The Genesis Code,, T4G, CJ Mahaney, Prayer and Twitter

"I am more afraid of my own heart than of the pope and all his cardinals. I have within me the great pope, Self."
                                                                                     Martin Luther



Giant "Twisters" in the Lagoon Nebula Hubble

Giant "Twisters" in the Lagoon Nebula- Hubble


Today marks an important occasion. “On 31 October 1517, Luther wrote to Albert of Mainz, protesting against the sale of indulgences. He enclosed in his letter a copy of his "Disputation of Martin Luther on the Power and Efficacy of Indulgences," which came to be known as The Ninety-Five Theses.” (Wikipedia). This blog is named after the castle in which Martin Luther was sequestered to protect him from the Pope’s murderous intent. In the last 1000 years, we at TWW believe that Luther, more than any other religious leader, profoundly affected the course of human history. Now there was a guy with some staying power!




There is a new movie being released on November 4th called The Genesis Code. We think our readers, who are interested in the creationism wars, might find this movie of interest. We have included a trailer for the movie at the end of this post.

According to the site here:

"The Genesis Code" explores three major issues facing Christians today. One issue is the alleged conflict between religious and scientific explanations for the beginning of the universe. As the film shows, this conflict does not exist. The Biblical and scientific explanations for the beginning of life are totally consistent, but told from different perspectives.

The film also explores the often-ignored story of discrimination against Christians on college campuses. In the film, Kelsey Sanders portrays a talented paleontology student who is pressured to conceal her faith in order to advance in the academic world.

Finally, the film deals with end-of-life issues, as Logan Bartholomew's character fights to prolong the life of his comatose mother when his grandparents attempt to remove her from life support against his wishes and despite the possibility of recovery.”

From what we can tell, this movie offers an interesting perspective on the creation story. The bottom line is this. Creation could have been both a 24-hour, 6 day event and a long term (billions of years) event at the same time. This is the theory of time dilation. Huh?

Let me explain it like this. There was an episode on Star Trek, in which the ship was invaded by a race of people who lived at super high speeds. They moved so quickly, that the Enterprise (or Voyager, I forget) crew, who lived in our space and time, could not perceive their presence. To these aliens, the crew members appeared as if they were standing still. So from our race's perspective, the other group of people lived and died in what seemed like minutes. Yet the aliens lived out a normal life span.

Now, I am hoping some of my friends, who are more scientifically adept, will jump in and save me but this all has something to do with time dilation. So, from God’s end of things, He created the earth in 6 days. But, from our perspective, it took billions of years. It seems like some folks are trying to find a midpoint for this debate. Even if their theory is ultimately rejected, we applaud them for trying. Already some in the YEC crowd are condemning this movie, further proving that it is their way or the highway.

Here is the bottom line from us. Go see it and think.






As you know, TWW has a twitter known as wartwatch. This is an attempt to keep our readers up on some interesting current events.

However, we would also like to encourage our readers on a more personal level.

bidgod-prayer and encouragement

This is a second twitter that will be provided on a Monday-Friday basis. We call it “Surviving life on a tweet and a prayer.” Think of it as a God invasion into your day-to-day life.

This twitter name is based on an old saying “Bidden or not, God is present.” What we propose to do is this. At some point in your day, you will receive a Bible verse or Christian quote. Along with this tweet, comes an assurance that we will be praying specifically for all those who have signed up.

We promise that this tweet will never ask you for anything or provide anything more than an encouragement once a day, Monday through Friday. Since it is only 140 characters, it will only take a few seconds for you to read it. And know this, one of us is praying for you at that moment.

Once again, for those new to the twitter game, here is how it works. For those who have a cell phone with text messaging:

Text the following words Follow bidgod (or Follow wartwatch) to the following number: 404-04
You will receive a message within a minute that you are following this twitter account. You may unsubscribe at anytime.

If you wish to receive this on your computer, please go to and sign up as a new user. You will then receive be able to request to receive bidgod this on your computer.




We care about you, our readers, beyond your comments. When any of you share your personal stories with us, we often wish we could do something to be of support to you. So, we have come up with an idea. Along with our Bible reading at the end of each post, we would like to begin including prayer requests from you.

This blog gets a fair number of hits and we presume that many of them are from Christians. Most Christians, when presented with a prayer request, will often take a moment to pray for that person.

So, here is what we propose. If you would like the TWW family to pray for you, please start a comment with the words “PRAYER REQUEST” in caps so your half blind blog queens can read it. We will then add the request to the bottom of our next post. You may also send us an email request. If for any reason we overlook your request, send us an email.

