What In the World Is Going on at SWBTS? Also, Christa Brown and David Clohessy Expose Problems With the SBC’s Response to the SATF Findings #ThisistheSBC

Messier 16, also known as the Eagle Nebula, is a famous region of the sky often referred to as the “Pillars of Creation. The Chandra sources, which look like dots, are young stars that give off copious amounts of X-rays. JPL/NASA.

“Knowledge that can make miracles happen needs to be guarded carefully. If it falls into the wrong hands, miracles become disasters in no time.” ― Pawan Mishra, Coinman.


There are so many problems within the SBC that I don’t know where to begin, so here are a few highlights or lowlights…

Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary: DOJ investigation? Squirrelly finances? Plummeting enrollment? Yikes

Southwestern Seminary was Paige Patterson’s old gig. They dumped him over the coverup of sex abuse and concerns over spending. His replacement, Adam Greenway, resigned at the end of last year over financial and legal issues. It’s the same old, same old. Southern Baptist departures continue as major seminary president resigns.

Oddly enough, he got some gig with the IMB, which seems to be a place where failures or tired old men can be paid well, but they won’t tell you how much. Just keep that money coming, pew sitters.

It now appears there is much more, and meetings are taking place. Southwestern Seminary trustees called to special meeting next Tuesday.

Why the investigation of financial irregularities led by trustee Aaron Sligar, pastor of Living River Chapel in Sutton, W.Va., was not fully reported to the full board. The letter contends executive committee officers asked Sligar not to share the full report with the board but to give “a selective verbal reading.”

Why Baptist News Global reported on the existence of a written report from the Sligar investigation when most trustees were not aware of its existence. “Yet that report exists.”

BNG previously reported the trustee-ordered investigation into alleged overspending by the Greenway administration had been shared in detail only with the trustee executive committee but an oral presentation was made to the full board. The letter asking for the special meeting confirms that assessment.

Despite this, they fudged the numbers so the school could still get money from the Cooperative Program. So, folks, keep those tithes coming!

Aided by a global pandemic, Southwestern’s enrollment continued to slide — dropping so low that the 2022 SBC Book of Reports includes a footnote on Southwestern’s FTE enrollment, explaining that the Council of Seminary Presidents had allowed the prior year’s enrollment number to be used in 2020-2021 to avoid a further drop in Southwestern’s Cooperative Program allocation.

The DOJ may be investigating SWBTS.

reported inquiry by the U.S. Department of Justice about some kind of sexual abuse case related to Southwestern or Southwestern employees.

There are concerns that enrollment is the lowest since WW2,

According to BNG in Behind the Numbers: How Southwestern Seminary’s enrollment came to be the lowest it has been since World War II

What once was the world’s largest theological seminary now is the fifth largest of the six Southern Baptist Convention seminaries.

LOLOL. And Greenway is now at the IMB!!!

When Southwestern trustees hired Greenway as president in 2019, they charged him with reversing the enrollment declines and overspending of the Patterson era. Three years later, he had been unable to do either.

Back to the special meeting at SWBTS. There are concerns over some hinky business dealings.

Why Colby Adams, vice president for institutional administration, has collaborated with two Fort Worth businessmen to create a new corporation named Future Fort Worth that uses as its registered address the seminary-owned home where Adams lives. “Adams, as lead negotiator on real estate deals for SWBTS, has not disclosed this business relationship to the board of trustees.”

And some hinky financial expenditures.

We already know that Dr. Greenway and others demonstrated a freedom in the finances of the seminary.”

The report identifies $12 million “spent on renovation projects, primarily to offices and cabinet member homes.” No time frame or context is given for that $12 million expenditure.

However, Sligar spoke of “out-of-control spending.

This example is even worse than hinky: someone took out credit cards in the names of employees without their knowledge.

unnamed seminary employee reportedly entered into an agreement with American Express to take out credit cards in the names of seminary staff members using their full names, dates of birth and Social Security numbers without their knowledge.

