid’s sermon was wonderful and much appreciated!
HowDee YaAll,
All to Jesus I surrender. I surrender all?
Do you remember that famous hymn of the faith that describes the exact starting point for becoming a true disciple of Christ: total surrender of self?
What?
God desires a heart willing to unconditionally surrender everything to Him…
It is not about ‘pastors’
It is not about ‘preachers’.
It is not about ‘church’.
It is certainly not about the bad things they do…
…All to Jesus I surrender.’ I surrender all.’
When the currency & the economy fail, and it is a guess-they probably will, it is a good bet that pastors, preachers, and other church folk will be sucking the same buttermilk too!
You will most likely be the last thing on most church folks’ mind.
humm…
If you stay close to the Almighty, you will trust him and discern his will for you, when most folks’ faith was just fair weather, and destined to fail.Â
Huh?
ah, but not you…
All to Jesus I surrender. I surrender all.’
Jesus keeps all that are his in the hollow of his loving hands.
Be secure. Be safe. Be provided for. And have stuff left over for others…
‘All to Jesus I surrender
All to Him I freely give;
I will ever love and trust Him,
In his presence daily live.
I surrender all, to you Jesus I surrender all, all;
All to thee, my blessed Savior,
I surrender all.’
King David said, “I was young, now I am old, but I have never seen the righteous beg bread.”
Neither will you.
(grin)
Not to worry…stay close, and trust him. He is pretty neat!
I’ze knowz cuz he’s been pretty swell ta me, ya hear?
hahahahahahaha
Sopy ;~)
___
All To Jesus I Surrender ~ ‘I Â Surrender All’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiJKGQ_3hyQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player
DON MOEN – ‘I Surrender All’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4p3pjAjALI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Anne,
HowDee!
This here tune is for you:
Paul Baloche ‘The Same Love’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAK3t6uG58Q&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Love, Cuz He does!
Cheers!
Sopy ;~)
I like the Ashanti prayer. It’s an African version of Schiller’s “Ode to Joy”. I’m struck by the fact that they have not lost their elemental connection to earth, sky, sea, and the Almighty as the bringer of all that is good.
Out here in the Golden Cibola of Southern Calif. that connection was severed long ago. The rich have gotten richer and are in need of nothing. Except maybe the latest toy from Apple or another shopping spree at Nordstrom’s.
Anne – I think Dee’s answer to you says much of what I would want to communicate (though there’s no way to send a *real* hug over the internet :)).
I have been caught in the same trap – this fear of an invasive, basically martinet-like God – and now, after a few years of intense turmoil, believe that *that “god” is actually a not-god – even though this not-god is preached like crazy in many, many churches.
Why “not-god”? Because there is *no* grace, mercy, compassion – no LOVE – in that not-god. None.
otoh, Jesus came because he could do nothing other than come here for us – the Second Person of the Trinity actually living with us, as us, with all the pain and limitations and inconveniences and [fill in the blank] that we live with. To heal the suffering, he became The Sufferer. He understands that we are all “bruised reeds” and he says that he will heal us. (See Isaiah ch 42 1-17; and Matthew ch 12 1-21 – in the Matthew passage, the writer says that Christ came “to fulfill” what Isaiah wrote about bruised reeds and smoldering wicks – that he will *never* break the former or quench the latter. EVER.)
The God is loves you is the one, true, REAL God. The not-god is (imo) some of the worst aspects of the human ego projected out there and made into a sort of “God” that, sadly, all too many people worship.
I believe that the real God is there, even if you can’t see or feel him right now. I went through a long period of time that was (in some ways) like walking through a dark railroad tunnel… I knew there was going to be light at the end, but it really *did* take a while for me to get to the point where I started to be able to see the glimmers, and then, eventually, the actual sky and its light. (Daylight and also moonlight and starlight as well.)
One of the most important things that I’ve been learning over the past decade is that simply being is a good thing and one that God wants for all of us. (Articulated in a slightly different way above, by Dee.) I had been crushed by feeling like I had to do all the time, that the not-god who had been preached to me demanded achievement – the kind of “achievement” that could never actually happen, because, being human, it was/is impossible for me.
I believe God isn’t kidding about his mercy and compassion and grace (as written about in John ch. 1, for instance). It’s real. Equally, the kind of thing you’re afraid of – and that I have been afraid of myself – is the exact opposite of what God says about himself, as it entails violation and exploitation. (More Hitler or Stalin-like than Christ-like.)
I think I need to end this for now; it’s turned into a letter instead of a post!
I like the Ashanti prayer. It’s an African version of Schiller’s “Ode to Joy”. I’m struck by the fact that they have not lost their elemental connection to earth, sky, sea, and the Almighty as the bringer of all that is good.
Out here in the Golden Cibola of Southern Calif. that connection was severed long ago. The rich have gotten richer and are in need of nothing. Except maybe the latest toy from Apple or another shopping spree at Nordstrom’s.