If this takes off, we may start a prayer request page. Your anonymity will be strictly maintained.



Deleted comments on another blog

We received an interesting email from a reader. Apparently, Tim Challies will not allow any negative comments about his friend, CJ Mahaney, on his blog. He states this in the comment section.He  wrote a post here called Should You Go to T4G? 

Funny thing about all of this is that the coordinator of T4G, Matt Schmucker, was interviewed by Challies in this post. Guess what he said about Mahaney?

“Tim, I have had the privilege to observe CJ publicly and privately through this very public trial. I can report that CJ is taking the reconciliation process very seriously, fully cooperating and humbly submitting to everything asked of him. More importantly, I have been surprised by the grace that is so evident in his life even as he’s digitally fried through anonymous posts. I can assure you that I would not be nearly as gracious. Yes, I expect CJ to be present and a full-fledged participant at T4G 2012. He is exactly the kind of man we want to stand with—together for the gospel.”

So, it appears that Challies will only allow flowery comments about Mahaney on his site. So, it seems that this site willfully ignores the pain of the lost and broken while building up the rich and influential, just like Jesus, right? In other words, folks, the party is over and the judgments are in. Mahaney is cool and the people who are hurt are not welcome. T4G and this blog, among others, are the latest names in image rehab, it seems.

So, this reader decided to approach it in a different way. He submitted Bible verses. Guess what? Bible verses are no longer allowed as well, especially, if by some imagination, they could be applied to hurting people. Of course, if Mr. Challies would like to challenge this reader’s perception of events, he may contact us.

Here is the relevant portion of this reader’s email to us:

"I put this to the test a couple nights ago on the Challies site in comments on "Should you go to T4G?" It seemed to me that Mr Schmucker lied in his statements about CJM and his humble submission, as well as CJM being "digitally fried in anonymous posts" (Lots of non-anonymous people have begged CJM to repent, from what I've seen. But not so with his friends at T4G.)

Then I read the comments, and saw that any comments about said apostle or his flock are strictly "verboten". All, right, I thought… Just what comments ARE permissible? "Just say no? Heavens no, I won't go?"

Those would answer the title question, but I did want to put the blogger to a serious test, so… I remembered Jeremiah. I considered adding Isaiah 30:10, Ezekiel 13:10-16, and Micah 3:5 but decided to be short and sweet. The entire comment: “They have healed the wound of my people lightly, saying, ‘Peace, peace, when there is no peace. Jeremiah 6:14 and 8:11

God's comment was there almost a day, and then– it wasn't. Gone… Just with the touch of a button by Tim or a helper. No refutation, no explanation, no form email explaining "your comment was appreciated but deleted". God's Holy Word, disagreed with and deleted, once again. Although I had fully expected this to happen, I was still surprised at how hurt, shocked, dismayed, and angry I felt.”

So, dear readers, we have decided to keep track of such deletions. If any of you have had something like this occur, on any blog, please let us know. If the story has merit, we might run with it.

Trailer for The Genesis Code



Lydia's Corner: 2 Chronicles 26:1-28:27 Romans 13:1-14 Psalm 23:1-6 Proverbs 20:11


The Genesis Code,, T4G, CJ Mahaney, Prayer and Twitter — 75 Comments

  1. Dee,

    And to think that I had serious concerns before starting this blog that there wouldn’t be enough topics to discuss.

    So much material, so little time…

  2. I just posted this on Challies post, a minute ago. Let’s see how long it lasts:

    Jeremiah 9:4-9 [ESV]

    Let everyone beware of his neighbor, and put no trust in any brother, for every brother is a deceiver, and every neighbor goes about as a slanderer. Everyone deceives his neighbor, and no one speaks the truth; they have taught their tongue to speak lies; they weary themselves committing iniquity. Heaping oppression upon oppression, and deceit upon deceit, they refuse to know me, declares the LORD. Therefore thus says the LORD of hosts: “Behold, I will refine them and test them, for what else can I do, because of my people? Their tongue is a deadly arrow; it speaks deceitfully; with his mouth each speaks peace to his neighbor, but in his heart he plans an ambush for him. Shall I not punish them for these things? declares the LORD, and shall I not avenge myself on a nation such as this?