“This made the faculty/staff financially responsible for the card payments if SWBTS failed to pay,” the Sligar summary states. “When bills were paid late, it began to affect the credit scores of the individuals. This level of incompetence opens the door for the seminary and/or credit card manager for possible contract violations or legal issues.”

Someone even allegedly used designated endowments for other purposes. No wonder the DOJ is getting really interested.

someone in the administration authorized using designated endowment funds for undesignated purpose. Such actions are illegal under federal law. When a donor gives a gift with a designation, the money must be used for that purpose only unless the donor gives permission to make a change.

Trustee Chairman Roberts claims, “Nothing to see here, move along.”

we assert claims of inappropriate activities of the board officers, executive committee, and/or named staff are without merit, and the board will release all relevant and appropriate information following a special-called meeting of the board of trustees to be held on May 30

But aren’t they doing better with the Sex Abuse Task Force?

Not so fast, says Christa Brown and David Clohessy, writing for BNG: Five things Southern Baptists should do now to address clergy sex abuse.

Did you know that the SBC has not outed a single accused abuser?

Despite much talk and multiple committees, the SBC has not yet, on its own, outed and held accountable a single credibly accused clergy sex abuser.

This is the most disturbing part of their post. Individual churches are supposed to initiate their own independent investigation. (Yeah, right!) However, it’s not up to the SBC to oversee this because every church is autonomous. (Passing the buck?)

Currently, a call to the SBC’s sexual abuse hotline does not trigger an immediate independent investigation to assess whether a pastor is credibly accused. Instead, an abuse report may get referred to the relevant church, and the church is responsible for initiating an independent investigation. According to the Abuse Reform Implementation Task Force, “each local church has full autonomy in selecting an independent, qualified firm.”

Did you know the abusers on the former secret list are still not listed?

  1. Immediately add to the new Ministry Check database all the names of pastors and church staff that are on the Executive Committee’s list released a year ago.

For at least 15 years, the SBC’s Executive Committee kept a secret list of sexual abusers. Even as survivors struggled desperately to warn congregations about preacher-predators, SBC officials knew about more than 700 abusive pastors and took no action to protect people — the moral bankruptcy of it is unfathomable.

Finally, in the face of survivors’ demands and media pressure, the Executive Committee made its list public.

How many abuse reports have been made to the hotline, and what are they doing about it?

  1. Provide public information about the abuse reports made to the hotline.

The Abuse Reform Implementation Task Force has said that “hundreds of unique submissions” have been reported to the SBC’s sexual abuse hotline. This raises many urgent questions.

…How many pastors and church staff have been accused of sexual abuse? How many reported pastors have been placed on leave pending investigation? How many independent investigations are currently in progress? Have congregations with accused pastors been fully informed? And where are these potentially dangerous pastors now?

Is the new Ministry Check database adding convicted or self-confessed church staff? You guessed it…

  1. Immediately add to the new Ministry Check database all the names of any pastor or church staff for whom documentation has been submitted of a criminal conviction or plea bargain on sexual abuse or sexual assault, or on the possession or distribution of child sexual abuse materials.

“I gave her the name of my perp, I sent the scanned felony paperwork, the link to his being on the Texas sex offender list, and still, I do not see his name on the SBC list.”

That’s what a survivor said about her communication, 10 months ago, with the SBC’s sexual abuse hotline.

The Executive Committee applauded Morris Chapman and gave him an honorary title. Huh?

As the man who held top power during many of the years covered by the Guidepost report, Morris Chapman presided over the SBC Executive Committee’s egregious mishandling of abuse reports, its maltreatment of survivors, its resistance to reform and its callous, duplicitous choice to protect the institution over people.

Countless kids and congregants could have been spared horrific harm if only Chapman had acted years ago.

Please read the entire post. Unfortunately, it paints a picture of tone-deaf leaders, which does not portend well for the SBC. But there is more, much more. I haven’t even touched on the exposure of Johnny Hunt’s financial empire, which he created inside the SBC. I haven’t spoken of the growing concern for the inability to find out how much money is being spent and for what. Well, that’s for another day.