Agreed on the connection to the earth – and God’s creation in a wider sense. I think this might be because the Ashanti are farmers – not sure where you are in CA, but I’m sure that a trip to the Central Valley would bring about a shift, however slight, in that perspective. (I don’t mean to idealize farmers, but there *is* something about being “out there,” away from cities and around lots of growing things, that makes me feel a tad closer to what I think of as “the real world”…)
Thank you all for your very helpful words. I’ve been reflecting on them today. Dee, I now just about believe you when you say that God doesn’t want me to be anything other than what I am/what I was made to be. The whole thing about being ‘more like Christ’ is more to do with sanctification/purification than a change of personality, right? It’s simply being ourselves, but with less and less sin as we move from glory to glory.
I have some final questions, and then I’ll leave it and get to grips with the Word for myself. These too are genuinely heart-felt.
1) God’s intentions for us are absolutely 100% loving, beneficial, and for our best interests? Never to harm, neglect, use, control, or anything that would harm us? Cause I have trouble believing that His will for me is purely perfect. Does his loving, giving attitude ever change depending on circumstances, or does he always continue to want/give the best for us no matter what?
2) During the hard times, when we’re refined or matured, does he stop caring about our feelings? Does he throw storms at us for the sake of growth without being at all troubled about how it might affect us, but is nonchalant about it instead? Does he carelessly send us through storms just because he feels like it, because we’ve been less than perfect, or because he hasn’t bothered to stop them? Even if the painful times are for our best interests, does He hurt with us when we hurt? Does He care if we suffer?
Thank you all, again, for your support. For the record, I saw a video of Nick Vujicic titled “Knowing God” and in it he described the relationship as “It’s not a To Do thing, it’s a love thing.”
Anne, This does not answer your specific questions but I can remember what a eureka moment it was for me to really understand that since day one of creation Yahweh is a “relational” God. He created the earth then “walked in the Garden”, he was a cloud that went before the Isrealites leading them out of slavery. The examples are endless but the ultimate is HE became a person who was God in the flesh. Then He will come back, make a new earth and dwell with us again. Talk about relationship! He wants relationship with us. period.
Well, I went to the Summit Church today in North Raleigh…and loved it. Bet you knew I’d say that. 🙂
Loved the worship time, and the sermon on the Holy Spirit was very good. The church was simple and not showy at all. JD Greear is a gifted communicator. People were friendly.
I’d never want to live in Raleigh-Durham though…just too busy for me! I am a definitely a rural girl.
Shato
This has to be one of the least sensitive comments that I have seen on this blog and I have been doing this for 3 years. Why you would put this under EChurch which was started for those who have had bad experiences with churches is beyond me. No wonder the numbers of people fleeing churches continues to climb. I expect your next comment to be about your wonderful sin discovering slumber party with the Mahaney girls. Good night!
Shato,
I know quite a bit about The Summit because both of my daughters attend. My younger daughter alternates between the North Raleigh location and the one at Brier Creek. She was likely in the same worship service as you today because she prefers that campus. She was home for a few hours this evening, and we talked briefly about her church experience this morning. I told her I am concerned about J.D. Greear rubbing elbows with Mahaney at the upcoming T4G.
Anne,
First, I understand – these are the exact things I wrestle with myself. One of the things that is getting deeper and deeper in me is that God is NOT mad at us. Period. He’s really not. I have had (and still do to a degree) had difficulty trusting God – believing that he was loving. Well, part of the problem for me was that I had no clear definition on what love really looked like. I have found it hard to always believe that what He considers my best interests will actually be even tolerable. A few years ago, a friend told me that God understands why we have trust issues and He is not angered by them. She told me I should tell Him that I needed Him to prove to me that I could trust Him. Scary. But, I was in a very bad situation where I had no income and was down to having about 2 weeks left to find a place to live and a job to pay for it. And His response to my challenge was very simple. He said, “Okay,” and then walked me through from that place into a job and a new apartment and has been holding my hand ever since (4 years ago). Sometimes, I feel like I need to repeat over and over: He is not mad at me. And he is not mad at you. Hmm… it is very late and I am having a hard time focusing. 🙂
I will come back tomorrow and see how you’re doing. I think, for me, the heart of the issue of trusting God’s love for me is understanding what love really is – it was not well-modeled to me by family.
Lord,
Here I am again, finding my strength in drawing near to you. Â In the clammer of the day, unseen by others, you have witnessed the desperate cry in me –I wait on you God, …I open my ears…I’ll know that you are the voice of truth, so in quietness, I rest, in awe, …I worship you.
Please be with me. You are my comfort. You are my Teddy Bear in the dark of the night. You shield me from the great wickedness outside my window. You refresh my soul!
I will run to you and be safe!
I understand the significance of the cross now, your great sacrifice outside the gates, and what it means, God, you are the Saviour of my soul, and because of this, I worship you  alone.  Greater love has made a way to you for even me, so how could I forget the moment I, in faith confessed, ‘for my sins you died and rose again’, the day that you brought me in safely to your house.
There I do lay down in safety.Â
I believe the words you say, Father God with all my heart, they are life to my soul-they make me sing for joy! Â Open my eyes more so I can see your glory, your glory Lord!Â
Please deliver me from my fears…
and…
Oh! and bring me closer, closer to you!
Your forever friend,
Sopy ;~)
___
Inspiration: Hillsong – “♫ Open My Eyes ♫”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkvCWeqKVEQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Dee,
I didn’t realize this was only about e-church. Usually most posts are open for comment.
Deb,
I will talk to you about my experience with The Summit in the next thread. I liked it pretty well.
Shato