The first-anniversary image from NASA’s James Webb Space Telescope displays star birth like it’s never been seen before, full of detailed, impressionistic texture. NASA
“One man’s transparency is another’s humiliation.” Gerry Adams
I am in one of those moods and need to focus on a post for Friday. So this post is simple and annoying.
Meet Rob Wilton: The struggling young church planter.
What if your dad was Billy Graham’s pastor and led a megachurch when you decided to “go into ministry in the SBC?” Whoops- I mean called by God…You plan to be an SBC church planter, and everyone knows those guys live on the cheap, or do they?
Baptist News Global posted Critics say this SBC missions agency appears to be in the real estate business.
Wilton comes from a legacy family within the SBC, which might explain why he has been entrusted with such riches allegedly for church planting — including a custom-built house for him in a gated community near Pittsburg.
…Wilton works as the church planting pastor at Vintage Church in Pittsburg and is founder of the Vintage Church Network, which advertises churches in suburban New Orleans and in Pittsburgh. He’s also a NAMB Send City missionary — a Send Network employee whose role is to ensure the planters/plants have every opportunity to be healthy
…Before moving to Pittsburg, Wilton made a name for himself in New Orleans fighting against the city’s morning noise ordinance. When residents complained about the noise generated by his Sunday morning church services in the French Quarter, he claimed his First Amendment rights allowed him to violate the ordinance.
After leaving that work, Wilton moved to Pittsburg to start another church, through the Prestonwood Network, Longhollow Network and his own network.
Guess how many homes the North American Mission Board ( which appears to be a home for worn-out pastors who want to make a lot of dough) has gifted the son of Billy Graham’s pastor?
Eight homes for use by Wilton’s church and a new custom home for himself — a property located in a gated community nearly 30 minutes away from his inner-city church.
Again, according to public records, the nine houses entrusted to Wilton’s care are together valued at $2,377,300.
It houses the staff of megachurch enterprises.
Do those of you attempting to tithe your money to missions feel like this is a good return on your investment?
These SEND missionaries (Hey SBC, what happened to all the swag you spent on marketing Great Commission Baptists?) are supposed to coordinate church planting efforts in Baptist-lite communities. Did you know the SBC invests in real estate outside the designated Baptist-lite circles?
property records show NAMB began buying real estate outside its Send Cities targets — in places like Iowa and Oklahoma — and giving those houses to megachurch network staff members and trainees near megachurches outside of the Send Cities.
Wait, aren’t megachurches already successful? I would love to know the salaries of the top pastors in those churches. I bet some are making $500,000+, but the NAMB good old boys are housing their staff if this post is correct, and I bet it is.
The “investing and saving it for a rainy day” excuse means buying expensive houses in gated communities for their church planters.
The NAMB says they may need money in the future and can sell these houses to get them out of hot water. There is no question that the SBC membership is declining. Eventually, this will translate into less income. However, does this mean the NAMB should buy more expensive houses than most SBC members might be able to afford so that their “legacy” church planters can live large in gated communities with custom homes? Then again, I bet most of the worn-out boys on the NAMB also live in lovely homes.
The dirty little secret: The NAMB will not show their financial records to anyone! But keep tithing anyway and trust them…
Even if everything about NAMB’s real estate dealings is above board, critics warn no one knows that information except NAMB’s tightly held group of insiders in Alpharetta, Ga. Unlike its predecessor organization, the SBC Home Mission Board, NAMB does not publish salary scales for its employees or make public any personnel information.
NAMB also does not make its official audited financial statements public and reports only basic data required for the SBC Book of Reports. These are not the same things.
Exactly how much real estate NAMB owns, therefore, isn’t publicly known. NAMB officials previously said the agency purchased about 100 residential properties for use by church planters and trainees and had approved purchasing another 100 properties.
Ask them how many church plants failed. They won’t tell you. Ask how much the salaries are for the leaders in the NAMB. They won’t tell you. Just keep tithing.
There is little transparency in the NAMB, and much money is being spent.
They even stopped funding church planting efforts by the local Baptist conventions.