Comments

What In the World Is Going on at SWBTS? Also, Christa Brown and David Clohessy Expose Problems With the SBC’s Response to the SATF Findings #ThisistheSBC — 65 Comments


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    “There are so many problems within the SBC that I don’t know where to begin…” When the SBC leaders failed to act, the DOJ has now stepped in. When churches don’t clean their houses, God has no choice but to let secular entities step in. Looking at this post is heartbreaking. Same old, same old. Sigh.


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    Churches need to start leaving the SBC en masse. This is all ridiculous.


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    Church 1: “We believe in infant baptism”

    SBC: “Sorry, you can’t be an SBC church any more”

    Church 2: “We think there is value in listening to Black Lives Matter”

    SBC: “Sorry, you can’t be an SBC church any more”

    Church 3: “We covered up sexual abuse reports involving our pastor”

    SBC: “Well that’s your right as an autonomous church.”


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    “We already know that Dr. Greenway and others demonstrated a freedom in the finances of the seminary.”

    “The report identifies $12 million “spent on renovation projects, primarily to offices and cabinet member homes.” No time frame or context is given for that $12 million expenditure.”

    Dog washing stations do not build themselves.


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    “unnamed seminary employee reportedly entered into an agreement with American Express to take out credit cards in the names of seminary staff members using their full names, dates of birth and Social Security numbers without their knowledge.

    “This made the faculty/staff financially responsible for the card payments if SWBTS failed to pay,” the Sligar summary states. “When bills were paid late, it began to affect the credit scores of the individuals. This level of incompetence opens the door for the seminary and/or credit card manager for possible contract violations or legal issues.””

    And…

    “someone in the administration authorized using designated endowment funds for undesignated purpose. Such actions are illegal under federal law. When a donor gives a gift with a designation, the money must be used for that purpose only unless the donor gives permission to make a change.“

    Levels of incompetence, you say? As Jerome brought up a few days back:

    https://thebaptistpaper.org/florida-baptist-convention-continues-efforts-to-recover-700000-in-stolen-funds/

    Oopsie, mistakes were made (sending 700 K cuz email sed so); barn door closing subcommittee; we good?

    If no one is taking oversight, transparency, and accountability seriously enough (or if some do some but are rebuffed one way or another), why wouldn’t things go a certain way — and continue that way until things get really bad — without sufficient safeguards and related priorities?


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    JDV,

    The world’s institutions have started to copy these thefts FROM the churches.


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    I don’t know what’s going on at SWBTS, I’m afraid, so I can’t help emdy there.

    On the plus side, Lesley and I are just back from a week on the Isle of Skye, which went superbly well – sunshine on the Cuillin! I’ll be in the garden for most of today, digging (and perhaps pouring) the foundation for the next section of retaining wall up at the top.

    ION: The Ashes begin in just over two weeks. AWWBA, this is a major event in the Wartburg national sport of cricket. I shall, of course, be keeping you all posted.

    I hope this is helpful.


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    JDV: “We already know that Dr. Greenway and others demonstrated a freedom in the finances of the seminary.”

    I admired that phrasing.


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    Taking out credit cards in employees’ names without their knowledge to pay the seminary’s bills? What is this, identity theft for Jesus?


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    How can anyone take out a loan, get a credit card, open a bank account without the person respnsible for paying the bills showing up in person and presenting a valid ID?

    Some things are just too easy and convenient in the U.S., for the perpetrators of ID fraud, that is.

    I’m quite happy that my country is old-fashioned enough not to allow this.


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    When the org pipsqueaks in charge, circa year 2000, decided to prove their manhood by denigrating women, the org turned a corner.

    Nothing good can follow from one gender denigrating another, in the name of god. God is nowhere to be found in any of this.

    Basic.

    Hang on to this org at one’s own demise. It’s really that basic.