  3. Hi Dee,

    I have commented here a few times before and wanted to let you know I am the Diane who posted a comment at that article on Challies blog about T4G. You can read Kjos’ reply to me. I responded with a follow up comment which was deleted within an hour. You can see the follow up comment at this link below, as I wrote it as a comment to the article this man wrote about Challies.

  4. N.W. Clerk,

    Where did you post your comment on Tim Challies’ blog? I just checked several of his posts that mention C.J. Mahaney.

  5. Hi Dee,

    I have commented here a few times and wanted to let you know I had a comment deleted from the T4G article. You can read my initial comment there under Diane and Kjos’ reply to me. I wrote a short follow up comment, which was deleted a short time later. You can see my deleted comment at Reformed Anglicanism–the owner of that blog did a story about the commenting practices at Challies and I provided my deleted comment as a comment to his article.

  6. Sorry for the duplicate post–got distracted and then had computer freeze on my end so thought first comment was lost. 🙂

  7. Deb,

    I posted it at the link given above:

    This morning, in response, I have also posted, at the same link:

    “This is my response to my deleted comment, which was a simple posting of Scripture.

    2 Timothy 3:16 [ESV]

    “All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness.”

    – Nat

  8. NW Clark
    Please keep us posted. Let’s see if they think a bit more deeply about the ramifications of deleting Scripture. I will check as well. Thanks for doing this.

  9. Dee, the Star Trek episode you’re referring to is “Wink of An Eye” from 1968. But you’re also correct in thinking that ST:Voyager also had an episode that dealt with sped up time. That episode was titled “Blink of An Eye” in homage to the original series episode with a similar “living life at a faster speed” time premise.

  10. Dee,

    My verse from last night was deleted sometime between last night and this morning. Also, I just discovered that my comment from earlier this morning is no longer up, as well.

    – Nat

  11. Anonymous

    Good for you. I have said this over and over again. I do not respect anyone who shows more regard for the rich and influential than he does for the ones who have been hurt by an authoritarian system. Jesus condemned the Pharisees and comforted those who mourned, many of them rejected by a religious system that gave preference to the powerful. I do not see the sacrificial love of Jesus in this article or in many of the people who have surrounded Mahaney. Jesus spent His time surrounded by the lost and let down.

    If only Challies, Schmucker, et al would say, “Hey, we support Mahaney but we are also very, very concerned about the people who have been hurt.” I might disagree with them on the Mahaney part but I would give them props for caring about the wounded. Not so, in this situation. I believe those wounded by this heavy- handed ministry will one day be held up as examples in heaven. At that time, Mahaney will probably get a taste of true humility, along with his rah rah team.

    If you would like me to post your deleted comment, send it to me, along with a contact email (it will be kept strictly confidential) and we will get it up.

    Blessings to you.

  12. Lynn

    You wait, Ken ham will make some big flashy comment about it as well. That alone is reason to see it.

  13. Here is the link to the AIG ‘review’:

    AIG poopoos “The Genesis Code”

    Yep, according to them us hapless OE/CE/TE’s are just to stupid to know how dangerous such a film might be 🙂

    I do hope it does well. It’s got some good actors in it, including Fred Thompson of Law and Order fame, and a personal favorite Catherine Hicks for her role of Dr. Gillian Taylor in “Star Trek IV, The Voyage Home”(also the mom on ‘7th Heaven’)

    So far it seems to be midwestern fare. Hopefully it will come this way.


  14. Zeta
    Once again, it is their way or the highway. I truly believe that one day ken Ham will see the damage he has done to those who have honestly sought the faith and were given a stone instead of bread.

  15. NW Clark
    i just went over there. He has closed comments, once again proving how “manly” these guys are. May I post your comment that was deleted? Were there two of them? Both Bible verses? We can do that in our post tomorrow.

  16. I don’t know. It seems to me that it might be one of those flashy but not too well made movies. Wooden. We’ll see.

    Sort of like me cooking a great steak. Never seems to happen. I seem to be at the level of making burgers no matter what cut of meat I start with.

  17. One thing about it, if it’s an attempt to deal with science and faith and AIG is against it, it’s probably worth checking out!



  18. Dee,

    My two posts were basically just Bible verses, the second one included a little of my own commentary. The verses were Jeremiah 9:4-9 and 2 Timothy 3:16. You are welcome to post both of my comments.

    – Nat

  19. Dee-

    My 1st comment was posted under anonymouse by mistake–I am Diane and posted the second same comment–same person. 🙂

    You can see my initial comment at Challies like I stated, and the deleted one at the site I linked at Reformed Anglican. It does not matter to me what you do with my deleted comment. I do not have a copy to send you–it is at the link I sent in my comment. Thanks.

