Woman crying in church. cotonbro@pexels
“Religious sexual harassment and abuse has become an epidemic. Sadly, it’s not something new. It’s existed since the fall of Adam and Eve. Religion is not exempt. A sacred place meant to be safe and holy has become the breeding ground for violence and evil.” ―
This is a quick overview of the alleged despicable abuse by Paul Pressler. I will write a more comprehensive post in the future, but I felt this needed to get out ASAP. This will suffice for the Monday post as well.
When I first started blogging, I was asked by an alleged victim of Paul Pressler to write his story. He did not want to come forward with his name. I had read that Pressler allegedly sued folks who wrote about his behavior. I knew he was a powerful lawyer and beloved by the SBC leaders. I decided not to post his story since he would not allow me to use his name. I have long regretted that decision. I believed him, but I was afraid. I do believe that it was likely I would have been sued.
Finally, the tables turned, and in 2017, Pressler was being sued by victims of his alleged behavior. I believe that he was a prodigious abuser. I also believe that many in the SBC leadership knew it was true but covered it up. Many of them must confess their intransigence.
The SBC had to make a payout for “covering up” Paul Pressler’s activities.
I don’t usually post on a Sunday, but Robert Downen’s article in the Texas Tribune is so essential that I wanted to get it posted: Southern Baptist Convention settles high-profile lawsuit that accused former leader of sexual abuse. It is subtitled: The suit prompted a major newspaper investigation into Southern Baptist sexual abuse and seven other men to come forward with allegations against Paul Pressler, an influential conservative activist and former Texas judge.
Here is the overview.
In 2017, Duane Rollins filed the lawsuit accusing Paul Pressler, a longtime Southern Baptist figure and former Texas judge, of decades of rape beginning when Rollins was a 14-year-old member of Pressler’s church youth group in Houston.
Rollins claimed in court documents that the alleged attacks pushed him into drug and alcohol addictions that kept him in prison throughout much of his adult life. After disclosing the alleged rapes to a prison psychiatrist, Rollins filed the suit in Harris County against Pressler along with other defendants who he accused of enabling or concealing Pressler’s behavior — including the Southern Baptist Convention and Jared Woodfill, the former chair of the Harris County GOP and Pressler’s longtime law partner.
Who was Pressler?
Pressler, 93, is one of the most influential evangelical figures of the last half-century, and is considered the co-architect of the SBC’s “conservative resurgence” that began in the late 1970s and prompted the faith group to adopt literal interpretations of the Bible, align more closely with the Republican Party, ban women from preaching and strongly condemn homosexuality
He was best buddies with Paige Patterson. I believe it is safe to say that he was among the most well-known men in the SBC. However, it is alleged (and I believe it to be true) that he was a prodigious molester of teen males and young men. Pressler is now 93 years old and continues to deny everything. This was a civil trial, not a criminal trial, and ably conducted for the victims by Michael Goldberg and other attorneys of Baker Botts.
Why in the world did the SBC settle? Don’t they claim that all churches are autonomous? Does this mean they “knew” Pressler was doing this?
In a statement, legal representatives for the Southern Baptist Convention and its executive committee confirmed that they had “entered into a confidential settlement agreement” despite being “fully prepared” to proceed to a trial that was scheduled for February after being postponed twice this year.
“However, several factors ultimately made settlement the more prudent choice,” they wrote. “Chief among those factors was the horrendous nature of the abuse allegations, the likelihood that counsel for the SBC and Executive Committee would have to confront and cross-examine abuse survivors, the Executive Committee’s current financial condition, and the willingness of multiple insurance carriers to contribute to the terms of the settlement.”
I would say there is a chance that the SBC may be subjected to more lawsuits in the future. It sure stands to reason that the SBC and the executive committee knew something. Keep an eye on this one. It looks like the old “autonomous” argument doesn’t always work. It appears their financial situation is dicey.
What did Jared Woodfill, his law partner know? What did Pressler do?
This is a disturbing situation.
Woodfill similarly downplayed sexual misconduct allegations in 2016, after a 25-year-old lawyer at his firm alerted Woodfill that Pressler had told him “lewd stories about being naked on beaches with young men” and then invited him to skinny-dip at his ranch, court records show. The attorney said he addressed the incident with a longtime employee of Woodfill’s law firm, who made it clear that this was not the first time he’d heard such allegations.
“I discovered that this was not unusual behavior for Pressler, and that he had a long history of lecherous behavior towards young men. Even going as far as bringing scantily clad men and parading them through the office,” the attorney wrote in an affidavit that was filed as part of Rollins’ lawsuit.
…The young attorney’s claims are similar in detail to those from other Pressler accusers, who said he leaned on his stature and connections in conservative religious and political circles to try and coerce them into lewd massages, naked swimming sessions or sex.
,,,Court filings also show that Pressler’s family was alerted about his behavior in 2017, when an aide claimed in a letter that he had “both heard stories of and personally witnessed” Pressler getting nude massages from “young men who work for him.” He also claimed that Pressler had recently bragged about skinny-dipping with three boys who were younger than 10, and that he had seen Pressler “manipulate” a 20-year-old into giving him a massage and then repeatedly kiss him.