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    CMT, What is this, identity theft for Jesus?
    I don’t know why we are surprised. They have been using the name of God to take money, power, and control, and use and abuse for decades.


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    What’s the difference between what these SWBTS people are doing and a gambler using someone else’s identity to gamble at a casino??
    …….Other than the fact that SWBTS pretend to be doing it for the advancement of God’s kingdom, which make them a little more wicked than an identity stealing gambler.


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    Gus: I’m quite happy that my country is old-fashioned enough not to allow this.

    The unrestricted wheels of commerce are contributing greatly to the downfall of my country. No politics involved, it’s just fact.


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    Nancy(aka Kevlar): Other than the fact that SWBTS pretend to be doing it for the advancement of God’s kingdom, which make them a little more wicked than an identity stealing gambler.

    At least the gambler doesn’t try to pretend it’s something else.


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    Nancy(aka Kevlar): What’s the difference between what these SWBTS people are doing and a gambler using someone else’s identity to gamble at a casino??

    Long prayers and SCRIPTURE quotes for justification.


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    CMT:
    Taking out credit cards in employees’ names without their knowledge to pay the seminary’s bills? What is this, identity theft for Jesus?

    Nice Racket.


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    “… they fudged the numbers …”

    Which is actually a common problem within SBC. It’s all about nickels and noses in SBC. For years, they reported 15 million members, while those of us with some tenure in the denomination know the population of active members is really far less than that (I was a Southern Baptist for 70 years before the New Calvinist movement moved me out of SBC, so I know a few things). Even local churches (45,000+ across the U.S.) play the numbers game. I can take you to SBC churches in my area that are still counting members who have moved from the area, changed to another denomination, dropped out of church altogether, or dead. Two or more SBC churches in the same community are even counting the same members, as folks tend to shop around! Church leaders are reluctant to report ‘real’ membership; it makes their church look like it’s on the decline.


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    Max, I can take you to SBC churches in my area that are still counting members who have moved from the area, changed to another denomination, dropped out of church altogether, or dead.

    It’s the same way here in Southern Kentucky.
    At an SBC church where I was a participating member for years, pastors wife pushed to remove from the roll the names of members who were deceased and members who had not attended in the past 6 years. A man made a proposal in favor, and a motion was brought before the congregation for a vote at a business meeting (yeah, I was there). The motion was voted down.

    I can


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    Nancy2(aka Kevlar): pastors wife pushed to remove from the roll the names of members who were deceased and members who had not attended

    My wife was volunteer church secretary at a rural church. She hit a wall of resistance when she proposed that the church purge member names from the roll who were nowhere to be found. SBC rural churches like to hold onto a lot of dead things.


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    Muff Potter: At least the gambler doesn’t try to pretend it’s something else.

    That’s the issue so rarely discussed in all of these “Oopsie, mistakes were made, we good?” instances. How many people actually express remorse commensurate with actual repentance in the middle of all these things about the damage done in the name of Christianity?

    Instead, as so many are already readily rendering unto Ceasar in their 501(c)(3) constructs, they may go into worldly lawsuit mode focused on preserving their future marketability, as has evidently surfaced. This can effectively take genuine repentance off the table, as the easiest and surest way they could make bank and get the power they want or feel entitled to receive is in their particular wheelhouse of relying on winsomely-sheared sheep funding them (yet potentially not holding them to biblical standards, let alone to common ethical standards).

    Thus, it falls on congregations, those paying for tuitions, and all those supporting these things to not support constructs that don’t also support real world consequences for actions. How’s that going? Let me know when that becomes the “Mark“ of a healthy church, institution, etc. as listed and prioritized by those in purported leadership.


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    i just really dig all these outer space photos.

    one of my fantasies is to hang out at a space station, looking out the window at earth way far away. like the justice league’s Watchtower. the quiet dull roar of engines in outer space. the objectivity of being removed from all the clamoring nonsense.

    (and having martian manhunter J’onn J’onzz as my friend)

    ok, i’ll read the actual blog post now.