  20. Dee,
    My initial comment with the moderator’s reply which has stayed on the T4G article since the 18th of this month has now vanished this morning.

  21. Zeta,

    Loved your comment: “if it’s an attempt to deal with science and faith and AIG is against it, it’s probably worth checking out!”

  22. Dee,
    I know a poster already told you but…It was Star Trek!! Original series!!! 🙂 Looooooooved that show…and that episode! Please keep referencing old Star Trek…and I may never visit another site ever again!

  23. On a related note to Challies and C.J. Mahaney, the CLC Members meeting from 10.30.2011 is now posted with a transcript and audio at:

    It’s nice to see some interesting “official” developments, on paper, as it were, rather than simply rumour or hearsay.

    – Nat
    Veritas nunquam perit!

  24. Leila, Argo

    Thank you both for the reference. I may see if I can find a clip to embed.

    One of the nicest things about aging is that my husband and i can watch old episodes and forget what happened!

    In case you have not read my bio, I became a Christian during an episode of Star Trek(I promise this is true) which makes watching it a “divine” experience for me.

    Leila, I love your name. My best friend from high school is named Leila.

  25. Lynn/Zeta
    Anything that challenges the AIG status quo gets kudos from this blogger. See Zetas comment!

  26. Nat,
    Your 2 posted scriptures at least got them to close the comments. They might not believe Jeremiah’s words apply to T4G, and are therefore off-topic (King Jehoiakim deleted that prophet’s words log ago with a knife and a fire), but you’d think they’d assent in some way to II Tim 3:16!
    When I went to Challies this morning to look for Nat’s scriptures, the first thing I noticed was the deletion of your exchange with David Kjos. Was this because of Nat’s posting, or do they follow TWW? I wonder. It had been there all this time.
    David Kjos
    “Memo to those who want to bring up the Mahaney/SGM situation: We’re not going there. Period.”
    What does that even mean? Why not?
    David Kjos
    If you don’t know, you probably don’t need to know.

    Because this isn’t the place for that.

    And that’s all I have to say about that.

  27. Nat
    My fellow blogette is currently listening to this. Thank you. May I add “Veritas vos liberabi.”

  28. Nat,

    Thanks for the link to the CLC transcript. I have read most of it and plan to listen to the audio this afternoon.


  29. Hi, Dee. Yes, that’s right. I remember that part in your bio about getting saved while watching Star Trek. Now, I have another good reason to continue to insist that it was the greatest show these eyes have ever seen. 🙂

  30. In looking up the Latin phrases, I found this cartoon, appropriate to the Genesis film.
    I also remembered a couple good Lewis quotes, from That Hideous Strength:
    Merlin has awakened in modern times, and asks Ransom,
    “And are we not big enough to meet them in plain battle?”
    “We are four men, some women, and a bear.”
    “I saw the time when Logres was only myself and one man and two boys, and one of those was a churl. Yet we conquered.”
    “It could not be done now. They have an engine called the Press whereby the people are deceived. We should die without even being heard of.”
    Later Merlin creates a Babel amongst those who twist language, and shouts,
    “Qui Verbani Dei contempserunt, eis auleretur etiam verbum hominis.”[1]   1. They that have despised the word of God, from them shall the word of man also be taken away.

  31. Eagle: I’m not a Star Trek fan…but I am an X Files fan 😉 Are there any theological lessons that can be gleaned from Agents Moulder and Scully.

    Skeptics eventually can become believers … 😉


  32. Re: 1968 Star Trek episode “Wink of an Eye”. I saw it as a college student in the early 70’s and my friends and I were quite shocked at a suggestive scene. Kirk kisses alien woman. Commercial break. Kirk puts on his boots.
    Ar least they did some deleting where deleting was needed!

  33. “Already some in the YEC crowd are condemning this movie, further proving that it is their way or the highway.”

    Okay you asked for an example the other day – this statement is one. I happen to be in the “YEC crowd” that you talk about, and I know personally hundreds of other people that also are. Yet, I don’t know one of them that has that attitude. They are very accepting of other people disagreeing with them and would never make it a salvation issue. So it is not correct or kind to group all of the “YEC crowd” with those that are vocal about it in the media.

    For the time I have been reading this blog the attitude that I have picked up from many in the OEC crowd is: “it’s my way or you’re stupid”. It wouldn’t really be fair of me to characterize everyone with that belief that way, so I would assume that grace would need to be offered the other way too.