“He talks way more about nudity, the male body, being naked in spas in Europe, being naked in general than God, or his Baptist background,” the aide wrote before announcing his resignation.
Downen also wrote Houston GOP activist knew for years of child sex abuse claims against Southern Baptist leader law partner.
…In recent sworn testimony, Woodfill said he’d known since 2004 of an allegation that Pressler had sexually abused a child. Woodfill learned of those claims, he said, during mediation of an assault lawsuit filed against Pressler that he helped quietly settle for nearly a half-million dollars at the time. Despite his knowledge of the accusation, Woodfill continued to work with Pressler for nearly a decade — leaning on Pressler’s name and reputation to bolster their firm, Woodfill & Pressler LLP.
Rather than pay him a salary, Woodfill testified, the firm provided Pressler a string of employees to serve as personal assistants, most of them young men who typically worked out of his River Oaks mansion. Two have accused Pressler of sexual assault or misconduct.
What did First Baptist Houston and a ‘Presbyterian’ know?
In 2004, court records show that a small group of leaders at the massive First Baptist Church of Houston were made aware of allegations that Pressler, a powerful deacon at the megachurch, had undressed and groped a young man at his home. In a letter to Pressler that was unearthed as part of Rollins’ lawsuit, the church leaders condemned Pressler’s “morally and spiritually” inappropriate behavior. They also feared that publicizing the allegations would damage Pressler’s reputation in their church and the Southern Baptist Convention.
…Pressler, meanwhile, was a youth pastor at a Presbyterian church in Houston. He was ousted from that position in 1978 after church officials received information about “an alleged incident,” according to a letter introduced into the court file.
Final thoughts
- His law partner and SBC all denied knowing anything. I think that they did.
- Pressler appears to have held carte blanche when it came to acquiring young men to feed his disturbing habit, which he denies that he has. I think he has spent most of his life covering up his proclivities.
- Pressler appears to have harmed many young men.
- At the same time, he treated some young men well, so there appeared to have been plausible deniability.
- Did anyone care about the long-term harm to his victims?
- I wonder how many leaders in the SBC knew about this and covered it up? I suspect that many of today’s SBC leaders knew about Pressler and did nothing.
- Thanks got out to Michael Goldberg for his work on behalf of the victims.
On a completely unrelated note, a very happy New Year to Wartburgers everywhere.
Nick Bulbeck,
And to you, Nick!
“He was best buddies with Paige Patterson. I believe it is safe to say that he was among the most well-known men in the SBC.”
Pressler and Patterson were (are) referred to as co-architects of SBC’s Conservative Resurgence in the 1970s-1990s.
Nick Bulbeck,
Happy New Year, Nick! Please keep coming around in 2024.
“I wonder how many leaders in the SBC knew about this and covered it up? I suspect that many of today’s SBC leaders knew about Pressler and did nothing.”
What a sick group of criminals running a religious organization. Reporting is mandatory, which makes these leaders’ complicity criminal.
“I wonder how many leaders in the SBC knew about this and covered it up? I suspect that many of today’s SBC leaders knew about Pressler and did nothing.”
Pressler was kingpin of SBC’s conservative movement to send denominational liberals and moderates packing … he was critical for that mission … he was too big to fail. His bad-boy behaviour was overlooked, covered up, swept under the carpet.
The truth caught up with Pressler.
_______
FYI
The Methodist Church of Great Britain Labels Terms ‘Husband’ and ‘Wife’ Offensive. The death march continues for the progressive Methodist Church.
Ava Aaronson,
Yup…
Max,
I know for a fact that Paige Patterson knew about it in 1988 because he called a friend of mine and tried to intimidate him into keeping quiet about it. Pressler’s homosexuality was discussed openly by Moderates during the 1980s. The problem was that no news outlet would break the story because no one wanted to go public against him. He was that powerful. I’m so glad to see this coming out now at the end of his miserable life. I hope he dies penniless.
Pressler accomplished the destruction of the free Baptist press system leaving the denomination with a membership of uninformed congregations. Without strong state papers lay people are ignorant of
Facts and events that formerly helped them make wise decisions. it was part of his plan.
Rather than liberal vs conservative, how about moral vs immoral? Criminal vs civil? Love vs hate? Ethical vs unethical? Sicko vs healthy? Safe vs destructive?
Some people “got it” and left the SBC. Jimmy Carter, for example. Some would label him “liberal” but he took a hard line re: human rights, women, and church ethics. Is that “conservative” or “liberal”? It’s moral.
“Gareld Rollins Jr. claims he was regularly raped by the conservative leader. Rollins met Pressler in high school and was part of a Bible study Pressler led. Rollins claims he was raped two to three times a month while at Pressler’s home.”-wikipedia
With this type of Sodom and Gomorrah leadership and culture in churches, who needs a church? It’s worse than the local sleaze bar of consenting adults doing their hetero, bi, pan, and paramour activities. The SBC leadership is all about VIOLATING MINORS, CHILDREN. Sexual predation.