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    Max,

    Church leaders are reluctant to report ‘real’ membership; it makes their church look like it’s on the decline.
    Nancy(aka Kevlar),

    “What’s the difference between what these SWBTS people are doing and a gambler using someone else’s identity to gamble at a casino??
    …….Other than the fact that SWBTS pretend to be doing it for the advancement of God’s kingdom”
    +++++++++++++++++++

    The Great Commission of dishonesty and outright lying.

    With christian leaders like this i’ll hang out with my agnostic, atheist, and muslim friends and family.

    who’s personal integrity standards don’t permit them to leave a store or restaurant when the receipt undercharged them without alerting staff so they can pay what they owe.


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    elastigirl,

    “…when the receipt undercharged them…”
    +++++++++++++++++++

    no, it wasn’t God.


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    elastigirl: The Great Commission of dishonesty and outright lying.

    The Great Commission is not something that Southern Baptists talk much about these days. When I started out with them, it was in their hearts on on their lips. The Great Commission has been replaced by a Calvinist mission to indoctrinate SBC members in reformed theology, not reach the lost in Jesus’ name.


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    “…But there is more, much more….”
    ++++++++++++++++

    criminy, gadzooks, for squids’ sake, and many other interjections. as i see it, the number one faith tenet of my religion has become “the ends justifies the means” but it’s biblical so no need to wake up from your biblical passive compliant sea cucumber schtick, except to be scared and angry about the political talking points we give you cuz they’re biblical.


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    CMT: Taking out credit cards in employees’ names without their knowledge to pay the seminary’s bills? What is this, identity theft for Jesus?

    For the Kingdom. End justfies the means. Anything goes. In the name of Jesus.

    Which BTW violates the commandment about not taking our Lord’s name in vain.


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    Ava Aaronson: taking our Lord’s name in vain

    = much of the institutional church in America (in both pulpit & pew)


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    Headless Unicorn Guy,

    That is what it is… a “racket”…. Or, “rackettering”…. Which there are big federal laws to attempt to stop..


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    Max,

    More like they use (or should I say misuse) the Lord’s name to feed their own degenerate vanities.


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    Ava Aaronson,

    I think “thou shalt not steal” is more to the point.


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    Nancy2(aka Kevlar): they use (or should I say misuse) the Lord’s name to feed their own degenerate vanities

    which is a form of taking the Lord’s name in vain … not everything called Christian is Christian


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    Sarah (aka Wild Honey),

    “Christians” love to keep their “procedures” in a state of “needing reviewing” otherwise how would they get any chance for “virtue signalling”? A k a designer scandal or designer melodrama; that was why I always hated Laurel & Hardy (who were big on TV over here).


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    Muff Potter,

    JDV,

    “Christians” won’t supplicate for just quality of government (which will have to come through busy politicians), which is not ad hominem – oh and it is the one thing that is called for by the Bible more than anything else – and then they intrude into our underwear, and they normalise lying and thieving having started by stealing the Bread of Life from the lips of infants, and nothing is more ad hominem than those behaviours.

    In England a “contractor” for “changing behaviours by acting against nature” is now advertising. Established church authorities were reported as springing on us with 10 days notice, an unjustifiable modification to the coronation occasion, then a few days later it was reported to be all a mistake, like one of those revolving door farces. Never mind bait – just switch switch switch.

    John Stott’s arrogance and Carl Henry’s materialist “Moral Majority” have sunk the entire world. There was always a lot of “evangelising” in flower arranging and evensong. Because there is going to be more switching. Once the Sills and SWBTS tendency cement ascendancy they will flaunt indulgence with women but will still hate boys.


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    elastigirl: Great Commission of dishonesty and outright lying

    “Dissembling” (TM), a jesuitist method: Jesus and Paul wax doleful lest anyone foreordain themselves to loss through it. The “hidden security feature” in plain sight in Jesus’ Commission is “verse B”, namely “teaching them everything I have instructed you” which we need to infer, but “christians” won’t infer.

