Dee 3/29/23
“I created a vision of David in my mind and simply carved away everything that was not David.” Michelangelo
I have often found it odd how I happen to be in places where controversy erupts. I promise that I am not usually the subject of said controversy. This last week, while traveling in Italy, I posted this tweet.
Tallahassee Charter School parents think Michelangelo’s David is pornography.
So what in the world happened in Tallahassee to make me take time out to comment? Here it is in a nutshell. The Tallahassee Charter School, a Christian school, had a lesson in classical art for a 6th-grade class. One of the parents complained that some of the art was “pornographic.” According to the Tallahassee Democrat in Hillsdale cuts ties with Tallahassee Classical, revokes curriculum license after art outcry.
Former Tallahassee Classical principal Hope Carrasquilla was asked to resign or be fired at a last-minute board meeting in mid-March after parents complained about an art lesson about the renaissance period, which showed sixth graders Michelangelo’s sculpture “David” and the “Creation of Adam” fresco painting and Boticelli’s “Birth of Venus.”
She noted that Tallahassee Classical board chair Barney Bishop had been critical of her tenure in the last year, but said the parent complaints about the art project were the catalyst for Bishop’s ultimatum: to resign or be fired.
This was a 6th-grade class! Don’t boys and girls know what the human body looks like at that age? If they don’t, then something is wrong. Here is NBC reporting on this incident that got worldwide coverage.
This story dumbfounded Italy.
According to the BBC Italian art experts astonished by David statue uproar in Florida.
Cecilie Hollberg, director of Galleria dell’Accademia, has now issued the invitation to the class.
She said the principal should be “rewarded, not punished”.
“Talking about the Renaissance without showing the David, an undisputed icon of art and culture and of that historical period, would make no sense,” Ms Hollberg said.…The statue, one of the most famous in Western history, depicts the biblical David going to fight Goliath armed only with a sling and his faith in God.
…The mayor of Florence, Dario Nardella, also invited the teacher who showed the students the image of Michelangelo’s David to visit the city and its works of art.
“Mistaking art for pornography is simply ridiculous,” he tweeted. “Art is civilisation and those who teach it deserve respect.”
Even Hillsdale College is not amused.
The Miami Herald explains an interesting side story to the controversy in The David isn’t pornographic, though Italy’s offer to Florida is about exposure — to education | Opinion.
Nor is it about the school itself, which follows a curriculum designed by Hillsdale College — a conservative Christian school in Michigan — that has become a lightning rod for the woke wars.
But Hillsdale is having none of this nonsense. According to the Christian Post, Hillsdale cuts ties with charter school after parents liken Michelangelo’s ‘David’ to porn.
A renowned private Christian college in Michigan has severed its ties with a Florida charter school after the principal was forced to resign when parents complained that students were exposed to pornography during a lesson on Renaissance art that included Michelangelo’s “David” statue.
The Tallahassee Classical School had a license to use Hillsdale College’s K-12 curricular materials, but it has since been revoked and will expire at the end of the school year.
…In response to a request for comment from The Christian Post, a spokesperson for Hillsdale College provided its public statement from spokeswoman Emily Stack Davis saying its partnerships with schools are “founded upon a mutual understanding about the aims of education.”
…She added: “To set the record straight: This drama around teaching Michelangelo’s ‘David’ sculpture, one of the most important works of art in existence, has become a distraction from, and a parody of, the actual aims of classical education. Of course, Hillsdale’s K-12 art curriculum includes Michelangelo’s ‘David’ and other works of art that depict the human form.”
Well, Dee found Micahaelangelo’s David spiritually moving. I loved looking at the sling on David’s shoulder and imagining his victory over Goliath. I was engrossed as I learned about Michelangelo’s difficulties in carving this wonder. One of his students evidently screwed up cutting out the area for the hands, which is why they look so big. Michelangelo had to work with what he was given. He was a genius! Those parents need to grow up and teach their children better. Maybe they need a field trip to Italy?
And sometimes fellow Christians can embarrass us with their goofiness.
Another example for the ‘world’ of why not to take ‘Christianity’ seriously. And teaching kids that the human body is something to be ashamed of is another travesty…
I feel like old timey actor Edward G. Robinson in the film Soylent Green, the scene where he weeps into his hands saying:
“How did we come to this?”