  34. Eagle,
    I mean this completely good natured: I find it ironic that an antheist isn’t a fan of Star Trek, which is probably the most humanistic/man-centered/God-denying show ever made (and…I’m a huge fan, don’t get me wrong, but mostly because I think Kirk is awesome and I like the phasers), and yet you love the X-Files, which if I’m not mistaken, usually have undertones of the supernatural. 🙂

  35. I just found out about a very old creosote bush in Death Valley called King Clone.
    Somehow a still-living organism brings these things a little closer for me. Even though that living plant appears to be 7500 years old, it’s possible 1: Scientists got the age wrong or 2: God created it already appearing to be 3000 years old, or created the walls of Jericho looking even older. 3: The flood did lots of really amazing things 4: Some sort of time dilation or countless things we can’t understand. None of these are totally convincing to me, but I try not to be dogmatic except in what I believe the more crucial issue: “Nothing– given sufficient time and chance– became a vast complex universe for no reason.”. That one seems “highly illogical, Captain”.

  36. Argo,

    One can be a man/woman-centered humanist and still be a believer too. Mutual exclusivity is not required (for me anyway).

  37. Strawberryred –

    Why do you seem so defensive? Dee said “some” (as in not all) the YEC crowd. She did not group the YEC together at all. She didn’t even say “many.” She also didn’t bring in a discussion about salvation at all. When you come accross so defensive, it makes me wonder if you are questioning what you believe regarding YEC. When I’m not quite sure what I believe, I come accross defensive.

    BTW – My personal stance is that I don’t know exactly what happened when God created the world (wasn’t there). We could all get to heaven and be surprised. We could all get to heaven and not give a hoot anymore. (I hope I’m too busy worshipping and being in awe of my God.) Whatever stance you take does not change who God is one tiny bit.

    All that being said, when I went to the AIG site and read the article, I came away feeling that if I believed something other than what AIG believed, it would be unfortunate, and I would be getting a “compromised message,” and I would be an “unwary moviegoer.” Oh, and somehow the movie makers were trying to make us think that we have to make adjustments to the Bible (that appears very bad indeed). Yes, and besides all that, I can’t possibly think for myself.

    The other thing that was annoying is that all their discussion about the movie and God’s act of creating was surrounded with STUFF TO BUY! If people are really wanting to share valuable insight they have about God or his Word, if they are really concerned that we are all going down the wrong road – should it ever come accross as a money-maker?

    This has ended up much longer than I thought. This is not in defense of anyone or anything, strawberryred, these were my own thoughts when I read the review at AIG and when I saw your remarks.

  38. Appalled

    Thanks for your thoughtful reply. Glad to see you using Answers in Creation. It is a good site. Heard about the creosote bush.

    The only argument that i cannot accept is this one. “God created it already appearing to be 3000 years old, or created the walls of Jericho looking even older.” If this is true, God could credibly accused of tricking us. I think God is very open about His creation and our observations are based on truth. Some, in the YE camp would have us believe that the creation is so fallen that we cannot make any assumptions about what we see. This is the fall back mechanism-don’t trust anything you see. I think God is a bit more open than that and Romans 1:20 stands.

    However, your best statement was your ending-highly illogical, indeed!

  39. Strawberry
    Here is the problem with some in the YE camp.(Note:some) They have elevated this to a level in which we OE/TE/CE are represented as those who do not take a high view of Scripture and may be in danger of denying the doctrine of the atonement. Ken Ham has been disinvited from a few homeschool conferences (his constituency) because of his mean spirited attacks on Hugh Ross, Peter Enns and others. In my opinion he is one of the most divisive men in the faith.

    I don’t know where you live and I do not know of your friends, but I have seen the YE enthusiasts in action and have born the brunt of their attacks from pastors to fellow Christians, including a mass invasion of a Sunday school class I taught.

    This is a widespread phenom that has affected people throughout the US. i would suggest you read why Hugh Ross started Reason to Believe. It is because of so many in the YE camp who have clearly communicated that those of us who do not believe, wither theologically or scientifically that YE is correct are in danger of denying the doctrine of the atonement and cannot be considered real Christians.

    Finally, the best example of this sort of YE approach happened on this very blog. i had a YE enthusiast. come here and tell me he did not believe this issue was salvific. He then went on to “empathize” with my point of view. he told me how he had once believed what I did but the “Holy Spirit” had revealed to him that YE was true! Do you realize what this means? I did and told him so. You see, he knows the truth because the Spirit does not lie. Which means that I am in error and denying the truth of the Spirit.