    1 – Whatever the meaning of “eternal” – and it’s likely this is meant “literally” – it also has meanings as hyperbole. In a parallel we were told stories in which “they lived happily every after” except that they probably additionally had sadness as it is a sad world, or lost their grip like Solomon. (No need to bind ourselves to those that lose their grip.)

    2 – Pie Jesu qui tollis peccata mundi – our prior works – this makes possible salvation to be in the future. Protestants (and catholics) no longer advertise “assurance” as that would give the game away.

    3 – In the slogan “not yet already” do they mean no hurry about the (subsequent to belief) works worthy? Without belief it’s impossible to please God because that’s the only way they’ll get to offer a gospel to little ones.

    Why would the REAL Bible put an actual phrase “once saved always saved” when such a phrase never made sense in logic, relativity or mechanics. Predestination is for those who buy into God’s Son buying in, and He wills that to be everyone, even those hitherto high handed.

    The world cannot be fixed, but interventions of God or good angels are very frequent, often small looking. When did you last hear someone recommend a prayer and thanks be said for your guardian angel? Beware the ferment of the Pharisees. God says what He is saying by not saying what He is not saying.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm-yJpcFSss

    Souparnika Nair-O Holy Night (BBC Look East Live Recording)

    Look at the happy face of the TV announcer!


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    Michael in UK: fixed

    In the non-colloquial sense.


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    If I was a member of the leadership team at Saddleback Baptist Church I’d seriously ask whether our church would really want to challenge the decision the SBC made to expel from the Convention after reading this.


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    The SBC is done … it just hasn’t quit yet.


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    Adrian Romano,

    Saddleback is big. I’m sure members there have contributed to renovating those high-end homes and offices. Not to mention the housekeeping and kitchen staff at Pecan Manner (ICYDY: a mansion- home for the president of SWBTS).
    ……nice dinners, travel expenses, Armani suits……


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    Nancy2(aka Kevlar),

    And how does this differ from the old feudal system of religion?
    Answer:
    It doesn’t.


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    Michael in UK,

    “Dissembling” (TM), a jesuitist method: Jesus and Paul wax doleful lest anyone foreordain themselves to loss through it.”
    ++++++++++++++++++++

    can you put this plainly?
    ———

    “The “hidden security feature” in plain sight in Jesus’ Commission is “verse B”, namely “teaching them everything I have instructed you” which we need to infer, but “christians” won’t infer.”
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++

    can you put this plainly, too?


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    As I reflect on this post, and so much on TWW I am struck by the inherit corruption of SBC….
    Lets take Jimmy Hurt, for example…. There at least now 3 independent incidents of “questionable” actions by just him alone…. 1) Speaking at good old Ravi’s massage parlor, 2) his sexual abuse of the wife of a fellow “full time Christian worker”, and 3) Dee’s comment above that there is “questionable finacial”actions..

    Sigh…. How many times has be pounded into my head that we should behave in way that does not “look bad the name of Christ”…. I.e. I don’t drink or dance, or go with girls that do…


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    Nancy2(aka Kevlar): high-end homes and offices … housekeeping and kitchen staff … nice dinners, travel expenses, Armani suits …

    Makes a widow want to think twice before she drops her mite into the offering plate.


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    Muff Potter: And how does this differ from the old feudal system of religion?
    Answer:
    It doesn’t.

    True.


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    elastigirl,

    1 – mental reservation

    2 – The actual Great Commission occupies two parts of a verse, part A and part B, only the first part of which gets quoted (but the second of which I have quoted).


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    Nick Bulbeck: Wartburg national sport of cricket

    If only Ravi had stuck to the game, when he was 17 and left hospital.


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    Muff Potter: And how does this differ from the old feudal system of religion?
    Answer:
    It doesn’t.

    You’re correct on this, Muff.