“Don’t look, Ethel!”
This is utterly ridiculous. Perhaps there would be some wisdom in giving parents the heads up? But to be so upset about the human body is actually to be ashamed of Gods design. I think 6th graders are old enough to comprehend human anatomy and these uptight parents better get ready for the godless society that awaits their children. This is really embarassing to other believers.
I read that another charter school in Florida decided a 15th?? century Madonna and Child painting was “not family friendly” because the mother didn’t “look happy”!!
Article dated April 1is in journal Hypoallergenic. School official claims the painting is “hostile to family values.”
(The date the article was posted makes it seem like the story might be a joke. But nowadays it’s increasingly difficult to decide whether a story is real or a joke)
And yet there are preachers in pulpits going on and on, dressing down women and such – not so artfully.
Saw this article which seems to have the flavor of some the macho preacher boys in the way they treat women – also not artfully. If you care to take a look, what do you think?
https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-barstool-sports-culture-of-online-hate-they-treat-sexual-harassment-and-cyberbullying-as-a-game?ref=home
Well, I guess these parents would really be impressed with the art work in the Sistine Chapel!!!
Good grief. Walk through the doors of the Art Institute of Chicago and you will see a row of statuary dating from about 100 BC to 100 AD. Many leave nothing to the imagination. There are also unclothed sculptures by Matisse and Rodin as well. And goodness, look at all those awful paintings of nudes!! Terrible!!
Are we saying there’s something wrong with the human body that God created? Yet another example of why the world thinks Christians are nuts and not to be taken seriously.
Nah… too Catholic.
surely there is no more relative concept than what is modest & what is erotic in the social systems of humanity past & present.
even comparing the 1970’s to now. my friend from a very conservative country overseas was shocked at how i dressed as a kid (in photos). it was a total nothing at the time. I still consider it a nothing.
my extended family and friends in europe are totally relaxed around the human body, at beaches, etc.
I’m going to be controversial and state that I can empathize with the charter school parents, because I used to be there, too. BUT that’s because I grew up on the fringes of purity culture and absorbed a lot of its negative influences. Just to demonstrate how extreme my thinking was, as a teen and young adult I was also uncomfortable being around pregnant women, even married ones, because it was a clear indication they’d been doing the you-know-what.
Completely unhealthy and narrow-minded, I realize this now. But when you’re steeped in the “immoral sex is the worstest of all the worst sins” and “be careful of the slippery slope” and “if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out” philosophies, then EVERYTHING is viewed through the lens of sex. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, and even art that celebrates the human body that God Himself created and called “very good” becomes pornography.
Just my (fig leaf covered) two cents.
What? You mean Mary the mother of Jesus wasn’t “Keeping sweet” or keeping up appearances for the spectators? For shame!
But seriously, some people are really into plastic faith. People can’t be real. They have to play a part, play a role. That is what Christianity has become to so many. Fake, fake, fake. Which is sad and completely unhelpful to anyone inside or outside the faith.
Nothing to see here, it’s been going on for centuries – Pope Julius II, Council of Trent and “The Fig Leaf” Campaign.
https://medium.com/lessons-from-history/vaticans-fig-leaf-campaign-ac86884b87a9
From Frank Schaeffer’s book “Crazy for God”:
How nice it would be if everyone could go on vacation to Rome.
If someone is using language like “pornographic” to describe Michelangelo’s David, I suspect they either don’t know what that word means, or they have another agenda.
The coverage mentions the school’s commitment to “parents’ rights” and quotes a school board member (?) saying that parents’ rights trump everything else in education, and dismissing the expertise of teachers. I suspect the consternation over nude Renaissance art is a “fig leaf” for something else. Christian education can be a political and cultural minefield on multiple levels, and it looks like this principal found that out the hard way. Of course, she may have the last laugh, since the school has been exposed to public criticism and lost its curriculum license over this.
You have to be a certain age to get that reference!
This flap reminds me of the time that a professor of art history at a local university preached a guest sermon at church. Of course he incorporated power point images of several historically significant art pieces to illustrate some of his points. Of course the David statue was included. Of course he was required to add a blackout block over the statue’s most objectionable region. I’m not sure if Dr. M. was ever invited to give a guest sermon at that church again!