No wonder Will McRaney is suing the SBC. The NAMB rules the local state conventions and tells them what to do, who to fire, etc. The SBC is not autonomous. I know the arguments, and they fail in light of these situations.
Do you trust these guys? I don’t. Show us the financials. All of them!
Which genius at the SBC set up a NAMB that didn’t have to show any financial information to the SBC faithful? This would be worth a loud laugh amongst those who have completed at least one class in an MBA program. I wonder, are the boys at the NAMB laughing at the SBC faithful?
In the meantime, people should consider directly sending their money to missionaries and groups where they can see what is being accomplished. In other words, groups that emphasize transparency and accountability. Trying to figure out where the money goes in the SBC is like watching sausage being made. It turns the stomach of the uninitiated.
Stories like this just keep popping up. Long has it been, and much longer will it be, that I will ever give money to a large organization.
And all tax free to boot!
Remember the movie “The Blues Brothers”, when Jake is trying to get the band a gig, and they arrive at Bob’s Country Bunker, which announces “The Good old Boys” as the band for tonight? Then Jake says, “That’s not right, it should say ‘The good old blues brothers boys band’.” And he manages to get the “Blues Brothers Band” in instead of the “Good old boys”, who are delayed.
This is the reverse – it’s the good old boys getting in instead of the real missionaries. It’s the “Good Old North American Missions Boys Agency”.
Seems like the SBC is not a denomination, not because its churches are independent (these days they’re not), but because it’s a free ATM for the good old boys.
The fights between the factions are not really about theology, but about which faction gets to use the free ATM the most. And, not to forget, to keep those uppity women from ever getting their hands on the PIN code for said free ATM.
“Again, according to public records, the nine houses entrusted to Wilton’s care are together valued at $2,377,300.”
That’s an average of $264,144.44. Fairly modest, actually, in many housing markets today.
However, the link regarding Mr. Wilton’s “custom home” (5 beds, 4.5 baths, 4,079 Square Feet) shows a tax value of $491,100, while Zillow estimates its current market price at $886,800. (That’s an 81% increase since the tax assessment. Allegheny County is leaving a lot of revenue on the table.)
Here’s a picture of a neighboring house. Bland.
https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/1556-Celebration-Cir_Bridgeville_PA_15017_M39279-89870
Several things spring to mind here (bearing in mind I’m in the UK)
1. If this happened in the UK the church would have to register as a charity to get the tax breaks. All charities have to publish their accounts by law here.
2. I don’t know how it works there but there is a convention here that if you get a house as part of your employment you are paid correspondingly less than you would be otherwise.
3. Are church resources really best spent on domestic missions, particularly in urban areas? I find it hard to believe that there would be many areas in the US you’d be that far from a Baptist church.
Yes, they do; there are lots of stories. Trending.
And from the post:
“There is little transparency in the NAMB, and much money is being spent.”
Yes, another story, with Famous Father Syndrome (like the prophet Samuel), no-transparency finances, big bucks large living leaders, and lies AKA Power.
“Samaritan’s Purse and especially the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association should remove Franklin from leadership for spreading falsehoods and tarnishing the witness of evangelicals in a quest for political access. If they do not, the rest of us should provide them with no support.
“Many have called for this before, especially given the outrageous salaries Franklin receives, the lack of transparency, and the problematic models of ministry. But the insurrection at the Capitol raises the stakes.
“When we pack a shoebox for Samaritan’s Purse, we elevate Franklin’s political lies. When we affirmingly share one of Franklin’s devotional thoughts, we magnify his voice that he uses for partisan effort to dismantle democracy.
“We should reject those who wish for a king. And we should reject those who pervert justice in the name of their famous father.”
https://wordandway.org/2021/01/08/franklin-graham-the-sons-of-samuel/
“Do You Think Your Hard Earned SBC Donations Are Being Used in the Way You Intended? Read This to Be Disabused of Your Naive Notions.”
Who is this “You,” Dee? Just a guess but I doubt your regular readers are donating money to the SBC!