Evil of the worst kind.
“The SBC leadership is all about VIOLATING MINORS, CHILDREN. Sexual predation.”
_____________
No it’s not Ava. Are there troubled, sinful men in leadership? All of them actually when compared to the Holiness of God. Are they all about sexual sin? That’s crazy talk. They aren’t.
“ the likelihood that counsel for the SBC and Executive Committee would have to confront and cross-examine abuse survivors”
Am I reading too much into this, or is this the SBC’s attorneys acknowledging that the complainants are indeed abuse survivors? Implying that they agree Pressler is a serial sexual predator.
Bingo! SBC executives often forgot their mission.
In the absence of a free Baptist press, I fault 45,000+ SBC pastors for not keeping their congregations informed about the good, the bad, and the ugly SBC issues. Church leaders know, but remain silent. For example, the New Calvinist movement is sweeping through SBC ranks, displacing the traditional non-Calvinist belief and practice of millions of SBC members. The pew ain’t got a clue that their tithes and offerings are financing this rebellion. Their pastor knows and is not having family meetings with the congregation to warn and inform, as a good shepherd should. Yep, their pastor knows a lot he is not telling them, with the widespread abuse of women and children being at the top of the list. Praise God for watchblogs like TWW that are standing in the gap … a printed version should be inserted in SBC church bulletins at 45,000+ churches every Sunday!
What a kind thing to say! #HugEmoji
I shall endeavour to do so, especially as I’m likely to be semi-retired in the next couple of months!
I recommend fly fishing.
These are some of the folks who helped start the idea that LGBT folk were necessarily equivalent to child predators. I guess if you make church members scared enough of people on the outside they stop paying attention to what happens on the inside.
Max,
I’m going to write my second and third books, hopefully.
Anthony,
If what is said of him is true (and I think there is much that is said which is true) then he is an evil man and one of those wolves Scripture warns us about. Is he a believer? If he did some of those things of which he is accused, I have my doubts.
Max,
It’s not just non-Calvinist belief which has been displaced. Non-complementarian beliefs and churches are being eliminated by the BF&M and by actions of leaders like Al Mohler. Can God answer more than I ask or imagine by moving some notable influencers in the SBC to change their minds (i.e., repent) in 2024?
William,
Thank you for that comment. I have heard a number of stories similar to what you have stated. The SBC is filled with cowards who would not say a word.
“I LOVE the Poorly Educated!”
WHATABOUTism, right on schedule.
The two are related. Calvinism begets complementarity. Mohler has largely accomplished his mission to Calvinize the SBC via the New Calvinist movement.
AKA The Male ALWAYS Holds the Whip.
And an Alpha Male like Pressler can Hold the Whip over any Inferior Male and (just like in a prison shower) can make a woman out of them. With God’s Blessing. PENETRATE! COLONIZE! CONQUER! PLANT!
Be careful not to get sidetracked onto whether “Is he a believer or not?” Because while we start infighting about that (“DIE, HERETIC!”), Pressler slips out the back door (with his boy-toy boys) laughing.
Lesson Learned:
GOD H8S FAGS unless they’re Anointed MenaGAWD.
Rank Hath Its Privileges – “TOUCH NOT MINE ANOINTED!”
Same-sex Ehebephile.
Same-sex version of Voddie Baucham’s “As a man gets old, his eyes turn towards younger women.”
AKA “I keep getting older; they stay the same age.”
“I keep getting older; they stay the same age.”
Oh, they were paying him a salary.
Off the books, in continuously Fresh Meat.
“I keep getting older; they stay the same age.”
A better word than “proclivities” would be “APPETITE” or “APPETITES”.
AND Sin-Levelling.
As for the MenaGAWD enthroned atop the SBC enforcing Biblical Manhood, I leave you with a song lyric from 1974 AM radio, when for some reason Watergate was a popular subject:
“Is Nixon Guilty?
Well he has been seen
With Ehrlicman, Haldeman, Mitchell, and Dean —
Dean, Dean, Dean, Dean,
Haldeman, Mitchell, and Dean!”
Why would they? They ARE the system. They kissed the Don’s ring and pledged their allegiance to their godfather. For their paycheck, their livelihood, of course… for home and family.
This is the same system and godfather loyalty of Jesus’ day. Jesus says flat out to whom the religious leaders have sworn their loyalty:
“You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he tells a lie, he speaks from his own nature, because he is a liar and the father of lies. But because I say the truth, you do not believe Me. Which one of you convicts Me of sin? If I speak truth, why do you not believe Me? The one who is of God hears the words of God; for this reason you do not hear them, because you are not of God.”
-from John 8.
They have sold out their very souls. This system’s evil violation of children, minors, youth, and women, has been going on for a long time. The org has even kept a file on it to protect themselves, their org, and to silence the violated.
Like Dee says in the post, she didn’t post the truth about certain individuals earlier due to the threat of lawsuits. She wasn’t part of the system but she saw the threat looming.