Remember, this is the CHRISTIAN State of Florida under CHRISTIAN Governor DeSantis.
Again, CHRISTIAN obsession with Pelvic Issues.
You’d think they were all Nymphomaniacs like Deep Throat Driscoll.
Freud would have a field day analyzing this.
British SF author Simon Morden calls this “Fantasy Christianity”.
https://bookofmorden.co.uk/essays/sex-death-and-christian-fiction/
I’m glad you escaped that brutal and crushing system (fundagelicalism).
But how may others not so lucky, are still languishing in the Christian ‘gulag’ so to speak?
As quoted by Ray Stevens:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YM
Count me among the goofiest. Dirty is dirty whether labelled fine art or porn. And I just don’t care for “art” or a trip to McD’s where anyone’s who hah is hanging out.
As this seems to be turning into another “let’s blame those who hold to Reformed/Calvinist/Evangelical faith and doctrine”, I pointed out earlier that another, more powerful church had expressed identical views and, surprise, surprise, that was ignored.
If you had read the article you would have seen that it is claimed that Michaelangelo was trying to express David’s inner beauty by illustrating his outward beauty. It’s a specious claim given that this wasn’t Adam in his perfect Edenic character but David, after the Fall and after his own spectacular failures.
TWW should declare that it is a fact-free, history-free zone with a penchant for attacking that part of the Church they don’t like. Brotherly love, like facts, has been thrown out the window. And this is the week leading up to Christ’s crucifixion. Why did He die? Why did He rise again? Where is He now and who did He take with Him? All the answers are there to be found, even the ones you disagree with.
Happy Easter brethren!
…. but it was too late. She’d done been mooned…..”
I’m kinda partial to “The Mississippi Squirrel Revival”. More accurate now than ever.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K16fG1sDagU
I just don’t get the uproar over the statue of David.
I’ve seen multiple coloring books and children’s Bible story books that contain images of Adam and Eve -standing close together, no less- almost nude ……. no full frontal nudity, but danged near it. I’ve watched 3 and 4 year-olds color oh-so-close to barely covered certain body parts……
I’ve even had, and still do have several of those books in my possession.
And there are images of David holding up a sword with his foot on Goliath’s body – Absolom’s dead body, hanging in a tree – a bloody Jesus, nailed to the cross…….
Sarah (aka Wild Honey),
Unfortunately, I completely understand what “Wild honey” is saying..
Luckyforward,
LOLOLOL
tomke,
Good night!
I beg to differ: “One of his students evidently screwed up cutting out the area for the hands, which is why they look so big. Michelangelo had to work with what he was given.”
Many complained that the right hand was too big and overdeveloped. But this represents the hand of a man with the strength of God on his side. No mere boy could slay the giant. But David, powered by God, could…and did.
Seriously? SMH
Lowlandseer,
They pointed out some sculptures in which this happened.
Gus,
Great quote.
linda,
Does this include any unclothed piece of art including a mother nursing her child?
I was actually at the exhibit and heard the explanation given by one who works in the famous Accademia Gallery Museum in Florence.
Also, my tweet on the matter was retweeted by another traveler on your side of the Calvin divide but they agreed with me. I offered the article since it was another POV, as I often do.
You must really enjoy TWW to stick around. We enjoy you as well.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar): Luckyforward:
“Don’t look, Ethel!”
…. but it was too late. She’d done been mooned…..”
Excellent Ray Stevens references!
“…he’s gonna give us a peek!”
I actually toured with him in the 90’s – Ray Stevens that is, not David ;-). Those songs never got old.
Nor do I ‘get it’.
It’s probably a new thing amongst rabid fundagelicals.
A new bauble for their ‘cultural war’.
What will they bemoan next, Wonder Woman’s outfit?
the list grows longer of what fundamentalist-evangelicals approve of everytime they support trumpism – or ‘the new facism’ – all the while looking ‘away from’ the antics of The Donald who is held as ‘God-appointed’.
I guess the people in this group still need from time to time to reinforce that ‘they are moral’ in spite of the behaviors of the ‘New King Cyrus’,
but their antics don’t fool me one bit,
they have chosen whom to follow, and he comes with more baggage than they can ‘excuse’ or want to excuse, but is that not WHY he is ‘worshipped’? He offers to ‘save America’
through the burning of books, the destruction of norms, the contempt for the rule of law, and he promises retribution against his ‘enemies’ as soon as he is ‘back in office’.