From the standpoint of “propagating the Gospel to those who have not heard it”, perhaps not. But from a $-oriented business approach, one might argue that SBC emphasis on US church planting makes a lot of sense. The numerical decline in membership statistics may portend future income declines to SBC entities. It might be that NAMB is responding by seeking to create future SBC congregations that will make up future income shortfalls to itself and other SBC entities. The urban emphasis might simply be that “that’s where the people are”.
If one thinks of the business imperatives the entities face, that may help to explain the business practices.
Church as a business.
Fortunately, the Gospel is not a business. Jesus’ practices, including with his disciples, were thoroughly against the Gospel as a business. Antibusiness. On the other hand, the antichrist will therefore be thoroughly all about business. Church as a business is antichrist. We are there, as a culture, as a country.
Let’s do community engagement:
Build a brand. Franchise. Money rolling in. Experiential:
-social clubs
-youth engagement
-casino quality entertainment
-Hollywood-level star celebrity leaders
-children’s activities
-business networking opportunities
-award-winning performers
-professional music productions
-cutting edge technology
-TED talk speakers
-media savvy
-coffeeshop included
-recovery groups galore.
The place to be and TO BE SEEN. How exciting. Fabulous. Game on. We’re in. Everything that money can buy and crowds will applaud and adore.
Just take the “church” part, the “Gospel” out of it but do the community stuff, for those who can afford it. But this is/was not Jesus – not that there is anything wrong with doing community activities. But if you have to pay to play, it is definitely NOT church.
“The dirty little secret: The NAMB will not show their financial records to anyone! But keep tithing anyway and trust them …”
Well, here’s the dirtiest little secret of all … NAMB’s church-planting mission is all about planting reformed theology, not Gospel churches. They have been spending $60+ million per year to do that since New Calvinism moved in and took over leadership positions in all SBC entities. Mainline Southern Baptists are still primarily non-Calvinists in belief and practice, but their mission offerings have been used to plant a theology opposed to what they believe about God’s salvation plan (predestinated elect vs. whosoever will may come).
We’ve heard a lot about the stealth and deception of the new reformers taking over established churches, but little focus has been given to the stealth used to establish a theology across America contrary to the belief of millions of Southern Baptists, who still don’t have a clue about what’s going on in their denomination. If this revelation about NAMB spending their hard earned tithes on expensive real estate for church planters doesn’t get their attention, nothing will. It’s the darnedest thing I’ve ever seen!
“Church planting ‘Class of 2022’ pushes Southern Baptists past 10,000 churches planted since 2010”
https://www.namb.net/news/church-planting-class-of-2022-pushes-southern-baptists-past-10000-churches-planted-since-2010/#:~:text=The%20745%20%E2%80%9CClass%20of%202022,NAMB)%20president%2C%20Kevin%20Ezell.
CMT,
I have some hard core Baptist friends and they read!
… while also changing SBC’s theological default from non-Calvinist to Calvinist in belief and practice. The Mohlerites know exactly what they are doing with this business model.
As a side-note, Kevin Ezell, NAMB President, was formerly Al Mohler’s pastor … think about it.
I don’t know how hard core I was, but I was a Southern Baptist for decades … until the New Calvinists moved in and started taking SBC for this sort of ride.
“They even stopped funding church planting efforts by the local Baptist conventions.”
Wrong theological flavor, no doubt.
But from the standpoint of “Rich Pastor’s Furtick Mansion Money”, “Rich Pastor’s Private Jet Money”, “Rich Pastor’s PAC Money”…
But The Je$u$ Racket is.
“grace sold on the market like cheapjacks’ wares” (Dietrich Bonhoeffer)
McMansion.
https://mcmansionhell.com/101
Note the overly-complex roofline, the nested descending gables, the inconsistent window sizes and arrangement.
And like most McMansions, made of particle-board and styrofoam under all that bling-bling. It’ll be falling apart within five years, but then it only has to look good long enough to flip to some sucker.
Ouch. Bonhoeffer is right, of course, with his very stinging word.
Now we know why they want pew peons to “give ‘til it hurts’.
I wonder if Annie Armstrong is rolling over in her grave?