Everything about the violation of children, minors, youth, and women comes from one place and serves one entity or spiritual Being, just as Jesus said. This has NOTHING to do with God even though it is in the church. A mouse in the cookie jar is NOT a cookie.
Whether or not, fact is, without a complete 180 with restitution*, he dies soul less. Or soul going to the other place. Not enviable.
*Matt. 3.8 & Luke 3.8.
dee,
Cowards, and individuals unwilling to follow the basic tenants that Christ advocated…. I do not disagree that all humans are fallen, and all leadership is “compromised”; however we are EXPLICiITY called to stand up for the downtrodden/weak/children, etc… The SBC has failed on some of the most basic commands of Christ..
dee,
Definitely a wolf that scripture specifically calls out… and, from what we keep reading, no leadership in all of SBC for the last 40 plus years was willing to call out???
I would be HORRIFIED if people said that young boys were sent to my mansion….. for “questionable” activited…
What Jesus says to religious leaders who circle the wagons to support their org & provide cover for predators, from John 8:
“You are of your father, the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and doesn’t stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks on his own; for he is a liar, and the father of lies. But because I tell the truth, you don’t believe me. Which of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? He who is of God hears the words of God. For this cause you don’t hear, because you are not of God.”
So, a bit beyond “troubled”.
Sure, everyone sins, Rom. 3.23, but not all have sold out to the father of lies and evil – Jesus called out religious leaders serving their father the Prince of this World, who is NOT our Heavenly Father.
Then they executed Jesus, the Son of God. The religious leaders did this.
Then Jesus rose from death. Meanwhile, they all went to the other place. The religious leaders. Of Jesus’s day.
Do we have such religious leaders serving the Prince of this World today? Beyond “troubled”? Out and out sold out to evil? Apparently so.
The Weinsteins and Epsteins and Cosbys and Lauers with supporters leading our churches. Prominent, powerful, pompous, profitable, posing & posturing as Jesus’s servants, who serve none other than the devil himself. Doesn’t get worse than that.
Well, if they are in the category of religious leaders gone awry in Jesus’s day, they are far beyond “forgot their mission.”
They’ve completely crossed over to the Dark Side, while in leadership for the church.
It’s as if Winston Churchill covertly joined the Third Reich’s inner circle of leaders then delivered his country to the Third Reich’s Empire.
Jude verse 4 mentions men who have crept into the church and made grace into indecency.
That’s intentional, not forgetting.
In John 8, they are church leaders whose father is the devil.
Judas delivered Jesus to His execution.
These wolves in church garb with church titles deliver children, minors, youth, and women, right into a pit of evil where the church leader wolves violate them.
It’s only by the grace of God, that the innocent flee the evil to hopefully maintain and preserve their innocence. They are innocent. But what they have experienced is a snake pit of being violated while under the care of a church man serving the devil.
“forsook” would have been a better word for me to use: “SBC executives ‘forsook’ their mission.
… and for their SBC retirement annuity.
The gross corruption of the leaders of the SBC must be taken as a given. As an arminian–an anti-calvinist–I can only assume that our Lord has damned these people to a special place in Hell–a place to those offered salvation but who chose instead to defend a fundamentally corrupt theology that placed logic (and conservative Republican politics) over the simple message of the Good News: see you in Hell, Paul!
This whole mess is a classic example of thinking that the end (conservative resurgence) justifies the means (Paul, others like him, and covering for them).
The reality is that, of course, the means defined the end (an organization bereft of morals).
Smooth move SBC.
“Everybody’s got his price or a guy like me couldn’t exist.” — Howard Hughes(?)
And like Reichsminister Speer, they “arranged their minds” to see nothing wrong with the System that personally benefited them.
And for the Godly men at the top?
“He shall rule above the Law,
Calling on The LORD…”
— Rudyard Kipling, “The Old Issue”, 1899
And his little playgroup, Dodeka.
Indeed, that, too.
Sums it up.
Godly men my a$$.
An organization known for forcing their morality down everyone else’s throats.
Guess that only applies to the Powerless, not the Anointed Powerful.
“And Tommy ain’t a bloody fool —
You bet that Tommy sees!”
— Rudyard Kipling
Paul Pressler – Just like Jimmy Saville, Except CHRISTIAN(TM)?
These godly men certainly worship their god. Jesus clearly names their god:
“You are of your father, the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and doesn’t stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks on his own; for he is a liar, and the father of lies. But because I tell the truth, you don’t believe me. Which of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? He who is of God hears the words of God. For this cause you don’t hear, because you are not of God.” -from John 8
Religious leaders embedded with and leading the people of God, who are actually serving the Enemy is not an anomaly. Jesus addressed this in His day.
Due to how our churches are set up, some of these religious leader wolves are on the dole, supported by church member donations.
Others have paying jobs but their work in the church is their gateway to their hunting ground.
Headless Unicorn Guy,
They serve the same god, have the same godfather, as Jesus points out.