Perhaps the brou-ha-ha over the statue of David is a way to distract us from their true mission?
They will have to do better than this.
Classic art is outside of their league to ‘judge’ as they cannot even ‘see through’ the evil of a facist wannabe for a ‘leader’ (God-appointed at that!)
sorry for rant, but enough is enough
Muff Potter,
I dunno. Botticelli’s “The Birth of Venus” shows more skin……. but I’ll betcha Wonder Woman is better known in most of the US. But, since “David” was the subject of the complaint involving a class on classic art, I can’t help but lean toward “Venus”…… to boot, she’s not even in the Bible.
Activists cannot live without a Holy Cause.
When they destroy one target, they find another and shift fire to the next.
Lather, Rinse, Repeat,
Lather, Rinse, Repeat,
Lather, Rinse, Repeat…
In the words of the prophet Petra:
WITCH HUNT
One, two, three, four!
How about a little fire, Scarecrow?
Everybody, look
There’s a new bandwagon in town
Hop on board
And let the wind carry you around
Seems like there’s not enough
To keep us busy till the Lord comes back
Don Quixote’s gotta have
Another windmill to attack
We’re on another witch hunt
Looking for evil
Wherever we can find it
Off on a tangent
Hope the Lord won’t mind it
Another witch hunt
Takin’ a break
From all our gospel labor
On a crusade
But we forgot our saber
Witch hunt!
Witch hunt!
There’s a new way
To spend all our energies
We’re up in arms
Instead of down on our knees
Walkin’ over dollars
Trying to find another dime
Never mind the souls
‘Cause we really haven’t got the time
We’re on another witch hunt
Looking for evil
Wherever we can find it
Off on a tangent
Hope the Lord won’t mind it
Another witch hunt
Takin’ a break
From all our gospel labor
On a crusade
But we forgot our saber
Witch hunt!
Witch hunt!
Witch hunt!
Witch hunt!
So send out the dogs
And tally ho
Before we sleep tonight
We’ve got miles to go
No one is safe
No stone is left unturned
And we won’t stop
‘Til somebody gets burned
Bro Bro Bro Bro Bro Bro Brothers
Another witch hunt
Looking for evil
Wherever we can find it
Off on a tangent
Hope the Lord won’t mind it
Another witch hunt
Takin’ a break
From all our gospel labor
On a crusade
But we forgot our saber
Witch hunt!
Witch hunt!
(I’ll get you my little pretty)
Witch hunt!
(And your little dog, too!)
(AH-HA-HA-HA!)
Witch hunt!
(Look under all the rocks!)
(And all the trees!)
Witch hunt
(Look everywhere!)
(Till we find that old witch!)
Witch hunt!!!
I’m not a gambling man but I would still bet the same people disgusted by David are incensed at hijab and can’t see the irony.
They’ll probably also hate the incredible warmth of Dee’s smile in the picture.
Unfair to say florida is “christian” and take a stab at Desantis in the above comments. We have no clue what Desantis wpuld say and a cheap political shot at a conservative.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
Love Mississippi song. As an Uber driver I have many riders who are not from the South and they cannot see the humor in that song.
Some of us simply don’t have the time to check in and comment here several times a day and are only just now reading the article you linked to.
The original post said nothing about Reformed/Calvinist/Evangelical theology. It used the generic word “Christian,” as have the vast majority of the comments. Why are you feeling picked on?
Granted, I used the term “purity culture,” which is prevalent in evangelical circles, but is also not a defining characteristic. And it is also present in fundamentalist Islam and Judaism, among others, so I, for one, am hardly singling out your personal theologies.
And please hold the complaints about people here ignoring history. I have a degree in it. And there are a number of other regular commenters who also periodically bring up something of historical significance.
Oh I’m certain that zealots could find a way to turn Venus into:
“Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth”
With a good gift-o’-gab and good propaganda skills, just about anything can be manufactured from the Bible.
In my opinion, DeSantis thinks entirely too highly of himself. He honestly thought he was going to outwit Disney and its army of lawyers? That’s *hubris*.