“MONEY FOR NUTHIN’ AND THE CHICKS FOR FREE!”
— Dire Straits
Select TWW posts need to be Sunday morning bulletin inserts at SBC churches across America. Pastors just aren’t informing/warning their congregations what is going on in the denomination. Of course, if they did, they would become targets by the Calvinistas.
Well, she should be. The New Calvinists wouldn’t let her preach in SBC pulpits today (which she did while an SBC missionary), but they have no shame in collecting an annual Easter offering in her name from 47,000+ SBC churches to fund things she would most likely be opposed to … Annie preached the Gospel truth that whosoever-will-may-come.
Let me tell you about a real “missionary” I once knew. The lady “served” in the Four Corners region. She CHOSE to rent a small, around 8 by 35, trailer house behind a grocery store. It was a very old trailer. In a dumpy park. But by doing that she was accepted into the community that was that park. She did not take middle class belongings with her when she chose to live there. She was in poor health, but embraced living on the income her neighbors had to live on, and living as they did. Which meant a pretty poverty level lifestyle. Nothing fancy.
She let anyone who would donate Bibles to her, which she shared with her neighbors. She would glean gardens to get food for herself but mostly to have some excuse to share an abundance of food with her neighbors.
We let her glean and would help her pick from our garden. Until came a day when a stomach bug had me puking my brains out. That day she showed up, picked, picked for me so I could can later in the week, kept check on me, even went to sonic and got me a soda to settle my stomach.
Nobody ever ordained her. Churches shunned her because she worked without a net under her and did not ask their permission.
I just hope I get to sit close to her in heaven. Might be tough, as there might be too many people she led to Jesus wanting that honor.
She did not plant churches. She took Jesus to people who needed Him.
Max,
“Select TWW posts need to be Sunday morning bulletin inserts at SBC churches across America.”
++++++++++++++++++
billboards…
i was perusing how to buy billboards. (better to own than rent)
and buying the properties on which the billboards stand (& how to get permission to have billboards)
…just in case i come into ridiculous wealth.
it’s hard to find this information.
.
.
anyone here fabulously wealthy & counting, & not sure what to do with it?
It sounds almost like they’re focusing on the wrong thing. (sarc)
When churches fear a numerical decline it’s frequently for the wrong reasons.
I believe the Methodist church here (which has been Britain’s fastest declining denomination for decades) has also found all sorts of good things coming out of it, including feeling like the denomination is smaller but keener, and lots of work with other denominations including joint churches.
I was listening to an older DB Hart interview yesterday. Regarding Christianity in America, he was of the opinion that America has never embraced true Christianity, but rather what the first settlers brought from Europe (which was already in decline for various reasons) quickly got made into some kind of American enterprise that bears no resemblance to what Christianity was meant to be – not his words, but that was the gist. Similar to but more startling to American ears than Chesterton’s Christianity as “too difficult, therefore never been tried” saying.
I’d be hard put to argue that, especially with regard to how little most Christians do “hands on” for poor people. I know that lots of Christians put in many hours of in-person sacrificial care for people, but most of us – myself included – think that giving money to support others in their</i? care of the poor is all that's required. Israel's prophets and Christ himself would beg to differ with us. This troubles my conscience as a Christian every day – more than having the approved stance on any culture war issue. St Basil, who built and staffed an entire city on the outskirts of Constantinople for the care of the sick, orphaned, elderly, poor and mentally ill, was very clear: "When someone steals a man’s clothes we call him a thief. Should we not give the same name to one who could clothe the naked but does not? The bread in your cupboard belongs to the hungry man; the coat hanging unused in your closet belongs to the man who needs it; the shoes rotting in your closet belong to the man who has no shoes; the money which you hoard up belongs to the poor."
The whole money thing is what prompted me to comment, even though I've been out of the Evangelical/non-sacramental churches for 15 years. Although a church needs a place in which to worship and organize for doing good in the community, and that may involve owning land, church groups are not meant to be real estate brokers. Though the average value of those houses works out to be ~$250K, we all know that values differ in different places, and those houses would be sold for the maximum they could bring in their markers. No wonder trust of institutions is at an all-time low; all one has to do is "follow the money" (everywhere, not just in the SBC) to find out why.