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    Max,

    And I didn’t even list the catering services, the Italian loafers, the chauffeurs, the watches, the hotel rooms ….. and the wives have to be dressed to the nines and well fed, too.
    Spreading the “gospel” is not a mission; not a divine calling, but a career…. and for some, a lucrative career with a plethora of fringe benefits.


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    Jeffrey Chalmers: As I reflect on this post, and so much on TWW I am struck by the inherit corruption of SBC….
    Lets take Jimmy Hurt, for example…. There at least now 3 independent incidents of “questionable” actions by just him alone…. 1) Speaking at good old Ravi’s massage parlor, 2) his sexual abuse of the wife of a fellow “full time Christian worker”, and 3) Dee’s comment above that there is “questionable financial ”actions..

    May the stories be told to set the record straight.

    “I’m afraid of untold stories. I’m afraid that we will not be able to tell all the truths.”

    Reporter Natalie Sedletska has stayed in Ukraine to report on the war.

    We also should fear not the truth but that the truth be obfuscated and untold. Therein lies the danger. Lies and deception are dangerous. The truth sets us free.


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    Gus: How can anyone take out a loan, get a credit card, open a bank account without the person respnsible for paying the bills showing up in person and presenting a valid ID?

    Some things are just too easy and convenient in the U.S., for the perpetrators of ID fraud, that is.

    I’m quite happy that my country is old-fashioned enough not to allow this.

    I had to cancel a credit card (the one credit card I use all the time and pay off every month) today because someone used it in an attempt to buy a ticket on Taiwan’s High Speed Rail. (Hey I didn’t know Taiwan had a high speed rail, something to think about for a future trip to Asia…) So annoying. That said, the bank which issued the credit card has a pretty spiffy algorithm which identifies fraudulent transactions very quickly.

    Going back to Patterson, I’m reminded that he tried to redirect a $15 million foundation (which was to go half to Baylor and half to SWBTS) to his personally-controlled Sandy Creek Foundation. That got settled out of court. Additionally, Patterson was up to his eyeballs involved in buying six Dead Sea Scrolls fragment using money (unknown amount, but presumed to be in the hundreds of thousands or millions) obtained from a donor/SWBTS trustee. I also learned that after Patterson left SWBTS, he apparently took documents that properly belonged to SWBTS, as well as some of the big game trophies which were apparently left to SWBTS by a supporter and hunter.

    Patterson treated SWBTS as his own little fiefdom, and based on the info posted here, it looks like his successor did the same. *shakes head* Yikes.


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    Sarah (aka Wild Honey): Didn’t Wells Fargo do something similar and get their hands slapped for it?

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wells_Fargo_cross-selling_scandal#:~:text=The%20CFPB%20fined%20Wells%20Fargo,consultant%20to%20review%20its%20procedures.

    Why yes. I know something about this. And it’s more than a hand slap. Billions have gone out in fines and restitution, and Wells Fargo is not permitted to grow at all until this mess is cleaned up. And the government is dead serious about the “not grow at all” part. (It was quite the memorable headache for me one day at work.) It’s been almost seven years since it became very clear that the retail banking side had been up to SHENANIGANS.

    That said, given how much the Fed and the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency is all up in the business of the half-dozen largest banks in the USA, they’re not likely to fail any time soon. The SBC, the SWBTS, IMB, all the other orgs would just *hate* being in the crosshairs of banking regulators. If they had to treat the widow’s mite like Other People’s Money, they’d be a lot more careful with it!

    /tax the churches


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    Muslin, fka Dee Holmes,
    The SBC ………… would just *hate* being in the crosshairs of banking regulators. If they had to treat the widow’s mite like Other People’s Money, they’d be a lot more careful with it!

    Ahhhh, the SBC. When it comes to women with titles of pastor, deacon, elder, etc, those issues must be condemned and controlled by the SBC at the national level – prohibited in ALL SBC affiliated churches.
    But, when it comes to abuse in SBC affiliated churches and seminaries, the SBC wants to make sure those little dalliances remain local ….. LOCAL……responsibilities.
    You see, if abuse gets elevated to the national level, the SBC entities fear they might face multiple lawsuits and lose a few zillion of those widows mites and Other People’s Monies that they have managed to accrue through pew peons’ tithing and sacrificial giving.
    It truly is all about the Benjamins…… and lording it over women.