As for pr0n or dirty pictures or whatever, I might point out that there is some shockingly graphic language in the Bible. I won’t give examples, but it’s not too hard to find. Personally, I wish conservative Christians didn’t spend so much time harping on sex, sexuality, sex roles, etc., etc., to the exclusion of just about every other sin under the sun. If that happened, maybe people could just look at a David or the Madonna Litta by da Vinci and just admire the artistic talent instead of thinking it’s always about sex. Personally, I like the “Ceiling of the Camera degli Sposi” by Andrea Manteigna. It’s a trompe l’oeil painting with a few people, several naked putti and a peacock looking down into the room. The illusion of thinking you’re looking up into the sky and seeing all these creatures and people looking down at you is very well executed and it’s amusing. What are these creatures doing up there?
MOD: Please don’t try and slip past our filters by mis-spelling words. It is against the rules here. Thanks. GBTC
Lowlandseer,
Calvinist and Roman theology are identical in essentials (theocracy), though the Romans’ is alternately dissembling and wavering. Both are typified by William James and Heidegger, seeing us as means only. (I come at it from a Trinitarian henotheistic agnostic angle.)
I can see that De Santis is not like that at all, but his opponents who are also like it can’t think of anyone any other way.
Michaelangelo carved in the Mannerist not realist style. The proportions are weird (no reason not to show it off in a museum however).
In my young day children’s books available in corner newsagents had line drawings or photograps of all the traditional art.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
Venuses are always afforded a handy shell – assuming they’ve been allowed to keep their arms.
Bravo! And I offered that quote based on the nonsense that in many parts of the church, anything remotely associated with sex is automatically “sin”, but it’s fine to gossip, backbite, etc. as long as it’s in God’s name . . .
It’s a stunning study of the human form. Intricate artwork. I enjoy looking at art just to marvel at the skills of the artist.
Just wondering, like so much “Christian” art, it amazes me how European everyone looks. By their nature the art reflects the culture of the artists.
The Renaissance led us into the enlightenment. The art of the Renaissance held the kernel of free thought that led us to the liberal democracy that we enjoy here in North America.
We are all naked under our clothes….
dee–actually, yes. Somethings are so gobsmackingly beautifully created by God that they need, no deserve, to be treated with reverence. I don’t need to see a woman’s nipple nor a man’s penis to appreciate the skill of the Master, the skill of the human artist, nor the wonder and beauty of the world He created.
But some things just should not be flaunted. Sort of like sex between a husband and wife. It belongs exactly there, not filmed and shown to the world to appreciate the beauty, nor carved in stone for that matter.
It isn’t about the purity culture or the Reformed or fundamentalists. I dare say our LCMS pastor would not want the statue on our church property for that matter either.
We have lost our reverence and seem hell bent on cheapening everything.
We have lost our reverence.
I used the David statue as a sermon illustration a few years ago. I think I was illustrating how a master craftsman could carve something transcendent out of materials that others found worthless (the block of marble had been laying around for decades because it had some flaws).
I got no pushback, other than one couple who said they felt a little uncomfortable since I left it up on the big screen for like 10 minutes.
linda,
You must go to an extraordinary McDonald’s.
The Unpardonable Sin is ALWAYS the OTHER Guy’s Sin.
“THEE, NOT MEEEEEEEEEE!”
Especially in the original languages (Classical Hebrew and Koine Greek, NOT Kynge Jaymes Englyshe).
This isn’t YouTube, where everyone speaks in elaborate circumlocutions to get around The Algorithm.
To the point it’s as stilted as Newspeak, Marxspeak, or Christianese.
Once again, the Christianese tunnel vision on Pelvic Issues.
Well, they turned St Mary into the Whore of Babylon – Remember Operation Ice Castle and all those anti-Catholic books and tracts dating back to the Reformation Wars?
And according to Metatraon, the Classical Latin pronunciation of “Venus” is “WAY-noose”.
Well, when you’ve turned funerals into Happy Clappy Joy Joy “Homegoing Celebrations” where everybody’s SMIIIIIING OR Else…
Indeed it did.
In the Bible there is no such thing as The Rights of Man or the idea of representative government.
You (generic you in the Bible) are at the whim and fancy of some Earthly potentate, up to and including the great Kahuna in the sky.