    Here is the bottom line. I do not think the Spirit told him any such thing.And these are good reasons for me to believe as i do about some of the YE camp. So, I am glad to meet one nice person who does not believe in such a manner. May you multiply.

  40. Strawberryred: Okay you asked for an example the other day – this statement is one. I happen to be in the “YEC crowd” that you talk about, and I know personally hundreds of other people that also are. Yet, I don’t know one of them that has that attitude. They are very accepting of other people disagreeing with them and would never make it a salvation issue. So it is not correct or kind to group all of the “YEC crowd” with those that are vocal about it in the media.

    For the time I have been reading this blog the attitude that I have picked up from many in the OEC crowd is: “it’s my way or you’re stupid”. It wouldn’t really be fair of me to characterize everyone with that belief that way, so I would assume that grace would need to be offered the other way too.

    Hi Strawberryred!

    Thanks for you input. If this is what you have seen from this blog, or from my input anyway, let me first say I am sorry. It certainly is not my intent. I have many dear friends that are YEC. One at least that is almost militant – but we basically just agree not to talk about this issue (her decision).

    There are two primary sticking points with me concerning YEC. One is an attitude that I have come in contact with fairly frequently, and almost universally when interacting with those that lead in this concept, that YEC is the only ‘true’ or ‘uncompromised’ reading of scripture. The use of terms such as ‘Biblical’ creationism to describe the position and ‘Compromiser’ to describe any other position underscore the point.

    The second is the claim that scientifically the position is supportable. This is probably the side of the issue that perhaps we on the OE side of things may come across as painting the YE side as ‘stupid’.

    On the first side, we are on the defensive, I assure you. Anything you see here addressing the first issue is primarily a response to being degraded or treated as second class Christians on account of our position.

    But it is the second side that is perhaps that is truly difficult. In fact, I was once asked to leave a Sunday School class that was aimed at presenting the YE ‘scientific evidence’. Was it because I was abusive or abrasive? No. As one email put it, I was described as one of the most intelligent folks this particular teacher had met. And that would be ok, if I would keep it to myself. So no, primarily I was being asked to leave because I kept, as politely as I could, pointing out the egregious scientific errors in the arguments being made. To underscore the point, there was another fellow in the same class that was TRULY abrasive and condescending in his comments. But he was OK, I think primarily because they did not need to fear his comments convincing anyone in the class another position might need to be considered.

    The reality is, whatever ones reasons are for holding to a YE point of view, science cannot legitimately be one of them. And this creates a very awkward communication with those taught otherwise. One either lets it go, or one explains why it just isn’t so. And either way one is really upsetting the apple cart from the YE perspective. When in this position, I always try to be as polite and respectful as possible. But I am almost always perceived as a threat. And I don’t think it is my attitude. It is that the facts are themselves a threat to the YE position, and for many this calls their faith into questions. This is why I always try to emphasis that there are other options. That YE is not the ONLY faith position. But the Ken Hams of the world have spent a lot of time indoctrinating people to believe otherwise – that if YE is not true, then the Bible is not true. And that makes it very hard to talk peacefully about this issue.


  41. Dee,
    I totally agree about option 3 and intended that one to be facetious, but forgot the “what does that make God like” part. Maybe not many thoughtful YE proponents use that one either. Yet there’s a certain common mindset which says , if God wanted to do it, Who am I, Oh man, to question, and that settles it for me. Likely this applies to many other areas of Christian life.
    Total agreement with Bridget2’s BTW comment as well.

  42. Appalled
    Many in this crowd use that example. Here is what happened to me in my former church when I said the earth was old (41/2 billion years). This obnoxious woman approached me and using her well rehearsed Ken Ham tactic of the week said “My grandmother looks old and she is only 90 years old.” Yeah, right, and rocks show age just like grannie! I wish these folks knew how dumb that stuff sounds.

  43. So does that mean organic matter behaves in the same manner as inorganic matter? I’m thinking most inorganic materials might have a longer shelf life than grannie?

    (Couldn’t resist! And I have nothing against grannies.)

  44. Bridget
    In keeping on the same humorous vein, if you laid grannie at the bottom of the Grand Canyon and subjected her to the ravages of the river for a week, would she appear to age more quickly?