Oh dear God, the obsession with terminology among some Christians is so very annoying. Seneca, how about dealing with the child sexual abuse scandals in the churches first?
From what I understand, none of the men Pressler hit on (and who have come forward) wanted to be hit on. Pressler was a *power* in Houston when I was in law school. He was on the 14th Appellate Circuit bench as well as being a Baptist bigwig. And for those of you who have forgotten, during that period (1980s) Southern Baptists and other Christians absolutely covered themselves in glory (*sarcasm*) by going after people with AIDS and suggesting some fairly terrible “solutions” to same. So for me, there’s heavy, heavy irony that Pressler was apparently hitting on men during that period.
I don’t forget.
Muslin fka Dee Holmes,
Ted Haggard.
More like intentional hypocrisy in my book. All to the purpose of Pressler keeping power securred wherever necessary. So disturbing.
Muslin fka Dee Holmes,
I agree
StarF’ers.
Screw your way to the top.
“I’m the Sultan’s Favorite!”
Is there a word for the male equivalent of P*ssy Politics?
Or is this one of those things that has no name, even among the Goyim?
As annoying as Pronouns among the Goyim.
“Just like Pronoun Enforcement, Except CHRISTIAN(TM)!”
Solutions such as those worked out by Heydrich (and his sidekick Eichmann) at Gross-Wansee?
Remember the Pink Triangle was right up there with the Mogem David.
“Nowhere do we corrupt so effectively as at the foot of the Enemy’s altar!”
— Screwtape
A good way to describe the dilemma in most organized church structures. Compromise enters the door where pride, power, and prestige resides. All can be found in the ivory towers of SBC.
profit, patriarchy, predation, perversion …
Know them by their fruits:
“Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these.” – Galatians 5.
Whom do they serve?
“You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. …” John 8.44, Jesus addressing the religious leaders.
from the Texas Tribune article:
“Pressler … was a youth pastor at a Presbyterian church in Houston. He was ousted from that position in 1978 after church officials received information about “an alleged incident,” according to a letter introduced into the court file. Soon after, Pressler ramped up his involvement in Southern Baptist life.”
Chilling. From one denomination to another, looking for prey.
“Your adversary the Devil is prowling around like a roaring lion, looking for anyone he can devour” (1 Peter 5:8)
At age 93 it soon wont matter anymore. He will face the True Judge soon who knows everything.
His cover?
Spouse: Nancy Avery Pressler (m. 1959)
Children: 3
Residences: Houston, TX; Hidden Hills Rch in Wa. Cty, TX
Alma mater: Princeton; UofTX Law; Nat Col of St Trial Judges
Occupation: Lawyer; ret. judge; Leader of SBC Cons resurgence
It’s the 4-point predator cover. Like BTK: 1. Married 2. with children 3. Civil servant 4. Church leader.
During WW2, the Soviets recruited high level powerful sophisticated MI5 Brit agents to work for them, the Dark Side, as double agents. From Cambridge University, there were the Cambridge Five, who from the inside (top government positions) gave up deep intel over to the Enemy.
How much more, Satan works from top positions on down, inside the church. In Jesus’ day, from Judas to Caiaphas to the Barabbas-loving mob, they all executed Jesus.
Nothing new today.
The question about anyone in churches: Whom do they serve? Who is their godfather? Whose ring have they kissed? Whom will they betray with a kiss?
When donating, what kingdom is being supported?
True, for him personally.
However, there’s the question of the org where he wielded power, and used as his hunting ground.
Guessing that those who survived the monster would like something done about the org that supplied and propped up the monster.
Note: even as they age, predators persist.
A former US President groped a young lady from behind while in his wheelchair, during a photo op. Creepy old monster right to the grave.
From Tim Meshginpoosh @oldreepicheep on Twitter thread about SBC and Pressler:
“At my last church, where I was on the security team for over 10 years, I remember telling the pastor: ‘you know what keeps me up at night? It ain’t the active shooter. If one of those guys tried to bring an AR-15 in and shoot the place up, we’d take him out before he got in the building. It’s not the shooter… it’s the grooming, schmoozing predator who’s going to sneak in and win everyone over. He’s going to do the real damage.’
“I was right. But the predator didn’t strike that church.
“He hit the whole damn convention.”
He nails it, describing the embedded wolf in sheep’s or shepherd’s costume. The real danger. Doing serious damage. From within. A corrupt org. Grand old org. Deadly as a plague of Medieval times. Through and through.
It seems the real definition of “Conservative” is: All in with the silencing of women and children. Surely it has nothing to do with integrity, especially moral integrity.
Time to note what Jesus said about knowing someone by their fruits…
Remember Paige Patterson’s stained-glass windows depicting leaders of SBC’s Conservative Resurgence in the hall of fame at the SWBTS chapel? Pressler’s image was depicted there, along with Frank Page (who failed morally) and Johnny Hunt (who failed morally). SWBTS was right to do away with the hall of shame when Patterson left campus.
Should have left it up but changed the captions to be these monsters’ rap sheets. Instead of shoving it all under the church rug to make it go away and disappear.