D.
dainca,
Sorry about the formatting – “their” is all I meant to be in italics…
also “markets”
D.
I disagree.
I do not think that churches need to own property. That is a false construct.
CynthiaW.,
I take it the slave quarters are out back?
Slavery is after all, completely ‘Biblical’.
The linked story about the church’s noise violations is hilarious. During a building renovation, they set up a tent and started making amplified worship noises as early at 7 on Sunday mornings in a neighborhood. One excuse after another. Preaching without a microphone strained the pastor’s voice. How could they possibly tell their service exceeded 60 decibels? No indoor facility met their needs. The sight of deputies responding to citizen complaints “unnerved members of their congregation.”
The church simply had to start outdoor services an hour earlier than local noise ordinances allowed, because “People have so many other obligations and plans on Sunday afternoon, whether it’s getting their kids down for a nap, watching a Saints game or going to a local festival.”
My favorite: people need to hear music before they hear the Bible.
linda,
“The last will be first, and the first will be last”
I disagree.
I do not think that churches need to own property. That is a false construct.
Bob M the Fundy (or so called),
Hmmmm…… I agree and disagree. It is nice for a group of people to have a common place to meet and worship; a place no one can throw them out of on a whim. But, neither Jesus nor Paul (or any apostles/early disciples, afaik) ran around buying land and buildings, or pushing fundraisers to do so. {Note: I said land and buildings. The NAMB is buying up mini-mansions in gated communities!!! (Steve Gaines???)}
They lived and functioned around the people they served – people didn’t have to have a passcode to see them. Elders/deacons tended to the widowed, the elderly, the sick……
Setting up an income base. For a professional holy man “pastor”.
One small quibble about “a gated community nearly 30 minutes away from his inner-city church.” The Vintage Church in the city of Pittsburgh is on Mount Washington, not in the “inner city.” The other Vintage location is in Moon Township, a suburb.
I don’t know what the Vintage Church trying to achieve, but “inner city” implies outreach to the poorest, who will not be found in either place. Mount Washington, Moon Township, and Bridgeville are all on the far side of the Monongahela River from downtown Pittsburgh. Convenient.
Allegheny County is jam packed with churches, many established long ago and struggling to keep their doors open. The Mount Washington location is/was a Presbyterian church of some flavor. The Moon Township place is/was West Hills Christian Church. Perhaps Vintage is sharing space, or perhaps it is leasing abandoned churches.
For what it’s worth.
Linda…..thank you for sharing that wonderful story about your precious friend….
dee,
I stand corrected!
No biggie.
There are times when I’ve mentioned ‘Injun Joe’ from Twain (same creator of Muff Potter), and it went into limbo for a while.
That is definitely not the ministry model used by SBC’s New Calvinists! The dudebros spend too much time tweeting their lives away at the coffee shop to minister to the flock! Visiting folks in nursing homes, praying for the sick in hospitals, providing for the needs of widows, staying in touch with church members through the week, preaching funerals, etc. are not in modus operandi of the new reformers.
Bob M,
I have on a couple of occasions had a post that is there, disappears and then shows up again later.
It sometimes seems that technology is not always fully “there”.
A few admin points.
Don’t talk about moderation.
Read the “Click here for our commenting rules” if something doesn’t make sense.
Bob M – Changing your name for cuteness makes you look new. All all comments from new folks get held.
GBTC
Self-serving or God serving. The question.
“Whatever you do unto the least of these, you do unto Me,” Jesus said. So that is the answer.
This goes way back to the OT covenant God had with the Israelites: having been rescued by God in His grace, they were to look out for the least of the least in their communities: the orphans, widows, and migrants. The prophets critiqued their faithfulness or not.
Jesus then said a new commandment I give you, that you love one another, specifically the least of the least. The new covenant was Jesus extending His grace beyond Israel to the Church, the Body of Christ.
The business model of the church today has nothing to do with Jesus.