  45. At risk of beating Star Trek to death.. They had more than one rapid aging episode, like poor Grannie. Maybe Alien Intervention should be brought in as a possibility by YECers. Might help in relating with some scientists.
    On the other topic, did anyone else try posting disagreeable scriptures/interpretations elsewhere?

  46. Appalled

    The folks involved in this matter were members (or former members) of SGM. They were trying to say something that would keep within the guidelines of Challies’ blog. Tune in on Friday when I, Dee, shall pontificate, at length, over this matter, moving it out of the SGM rah rah club to a deeper issue that I perceive .

    Re: Star Trek- I read something once by a Young Earther who believes the aliens are manifestations of demons, sent by Satan to cast doubt on the uniqueness of the Earth. That is when they lost me. Anyone who has such bad imagination is not worth listening to.

  47. Dee, I MUST know … which ST episode was it, and can you tell us how it converted you into belief?

  48. Dee — yes, that’s the name for it — bad imagination, inDEED! Underscored understatement.

  49. Leila

    I actually do not remember the episode, however, I remember Spock making a humorous comment to Kirk. I was somewhat overwhelmed at the moment. I was reading a news magazine which was talking about a mass conversions of teens in Rye, New York. One of the kids said “It isn’t a religion, it’s a relationship.” And it hit me. The reason I loved Star Trek was because I was searching for something more, a really big something more. And finally, that really big something more was defined-the person of Jesus. Whenever I see Star Trek today, I still love it because it reminds me of my conversion.

    Funny thing, God understands me very well. Soon after my conversion in Salem, Massachusetts, (I knew only a couple of Christians-didn’t even have a church to attend), I went to college. A new friend in the Christian group handed me a book by CS Lewis and said I needed to read this. It was the first book in Lewis’ space trilogy-Out of the Silent Planet. I was ecstatic-intelligent Christians wrote science fiction!

    If you note, many of the pictures on this blog are from NASA and Hubble. There is something about the universe and the creation that moves me deeply. I have read just about every Christian sci fi I can find, along with some others that were written by those who have religious sensibilities.Years ago, my daughter chose to dress as Captain Janeway for Halloween. Little did she know, at the time, how happy that made me. Thanks for asking. Live long and prosper! 🙂

  50. “Re: Star Trek- I read something once by a Young Earther who believes the aliens are manifestations of demons, sent by Satan to cast doubt on the uniqueness of the Earth. That is when they lost me. Anyone who has such bad imagination is not worth listening to.”

    When I was a kid my parents taught me that sci fi and any talk of aliens (even in fiction!), “Sows seeds of doubt” (direct quote!). Even C. S. Lewis’ Space Trilogy was forbidden. It’s been only in the last few years that I’ve discovered that I love sci fi. I’m about halfway through the Space Trilogy and LOVE it! Haven’t really gotten into Star Trek yet, though. I’m a bit more of a Whovian at the moment.

  51. I see the Trekies(sp) have been beamed up from the other thread! I’m afraid my ST experience is not like Dees. It’s interesting how our experiences can shape our views. You see I dislike ST and Sci-Fi – eeks bad me! But I’m glad you are all having fun with it 🙂

    Beam me up Scottie.

  52. Amanda the Whovian
    What a wonderful amount of reading and viewing you have ahead of you! Once you are done with the trilogy, i have so many great Christian sci fi books to recommend. For those who want one now, I love the Lamb Among the Stars trilogy by Chris Walley. Maybe I will do a post on it one day. I have discovered that people who love sci fi are a lot of fun to hang around!

  53. Bridget
    Hanging around with Star Trek fans can be a little overwhelming. But most of us are distractible. For example, I am also a NCIS fan and love Tony and Abby. Did you know that Abby is a Christian? So one of my daughters told me.

  54. I like NCIS as well. My 14 year old daughter just informed me that it was her new favorite show. She loves Abby. It’s nice to have something in common to watch with our teenagers.

    BTW – from 12 years old up when ST or such showed up on the TV, I would escape to my room to read the likes of Austen or Bronte or Hemmingway or Alcott. My friends thought I was a bit strange – not really the norm during the hippie era. But who likes being NORMAL anyway!

  55. Bridget
    I love all of Austen’s novels. I also liked the PBS adaptations. Also, I adored Bronte and Alcott. Hemingway was a bit to heady for me when I was young. I should reread them.

    As for normal, anyone who writes a blog has taken leave of their senses and is not normal by any stretch of the imagination!