People need to see what they actually put in power and $upport in their churches. Monsters and demons.
Is there anything more vile than church leaders violating children, youth, and women in the name of “god”? While they silence the same children, youth, and women via their “Conservative Resurgence”?
That’s what predators do: duct tape the mouths of those they violate. No difference here except one group of monsters uses actual tape while the other uses theology. Which is worse? Using god talk with church policy to hold someone down and silent, or using tape?
Tape can be removed in one motion. The god talk theology of silencing victims may last forever as it grips the church where predators run free.
sinful men in leadership? All of them actually when compared to the Holiness of God. Are they all about sexual sin?
senecagriggs,
We are all sinful when compared to the Holiness of God, including you and me.
So, tell me: How many children, women, boys. and young men have you abused sexually?
How many sexual predators have you lied for to protect them and keep them in positions power… or to keep yourself in a position of power.
How many victims have you verbally attacked?
How many innocent lambs have you sacrificed on a pagan altar for your own “Godly” glory?
…… This is what the SBC leaders do, and their acts are very intentional.
Max,
In my eyes, Patterson is a heretic….. evil. How did he not know what Pressler was doing?
I suspect he knew a lot more. And, he was committed to brow beating victims in order to protect abusers.
Patterson and Pressler….. what a duo. No small wonder that there is a #ThisistheSBC.
“Break her down” Patterson knew.
Break her down and shut her up. Those are predatory tools.
There’s just no integrity, no transparency, and no basic human decency in this bunch. There’s nothing but evil with this bunch of powerful predatory church leaders.
Abigail,
Abigail,
93 or not, if he dies tomorrow the fact that some wrongdoing was acknowledged and some compensation was given will matter to the victims. So many have been coerced into silence because of the unwillingness of the SBC to deal with the issue. And, the cost of the settlement might force the SBC to be more careful in the future. The only thing that ever got the attention of the Catholic Church was the large payouts they have had to make to victims. You need large sums of cash to run a religious empire.
Given the track history of SBC leaders at the top of the pyramid, every Southern Baptist should question the integrity, transparency, and decency of their kingpins. They would do better to turn the pyramid upside down and vote for loving, humble, decent small church pastors to lead them in the future … there are thousands to pick from who have never bowed a knee to Baal. I know several in my area … not all Southern Baptist pastors are bad-boys.
Really? Have they ever showed up to support the victims of their org leaders? Boz says they never do.
Rallied with, for example, Christa Brown? Called out the predator who violated her?
Used social media to expose the Presslers, et al?
They are all in with the Conservative Resurgence that silences women, youth, and children? Theological duct tape?
Used their pulpit platform to address church predation, among their bro-guy favs?
It seems that’s how Dee left the SBC – no one listened, children were violated.
These “good-guy” SBC pastors are still in the system?
Robert Downen is a good guy – he puts the truth right out there front and center, no cover up, never looking away. Far more integrity than clergy.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
This is really the core “issue”… IMHO…
Ava Aaronson,
Point well-taken. As Scripture says “There is none good, no not one” (Romans 3:10-12). Yep, the thousands of SBC pastors who have remained silent about abuse in the denomination are just as bad as those who commit such sins (if I could sin-level a bit). They should have been hammering on their pulpits for accountability and change. I’ll look at the ‘nice’ guys in pulpits in my area in a different light. You can’t preach the Good News without addressing the bad news, too. As I said in an earlier post, I fault 45,000+ SBC pastors for not having congregational meetings to inform members of the good, the bad, and the ugly within SBC. A good shepherd protects the flock.
Max,
Well stated. Exactly.
Nice guys on their supposedly pious public platforms being silent about these horrific destructive terrors in their org used as a hunting ground, are NOT nice. Moreover the duct tape theology that silences women, youth, and children is evil. Also not nice.
Make noise? Make waves? Rock the boat? Good grief, yes!
From the outside (not God’s perspective), it sure appears that you may not be wrong.
These two Pervs said one to another:
PREV UNTO PERV O’ER THE WORLD IS BROTHER,,,
Marconi plays the mamba…
Listen to the radio…
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
(from other post on Biblical Counseling)
“myalgic encephalomyelitis/chronic fatigue syndrome”
++++++++++++
i’m very happy for you that you’re feeling better!
my 22 year-old son has fatigue issues. gets tired/sleepy throughout the day, needs to take naps.
it frustrates him greatly. he’s so ready to get on with his life and build his career (he’s preparing to graduate from college in the spring)
he eats super healthy, gets good exercise, sleeps well at night…
his thyroid was recently checked (normal range)
he’s waiting for results on ADHD/ADD evaluation (which has a fatigue element)
if this, too, proves not a culprit, do you have advice for how best to get this sorted out? primary care doctor? specialist? i’m thinking a specialist of some kind would be a more direct route…
Thank you, Nancy. Or anyone else here who has some advice.