The New Covenant was Jesus extending grace beyond Israel with the understanding that those receiving grace have the responsibility to extend grace to others. And therefore God is faithful with His benefits of the New Covenant: the fruit of the Spirit, the gifts of the Spirit, and belonging in the community of the Body of Christ. We belong.
Self-serving or God serving.
Ava Aaronson,
Doing a less than full-time job while getting a full-time salary, full-time benefits, a 5-bedroom, 4 1/2 bath home (and probably travel expenses covered by the ‘company’)……. all from the sacrificial giving of others ….. “to help spread the ‘gospel’ “.
That sounds like starving the sheep to get lobster and caviar.
Betcha it has “tray ceilings” and crown moldings, too. Nothing enhances the utility of a residence like fancy ceilings.
Muff Potter,
Faux-Craftsman, for that mildly nostalgic atmosphere.
Just as Jesus said they should. “Whatever you do to the least of these, you do to Me.”
The Jesus brand.
Well, here’s the deal. New Calvinist church planters are not spreading ‘the’ Gospel that millions of non-Calvinist Southern Baptists sow their hard-earned dollars into. To the new reformers, Gospel = Calvinism. They are planting reformed theology, not preaching the SBC default free-will theology endorsed by most Southern Baptists for over 150 years that whosoever-will-may-come.
The New Calvinists “retired” Jesus … they don’t preach much about Him these days – they talk more about reformed icons than Christ.
The Jesus RACKET.
They spread the Gospel of CALVIN.
CALVIN who alone Has God All Figured Out.
Isn’t that called a CULT CULT CULT when the Other Guy does it?
Who needs Christ when you have CALVIN?
And a twelve-foot cathedral ceiling with a faux-crystal chandelier in the boutique half-bath.
“Why Yes. We’re RICH. However could you tell?”
https://mcmansionhell.com/post/151896249151/the-10-circles-of-mcmansionhell-the-mcmansion
I live in a part of town that has a lot of REAL Craftsman houses.
Always wanted one (brought up to modern plumbing, electrical, and WiFi standards) but they cost more than a McMansion.
Allegheny County?
You mean the Pittsburgh area?
(5 beds, 4.5 baths, 4,079 Square Feet)
CynthiaW.,
Lots of rooms to keep clean……. I wonder if they have a part-time housekeeper – on the pew peons’ dimes?
The New Calvinists “retired” Jesus … they don’t preach much about Him these days – they talk more about reformed icons than Christ.
Max,
Jesus has been completely shunned in the SBC. Neo-Cal churches have replaced Jesus with Calvin, and Traditionalist churches have traded Him for Paul.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
this is what the house looks like inside.
https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1550-Celebration-Cir-Bridgeville-PA-15017/164607203_zpid/?mmlb=g,0
And no doubt it has that cavernous Open Concept Design from Hell that makes you feel like you’re in a combination high school gym and airplane hangar. Ugh.
Oh my gosh, just saw this right after I posted about the Open Concept from Hell. Holy Chip and Joanna, Batman!
And oy! That final shot of the “community.” Talk about depressing.
To paraphrase Pete Seeger:
Big boxes on the hillside,
Big boxes made of ticky-tacky.
Big boxes, big boxes,
And they all look just the same.
Franklin Graham is NOT a man like his father. The horror is that good people KNOW THIS and still support him. It’s a pattern that echoes from all political power-seeking entities that claim connection with religion.
Look at the ‘fruit’. ‘Samaritan’s Purse’ is a blind, behind which the troll hides and plans his ‘future’ in a place where autocrats divide the spoils amongst themselves. It is sad to see good people ‘fooled’, but it is WORSE to see good people KNOWING that they are being fooled and ‘going along to be seen and heard themselves’. . . what is needed? Someone to come and drive the money-changers out of the temple . . . oh wait, that has happened, two thousand years ago . . . they hung that ‘Someone’ on a cross then. But good people don’t remember sometimes the costs of confronting greed full on; or maybe good people do remember and are afraid of the consequences of confrontation with the money changers . . . (?)