I think (my opinion) that this tension with what they (fundagelicals) read in their Bibles, and what we enjoy under our liberal democracy is at odds with and messes with their heads.
With or without the dodges like the Kentucky Creation Museum, where Adam & Eve are shown waist-deep in water (i.e. only from the waist up) with Eve’s long tresses strategically positioned to hide her boobage?
Something about a mysterious linkage in the brain of Activistus Moralus Offendicus:
You will ALWAYS find Pro-one and Anti-the other – Pro-Sex and Anti-Violence or Anti-Sex and Pro-Violence – together, NEVER Pro-both or Anti-both. A moral crusade against one is always linked to worship of the other.
Daniel Jepsen,
Thank you for your comment. I wonder why they were uncomfortable after 10 minutes but not after 2 minutes.
John Berry,
Thank you for your kind comment. It has been rather cold over here, so I’m glad my smile was warm.
And yet the movie “The Passion of the Christ” is not considered indecent. Some churches urge people to watch it once a year, just before Easter. In isolated cases, congregations have been tricked into watching it. (I avoid violent movies, and have never seen this one.)
Somehow nobody pushes back against Hollywood faux hyper-violence against an actor playing the role of Jesus. The peer pressure to watch the film is all the more disturbing, given that Christians are raised to be very aware of Jesus’ wounds. Reading the Biblical account is vivid enough for me.
Friend–you must not be familiar with the culture or lack thereof around the Lake of the Ozarks.
I think there is middle ground between being an exhibitionist and an a prude. Flaunting your body and nursing a child are two different things. It seems some are stuck in black vs. white. Jesus seemed to present many parables on issues that are not so black vs. white to make a point.
And that’s fair. Nothing “goofy” about being uncomfortable with depictions of nudity. That’s a personal and a cultural preference.
This story, though, seems to have people jumping from “that piece of art makes me uncomfortable” to “this person should lose her job because I am uncomfortable” (not saying you’re doing that, btw). IMO, that is the goofy part- that grown adults old enough to have 11 or 12 year old kids are apparently having conniptions over this. Adults should be capable of working things out when people’s preferences come into conflict. What kind of conflict resolution is this school modeling for their students?
Take a long trip to Europe and visit different countries. There many art works with nudity displayed in public places. They art pieces to the people who lived there, not porn nor “dirty” culturally.
It is in US fundamentalists and purity circles that doctrines believers’ minds to have this black and white thinking on ALL things about human body.
Theologically, shouldn’t christians see the whole body with dignity and respect without shame?
Shame of our body is an effect after the fall and Jesus has redeemed our shame.
linda,
Linda, I can respect that people vary in their abilities to accept artistic nudity, yes. But admittedly, when I read your post I thought first of Michaelangelo’s Sistine Chapel and also of the stunning statue of David and I thought, as with all art, we bring ourselves to a work of art and there is a ‘dialogue’ at work;
so for me, in certain circumstances, I can view artistic nudity in the context of a great work of art and am not offended, as the ‘whole’ is contemplated more with wonder at its excellence than out of viewing portions in isolation as ‘unacceptable’.
But that is only in the presence of great classical art which when first viewed, has its own powerful dignity that any nudity therein does not, cannot diminish.
We are all entitled to our own feelings, and I do not wish to diminish your own, nor will I. I may see things in a different light perhaps, but I do respect your own individuality in this matter as it seems meaningful to you.
And a lot of them try to get back to that Godly Dictatorship (with guess who as the Court Favorite State Religion). By Any Means Necessary.
That’s not Secular Humanist Hatefest against Us the Righteous, it’s another example of the linkage between Sex and Violence; Pro-one and Anti-the other.
To me, he looks all mouth and no trousers.
GBTC: There was no intention to evade filters. I have been spelling that word that way since approximately 1994, when AOL got access to the Internet and AOLers invaded Usenet and asked where they could find porn. The joke was that they misspelled “porn” as “pr0n”. Again, no intention to evade, just using long-time Internet humor and leetspeak.
You know, I wish someone would write an article or book about that crazy. There were respected (in Charismatic circles) people involved in this “let’s go pray against the Queen of Heaven at the Everest Base Camp” nonsense. (Who does that?) A lot of that stuff has disappeared from the Internet due to link rot, etc.
Same. There is no movie one must watch as an act of faith.