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    Muslin, fka Dee Holmes,

    Such a great “Example of Christ”……. triple sigh..


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    Jeffrey Chalmers: Such a great “Example of Christ”……. triple sigh..

    Apparently, only narcissists, charlatans, con artists, great pretenders, theo-mafia and assorted other whackos achieve elite status in SBC leadership.


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    re: credit card matter–

    This level of incompetence opens the door for the seminary and/or credit card manager for possible contract violations or legal issues.

    He was very kind, but it’s not incompetence. It’s fraud.


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    Max: Apparently, only narcissists, charlatans, con artists, great pretenders, theo-mafia and assorted other whackos achieve elite status in SBC leadership.

    Only when you are completely broken to The System will you be permitted to advance within The System.


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    Max: “… they fudged the numbers …”

    Which is actually a common problem within SBC.

    JUST LIKE SCIENTOLOGY!


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    Michael in UK: 1 – mental reservation

    And Barthians (which fundamentalists are) would call it “sublate” (a word they got from Hegel).


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    elastigirl: whose personal integrity standards don’t permit them to leave a store or restaurant when the receipt undercharged them without alerting staff so they can pay what they owe.

    That was something that made a big impression on me when I was a kid – our family (5) ate out at a restaurant, and they only charged us for 4 meals. When my Dad realized (while paying), he did alert the staff and had the 5th meal added on. Impressionable people are watching your actions!


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    readingalong: Impressionable people are watching your actions!

    … and are amazed when someone displays honesty and integrity in the public arena (increasingly rare).


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    readingalong,

    no doubt.

    honesty just feels great – the way i imagine jeans and shoes designed for one’s unique shape would feel. (with cushy socks)


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    Yesterday, promise of a comprehensive report on “audited financials” and “presidential expenses” of both the Patterson and Greenway regimes at the seminary, 2003-2022.

    “Statement of Danny Roberts, chairman of Southwestern Seminary Board of Trustees”
    “I state publicly and without equivocation my personal repudiation of the allegations made against my colleagues and me, as well as against staff members of the seminary.”

    https://swbts.edu/news/statement-of-danny-roberts-chairman-of-southwestern-seminary-board-of-trustees/

    “the chairman [Danny Roberts] upon the request of the president [David Dockery] called a meeting of the full board of trustees, which was held today in executive session.”

    “two staff members whose personal morality was egregiously and baselessly questioned were able to speak and share about the harm that has resulted”

    “the Board unambiguously expresses its support and complete confidence in Michele Smith and Colby Adams and finds the allegations contained in the email from Trustees Andrew Bunnell and Aaron Sliger of financial mismanagement and misbehavior amongst those individuals to be without merit”

    “the board unreservedly repudiates as unsubstantiated and egregious other rumors trafficked by Trustees Andrew Bunnell and Aaron Sliger made against employees of the Seminary”

    “the Board of Trustees requests that the officers of the board conduct an investigation of possible misconduct by Andrew Bunnell and Aaron Sligar”

    “it was the growing involvement of trustee leadership and our insistence of greater presidential accountability and resistance to our attempts to implement financial safeguards that led to Adam Greenway’s resignation”

    “the Board of Trustees authorize the officers to publish the audited financials as one comprehensive report for the fiscal years 2003-2022 and examples of presidential expenses”


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    Jerome,

    1 – Why aren’t trustees supposed to hold full meetings all along and why wasn’t it them – especially Andrew Bunnell and Aaron Sligar – that were insisting on this?

    2 – Are president Dockery, together with Michele Smith and Colby Adams proposing to place themselves open to inspection by a non-profits regulator and IRS?

    Your constitutional amendment, far from favouring religions, intends to not favour one religion over another, and hence any religion over other non-profits.