We are left wondering, and mourning. Billy Graham does not deserve this stain on his legacy . . . and from his own son! There is a pathos in what has become of the Graham family name, yes. Very sad indeed.
Headless Unicorn Guy,
Yes, Pittsburgh and vicinity.
If I’ve totally misunderstood, somebody please let me know. One of the links did not exactly work, but I think this is about Rob Wilton and the Vintage Church, at two locations around Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.
MC MANSION – Genuine Particle Board and Styrofoam! Built to Flip!
Note the inconsistent roof line, the giant dormers, the overly-elaborate giant colunnar entry, the inconsistent windows that look stuck on.
And total white-on-white interior – all that’s missing are life-size cardboard standees of Butler and Maid!
Once again, how deep on the McMansion Hell scale does it go?
https://mcmansionhell.com/post/151896249151/the-10-circles-of-mcmansionhell-the-mcmansion
Plot twist!
“Rob Wilton is a multi-city movement leader for Christ. He is the Founding Pastor of Vintage Church, Send City Missionary for the Send Network, and the Chaplain for the New Orleans Saints.”
Granted, these two items were 5 years apart (2015 and 2020), but I do detect a theme. 😉
https://m.exponential.org/2020orl/speakers/speakers-897.html
Or the pew peons themselves, unpaid – It’s a MINISTRY, remember?
I have found through experience that 1200 sq ft is the most house I can keep cleaned and maintained. These “humble parsonages” would need a full-time staff, especially with Reverend Master & Madame busy 24/7 with Spiritual things. Remember Vision Forum and its 200-year plans of dynastic Estates and “Household Servants”? The Jerk with his Kirk in Moscow ID with his ode to The Peculiar Institution(TM)?
Friend,
Plot twist…… I’ll add a word twist: From New Orleans to Pittsburg = from Saints to Steelers (saints to stealers???).
elastigirl,
Wow! Definitely much better than average! Since that house is in the same gated community as the one Wilton lives in, I would assume his house is of a very similar caliber ~~~ and free housing to boot!…… free for Wilton, anyway.
First off: my Bible reads, right from the jump, that our beloved Heavenly Father is our Creator. We love Him with all our heart, soul, mind, and strength, as children of God (not the cult).
Secondly: my Bible goes on to say that God created man and woman in His image. Every person, therefore, has dignity. We love our neighbor as ourselves.
Jesus reiterated and affirmed both of these, one and two.
However, Dear Boy Calvin, starts off his TULIP with the totally depravity of man. Talk about needing a therapist! What happened to reverence for our Creator God, and love our neighbors as ourselves, as both me and we are created with dignity in the image of God?
Twisted TULIP. As twisted and quaky flakey as a Costco churro.
Sure, after one and two, came Act Three in the Garden of Eden with the Fall of Man. However, that was AFTER Acts One and Two, with God as our Heavenly Father, and all of humanity created in the image of God with dignity. The foundations of Acts One and Two stand.
Dear Boy Cal leaves that foundation, basic truth & premise of all, completely out of the story which creates a mentally ill mixed up mess that somehow folks who don’t bother to read the Bible for themselves, follow after, wallowing in their so-called utter depravity.
No thanks.
Jesus walked a higher ground, with God as our Creator who loves us and desires that we love each other and ourselves. We follow Jesus, also on higher ground.
elastigirl,
Nothing wrong with the house. But asking donors to cough up the $$$ for this? Do all the donors live like this? If donors, no matter their own station in life, are to fund this, that’s idolatry, plain and simple.
We had a pastor that built his own house, literally. When something was askew with our garage door opener, my husband called the pastor for advice, but the pastor came out and fixed it. No charge.
LOL – what a joke these “spiritual” leaders are that ingratiate and pander for … for everything. They might as well be standing at the freeway exit with their cup, banging on your window while you wait for the light to change. That may be the reality of their Sunday morning gig – more akin to that guy standing by the side of the road with his cup shoved in the faces of all who pass by. Doesn’t look like that – but that may be all it is.