Max,
The whole thing (“stained glass”, etc) would be a real laugh if it was not so utterly depraved what these clowns did…. ( note, I use the word clowns to get past censors, and keep my posts less offensive)…
If this is not wolves disguised as angels of light, what is? Pure evil … in the name of God but truly the Enemy’s enterprise.
God save the children.
And all of the other church leaders who stand by watching in silence, as Polite Society does … they are equally tools of the Enemy.
Corrupt org, top down, through and through.
In Calvinism, “More Utterly Depraved Than Thou” is bragging rights among the Predestined Elect.
And since the Predestined Elect have a Get Out Of Hell Free card issued by God before the foundation of the world, why not indulge their Pelvic Appetites? What can God to to them? They’re His Predestined Elect! His Special Pets!
Here’s the stained glass windows at my parish:
To the left the Seven Secraments:
1) Anointing of the Sick: St James the Greater
2) Penamce (Confession): St John Vianney (the Cure of Ars)
3) Holy Orders: St John Bosco
4) Holy Eucharist (Communion): St Pius X
5) Confirmation: St Paul (whose epistles the Calvinists quote chapter-and-verse)
6) Baptism: St Francis Xavier
7) Matrimony (Marriage): St Elizabeth of Hungary
To the right the Seven Cardinal Virtues:
1) Counsel: St Catherine of Sienns
2) Fortitude (Courage): St Joseph
3) Understanding: St Augustine of Hippo
4) Piety (Faith): St Charles Borromeo
5) Knowledge: St Thomas Aquinas
6) Fear of the Lord: Moses
7) Wisdom: St Mary, Mother of Jesus
How does that lineup compare to the one in SWBTS?
Headless Unicorn Guy,
You certainly have a better line-up of stained-glass who’s who at your church than the characters which formerly ‘graced’ the walls at the SWBTS chapel. The images of mere men like that should never be adored and revered … it was a bad idea, even before some of them fell from grace.
Between utterly depraved on one hand and totally depraved on the other, I don’t hold out much hope for the SBC.
Protestantism has no provenance.
Might get checked out for narcolepsy. Sounds like a good friend I had who struggled. Turned out to be that.
elastigirl,
If he has ME/CFS, there isn’t much that can be done. The diagnoses is done through the process of elimination. The best thing your son can do is pace himself….. Pushing too hard takes a big toll — makes exhaustion and pain worsen and takes a longer time to recover….. may cause set backs. The naps are a good thing. Honestly, I hope your son’s problem is ADHD/ADD…. there are medications that will help that. I would think that having undiagnosed, untreated ADHD/ADD combined with the stress he is under right now could cause issues similar to ME/CFS.
At my worst, I felt like I was walking in thigh deep concrete…every step was forced. My legs ached constantly.
Seeing a specialist is a good idea. A primary care doctor can send out a referral/referrals.
Has he had his white blood cell count and iron level tested? A high white blood cell count and/or low iron can cause fatigue, or can worsen the symptoms of ME/CFS. They could also be red flags for other things.
Tell him I wish him the best, and I hope doctors can solve the problems
elastigirl,
“Eat super healthy.” So many of us believed it till we came across Sally K Norton. Now she wrote a book “toxic healthy food”. Oxalate is everywhere except in meat. And it makes havrock in our health! Worth taking a look. Life changing
Max,
Max, anytime someone wishes to to glorify you – run like Hell. God knows you don’t deserve it. Paige at least should have put an immediate stop to it.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
It really doesn’t sound like ADHD unluckily. [read my biography – smile]
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
Thank you, Nancy. Truly appreciate your thoughts on this.
Frances,
never heard of her or this thing called oxalate. But i’ll look into it. Thank you very much!
I want to see those stained-glass windows. They sound wonderful.
elastigirl,
My son has narcolepsy. It started when he was 20, right after he had mono. It is a frustrating disease. He had to quit accounting and now works part-time in a grocery store while he tries new treatments.
The right thing to do is to have him tested by a sleep specialist, usually found in neurology practices.
Our 6 year old grandson recently went through a sleep study, where it was found that he had sleep apnea attributed to swollen tonsils and adenoids. Both were surgically removed over the Christmas break – he is now sleeping soundly and more attentive at school. Praise God!
dee,
thank you. this morning I found out his primary care dr. is referring him out to someone to rule out sleep apnea.
Thank goodness he made he a caregiver – young adults can’t possibly know how to navigate all these things.
Max,
super encouraging!
Tangentially, in 2007/8Pressler invited me to his house for dinner and conversation. I was more politically involved back then and was working with some national figures and that’s how we are introduced. All this was by phone, we never met in person. I never made it to Texas so the invitation was moot, but I shudder to think of being invited into a predators lair at all.
“Delivered from the snare of the fowler” (Psalm 91:3)
https://www.stbonifaceonline.org/_files/ugd/e82dc8_b511a9611acf435182e580b93db3f040.pdf
Headless Unicorn Guy,
Thx. These are wonderful. The Saints in glass have aged well.
Ava Aaronson,
In shockingly anodyne language, conflict of interests? Or even, portfolio career?
Headless Unicorn Guy,
These are so inspiringly designed and made, obvious from PDF.