  56. @dee (10:05 pm): Thanks for the recommendation. It’s been added to my list of things to read. 🙂

  57. I like the Trek shows (TNG and DS9 are my favorites), but… Ron D. Moore’s reboot of BSG is what’s really captured my imagination. Now there’s some truly intelligent sci-fi with a very interesting story arc and some great characters and performances. (naturally, Starbuck is one of my faves, though I wish she wasn’t quite so self-destructive.)

    And Edward James Olmos is superb.

  58. OK, how can I be 50 years old, Christian, and not know there is such a thing as Christian Sci-Fi beyond Lewis’ space trilogy? Heading over to amazon now to look up the Lamb Among the Stars.

  59. Eagle

    Thank you for reminding me why I liked this show so much. I forgot about the Star trek reference. I think one of my favorite episodes was Muldar and Sculley dancing with some young people who was misshapen due to some genetic deficiency. I think they were dancing to Walking to Memphis. I still don’t know why i liked that so much but it was moving.

    My favorite episodes were the ones dealing with aliens. My least favorite episode was the one in which some guy had to access fresh human liver to survive. Glad to find another fan out there. I had hopes that Fringe might be on the same level. But, I find it hard to connect to the main characters except for Walter who I find endearing.

  60. Numo
    More and more I know why I like you. I loved Olmos role in BSG. Actually, I have not watched the last three episodes. They are sitting on my computer. Perhaps I don’t want it to end? Picard was my all time favorite captain-urbane and tough. I think of him constantly tugging down his tunic while saying “Make it so.” His stint as Locutus of Borg is a classic for all time.

  61. Leila

    There are many such books. When you are over at Amazon, check the category of Christian science fiction. It will surprise you. Some of Alton Gansky’s stuff is very good.I really should do a post on good Christian sci fi and fantasy. I would guess you now have discovered years of reading ahead of you!

  62. Dee – aha! Thanks!

    One of the things that bugged me about the new BSG: why do the Cylons (mostly) have such terrible taste in clothes?! (Seriously; those leisure suits + Tricia Helfer’s get-up really annoyed me.)

  63. At one time I could list all the TOS episodes by name and provide a summary of the plot. To this day, I can recognize the episode within about 10 seconds of the opening scene. Trouble with Tribbles of course evokes instantaneous recognition, though among my favorites were the two time travel episodes where they went back to Earth: “Assignment Earth” with Gary 7 and Isis the ‘cat’, as well as “Tomorrow is Yesterday” where they accidentally travel in time and end up destroying a USAF jet. From a Christian perspective, one of the fav’s has to be Bread And Circuses where the crew winds up at a planet that is Earthlike, ‘modern day'(=’60s) but still under Roman rule. The good guys are a ‘cult’ that the crew thinks are ‘sun’ worshippers, only to discover at the end they are ‘Son’ worshippers, and the Messiah has only just at that time come to their planet.

    The final lines from Uhura and Kirk are –

    Uhura: “Don’t you understand? It’s not the sun up in the sky. It’s the Son of God.” Kirk replies with a note of jubilant humility: “Caesar … and Christ; they had them both. And the Word is spreading only now.”

    (exact text of the last lines pulled from my auxiliary memory – the internet 🙂


  64. numo:

    “Ron D. Moore’s reboot of BSG is what’s really captured my imagination. Now there’s some truly intelligent sci-fi with a very interesting story arc and some great characters and performances. (naturally, Starbuck is one of my faves, though I wish she wasn’t quite so self-destructive.)

    “And Edward James Olmos is superb.”

    So say we all. LOVE BSG! I knew there was a reason I liked your comments! Dee, do watch the last three. There are some interesting revelations at the end.

  65. FWIW Out of the Silent Planet = The very first “Christian” book I read as a Christian. I providentially found it in the University library. Not likely on most “Now that you’re a Christian” recommended book lists today.

  66. Appalled,

    It was the first book I was given by another Christian, shortly after my conversion. It opened my eyes to many issues. i think the Lamb Among the Star trilogy captures this same essence but in a different way.The example of how subtly sin crept back into this community is well worth the entire series. OK, I’ll tell you. It will not ruin the book whatsoever.

    In this future society, people are encouraged to rejoice and use their God-given gifts to glory God. Well, one woman was considered to have one of the most beautiful voices in that society. She made a recording and digitally enhanced her voice so it appeared that she was able to hit impossibly high notes.She failed to tell anyone she did so, purposely leaving the impression that she could sing such notes. This was the first indication that sin was on the move. Interesting, huh?