Beware. Be aware.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
The Steelers chaplain is Kent Chevalier. The Internet made me an instant expert, as usual. 😉
Lots of twists and turns going on today regarding the Long Island Serialist. Piece of work, allegedly. The FBI profile read: “bright, careful, sadistic, married, financially secure.”
The alleged LISK neighbors said he was quiet, but didn’t keep up his property nice and neat like the rest of the neighborhood – too busy with extra-curricular obsessions and preoccupations?
Anyway, everyone says they never suspected, not a clue. Only science made this happen.
Similar to our leaders that we never ever suspect. Perfect image. Science and data exposed activities beneath the image. The real deal.
Many have,yes.
It’s Paul this, Paul that, Paul sez this, Paul sez that…
Why don’t they just get it over with and call it Paulianity?
Well, the way that they’ve been acting (stealth & deception taking over churches, oppression of women, cutting Jesus out of the Bible, magnifying Paul when he said not to, etc.), total depravity fits.
Why even bother building churches to spout reformed theology when God theoretically calls people irrespective of their will and its all part of His soverign plan anyway??
Abigail,
Yup. Why bother going through all the trouble of “spreading the gospel”, why bother trying to live a righteous life, when every person’s fate has been predetermined “before the foundations of the world”???????
“You cannot get up in the morning and sh*t in a gold-plated toilet and not be delusional about who you are.”
— JMJ/CHristian Monist
Good question.
One that you’re not supposed to asking.
I keep thinking about this. Since the early 1600s, a thousand different approaches to Christianity have been attempted in America. Many Christians came here to escape persecution or lesser restrictions. More than a few forms of Christianity came into existence in America.
Maybe true Christianity has never been tried here, but I’m not sure we can generalize. I’m also not sure that American forms of Christianity are any worse than those practiced elsewhere in the past 600 years, as the alleged absence of “true Christianity” implies. Meanwhile we do have freedom of religion, quite a nice thing.
Exactly. Absolutely no reason to do church in a reformed world. On a “predestined” planet of humanity, there is no reason to evangelize, no need for missions, no need to talk about Jesus. Which, of course, are primary reasons why 90+% of Christendom have rejected the tenets of reformed theology for the last 500 years … there’s no Gospel truth in it. A hardcore hyper-Calvinist would argue that this is not right, that I’m not smart enough to understand their faith, etc. But the fruit (or lack of it) is there for all to see.
The Bible speaks much about the sovereignty of God. The Bible speaks much about the free will of man. It all works together to redeem souls in a way that is beyond human comprehension. To put the mind of God into a neat systematic theological box is to stand in arrogance before the Creator.
Projection? Takes one to know one?
What I cannot comprehend….the emotional and spiritual disconnect between loving God with all your heart soul and strength AND YET believing that this same God chooses most people for hell and without his will they cannot do anything about it. Yup.
And it’s not just the ‘Reformed’ that do it.
Every denomination, group, ‘fellowship’, what have you, has their own theo-box and bag of tricks through which they ‘speak’ for God.
There are 30,000+ Christian denominations globally. All built around the-only-truth, my-way-or-the-highway doctrines of men. It’s an endless smorgasboard of faith … what’s a poor soul to do?!
doublethink, comrades, doublethink.
The Money, of course.
Wasn’t becoming Filthy Stinking Rich the original Calvinist PROOF of Election? God Rewarding His Predestined Elect?
And when you factor in “Evanescent Grace” (GOD sending a “False Election” indistinguishable from the real thing until the Great White Throne, Haw Haw Haw), a Calvinist will become desperate to PROVE to himself that HE is Truly Among The Elect (and just as important, You’re NOT).
“For in the devil’s theology, the most important thing is to be absolutely right, and prove everyone else to be absolutely wrong.” — Thomas Merton
Ava Aaronson,
Dear Boy Cal also got forced into an unwanted law career by his father, and got rescued from that by The Reformation Like Aleister Crowley’s entire adult life, this may have been him giving that a double middle finger.
Plus another factor: Dear Boy Call was plagued with kidney stones (an extremely painful condition) at a time when alcohol was the only available painkiller.
Just take some potato salad and cold-cuts?