That.
Well, to be fair it was only one couple. Thankfully.
You know, I have not watched this movie either. Despite being a pastor for a couple decades.
I know I could not handle the violence and emotional intensity.
Yeah, not sure. I was a little surprised. They were both in their early 60’s. Great folks, but maybe not very well-travelled and exposed to a lot of different art and cultures.
I remember those idiots back then, any chance they got, they’d denigrate the Mother of God. I have always revered Mary as the Mother of God even way back in the day when I was a Calvary Chapel bot. I was even admonished by one of their ‘pastors’ that my veneration of Mary (and I’m not even Catholic) borders on idolatry.
I wish that I had the courage back then to have told him where he could stick his rebuke.
And before the Prophets of the NAR, I have only heard of the term “Queen of Heaven” as an honorific of St Mary.
But to Biblical Manhood and Womanhood, even she is “just a woman”.
I remember the uproar when Mel Gibson’s film hit the theaters.
Christians went gaga over it as a Witnessing Tool against the Heathens, telling Christians to pack Gospel tracts into the theater and start looking for Souls to Save (once the film softened them up).
People couldn’t get in to see it because churches had bought out entire screenings; being told “out of tickets” while all the church busses pulled up all singing hymns. Theaters had to stop selling tickets to groups so everyone else could get in.
Said church busloads (bringing tracts) finding NO heathens in the theater because the churches had bought up all the tickets. And then getting hit with the INTENSITY of the film. They’d come in all eager to Witness and Save Souls only to zombie-walk out in silent shock like everyone else, This Was Your Life and Four Spiritual Laws tracts and sales pitches completely forgotten.
And there were denunciations of “Extra-Biblical” scenes like Veronica’s Veil (which IS a Catholic folk legend/tradition). Guess it was too Romish.
My SIL (whose first language was Assyrian Aramaic) said the Aramaic was correct except for all the American accents.
My writing partner (the burned-out country preacher) went to see it and said “I just saw the best movie I’ve ever seen that I do not want to ever see again.” (As in Too Intense).
Gibson followed Passion with another art film Apocalypto set in pre-Columbian Yucatan (again in the original/period language) that didn’t do so well.
When “The Streak” first hit the airwaves (in the days of AM radios), I kept mishearing the refrain “Boogety! Boogety!” as “Lookithat! Lookithat!” Somehow more appropriate.
Macho Preacher-Boys:
“Just like Stoolies, Except CHRISTIAN(TM)!”
“Stoolies with Bibles!’
P.S. These “Stooiles” remind me a three-year-olds who just heard their first dirty word and can’t stop repeating it.
P.P.S. “Stoolies”? Really?
Remember what “Stool” means in a medical context – actually pretty accurate in this one.
“The warmth of Dee’s smile…
An actual smile, NOT the tetanospasmin rictus of Kenneth Copeland or the smirk of Cee Jay Mahaney.
Headless Unicorn Guy,
Witch hunt huh?
Isn’t that what the Big Orange Cheeto hollers all the time?
In those circles, unauthorized sex is theeeee… worst thing there is.
I thought Apocalypto was well crafted and pretty good.
Unless you’re a ManaGAWD.
Then it becomes a Privilege of Rank.
“TOUCH NOT MINE ANOINTED!”
Mesoamerica in all its grandeur and horror.
And the prophecy fulfilled at the end:
“He will lead you to those who will end your world.”
I never saw it and I have no intention of seeing it on DVD or other media.
I too remember the buzz back when it hit the cineplex, and the insinuation by some that you (generic you) were not a genuine ‘Christian’ unless you went and saw it.
Additionally, at some level there are “human bodies” rather than “THE” human body singular.
It’s as bad to draw attention to big or small proportions.
Fig leaves were sometimes cheerfully nonchalant both in what they didn’t and did hide (if hinting at wide ranges of realistic).
I remember the buzz, too.
Yet another Litmus Test of YOUR Salvation.
Recovery from shock?
Or it just took that long to connect? (Like that Simpsons episode where Bart “doctored” the hymnals at Springfield Community Church; being Simpsons characters, they were five minutes into the first hymn (“In the Garden of Eden” by I Ron Butterfly) before they realized they’d been had. “In a Gadda De Vida, Baby…”)