Elizabeth and Louis were Wartburgers! Robert the not so honorable was of Geneva!
Joseph is my fab confirmation name given me at the last minute by a friendly nun when she discovered I otherwise wouldn’t have one.
Much better than Paige Patterrson, Mark Driscoll, Douggie ESQUIRE, or End Times Prophecy Du Jour.
“NOWHERE DO WE CORRUPT SO EFFECTIVELY AS AT THE VERY FOOT OF THE ENEMY’S ALTAR!”
— Screwtape
Ava Aaronson,
One wonders was Pressler himself a victim of abuse when very young and did this evil imprint itself on him in a way that he could not cope with? In short, was he also one of the ranks of the ‘wounded’ that lash out and attempt to inflict their own pain on others in doing so.
What are we that God is mindful of us?
Why? A question that cannot be answered in our own earthly time-frame.
No ‘excuses’,
only ‘reasons’ . . . . there is a SADNESS that ends up on the Cross of Christ Crucified that expresses the pain that has no voice other than its own screams
We will have to disagree on this.
Although, first of all, we have no idea. There are offenders who testify being raised completely healthy, and they decide to try something new. Others say they were abused.
That aside, as adults we choose how we cope with whatever we are raised with. Made in the image of God, Genesis 1, means we are more than conditioned animals, we each have God-given agency. Thank God.
Using power and position to violate vulnerable children is never “I just can’t help myself”.
It’s not lust but sadistic.
Type example of this was a famous Austrian cult leader with a funny little mustache, who grew up surviving some very violent physical abuse and paid it back with interest his entire adult career.
“I just can’t help myself” is just the Geraldine Defense without the Spiritual Warfare talk.
Have you ever heard the proverb “The more Pious, the more Perverted”?
When you’re constantly Reinventing the Wheel in Year Zero Syndrome, you will never have a provenance/historical trace.
Was it Geraldine who also said “The Devil made me do it”?
Ava Aaronson,
once again,
I did not claim that evil imprinted itself, but merely ASKED THE QUESTION . . .
I also have no idea. These sad mysteries may be a part of why God asks us not to judge one another’s souls . . . but no question, the ‘behavior’ is horrific, that is a ‘given’
Max,
love it!
‘pre destination’ : does it also include that satan ‘makes us do it’?
I have wondered about that point of view.
Yes.
Flip Wilson’s best-known character and character voice.
(I have a lot of respect for Clerow “Flip” Wilson. Unlike a lot of celebrities, he showed restraint and money sense, not living high and bling but saving and building a nest egg until he’d had enough of showbiz and went into retirement. When the Flip Wilson Show ended its TV run, it wasn’t cancelled; its star just decided to retire.)
Headless Unicorn Guy,
The old-fashioned church was founded in 1995, the more up to date iteration in 2008. Falwell Senior was OT, which is why some can’t remember him.
christiane,
It came from the same place as that which imprinted on the Kanakkuk bosses, on the Iwerne camp bosses, on Bishop Ball. “Muscular Christianity”, a “work of the flesh”. False asceticism as false puritanism.
It manifests in its umpteenth generation as ESS, as misogyny, as suppression of Holy Spirit belief, as societal manoeuvring / moralising / megaphoning, as dominionism, as succumbing to ideology, as coverup, as bullying, as pliableness, as rationing of prayer, as designer outlet melodrama, as rejection of Scripture thinly disguised as embracing of Scripture.
St Paul says let every individual have their own conscience. What was done to these generations has thieved them of agency or comprehension of their own.
A prospective camp boss who hadn’t had this inflicted on them, would make sane decisions on whether or how to become a christian minister or ministerial assistant, how to join in the political and business worlds, etc.
In England, many victims / proteges of Nash / Fletcher / the Smyths are trying to themselves up. It’s alarming to realise that’s where many of our leaders have been, however indirectly: for instance, some bible colleges have a too hazy “Holy Spirit doctrine”.
Triumphal superficial evangelicalism didn’t have what it takes to resist. At the lookalike camps, it’s sensational when there are “allegations”, but what about the shallowness? Isn’t there a song, “we’re out of the shallows now”, that’s too few people evidently.
I saw what all this did to my RE turned civics teacher, what it had done to his recruits from the Ministry of Education, what it did to the generations of girls, women and boys since that time, what it did to regional church catechists.
Since the 1920s church bosses intruded in couples’ privacy over “family planning” instead of equipping them with Holy Spirit. “Muscular christianity” is what I call it.
I fell to some similar sects inspite of my spiritual background being mixed so that I could sense perspective somewhat, but only belatedly at an articulate level.
In the case of Falwell Senior I sense Manifest Destiny (which is very Hegelian) and contrived coinciding with secular ideals came into it.
In my second para. in the previous, add “it manifests as emotional turmoil – also in their followers”.
Ava Aaronson,
They can’t cope, but they can help themselves, unless of course they were taught too hard to cut out the bit of Bible where St Paul tells them to get a conscience (by guess what kind of people?)