Hubble/abhilashtard
I apologize. This is a rerun from an EChurch last year. I am away visiting my daughter and need to spend time with her. This is a favorite of mine.
A Morning Prayer: Syrian Clementine Liturgy. Ist century.
O God, Who art the unsearchable abyss of peace, the ineffable sea of love, the fountain of blessings, and the bestower of affection,
Who sendest peace to those that receive it; open to us this day the sea of Thy love,
and water us with the plenteous streams from the riches of Thy grace. Make us children of quietness, and heirs of peace.
Enkindle in us the fire of Thy love; sow in us Thy fear; strengthen our weakness by Thy power;
bind us closely to Thee and to each other in one firm bond of unity; for the sake of Jesus Christ.
Amen.
A Prayer of Forgiveness: Liturgy of St James, 2nd century
O God, who hast taught us Thy divine and saving oracles,
enlighten the souls of us sinners for the comprehension of the things which have been before spoken,
so that we may not only be seen to be hearers of spiritual things, but also doers of good deeds,
striving after guileless faith, blameless life, and pure conversation.
Release, pardon, and forgive, O God, all our voluntary and involuntary sins,
such as we have committed in action and in word, knowingly and ignorantly,
by night and by day, in mind and thought, forgive us all in goodness and love.
Sanctify, O Lord, our souls, bodies and spirits; examine our minds and search our consciences;
take from us all evil imaginations, all impurity of thought, all inclinations to lust, all depravity of conception,
all envy, pride and hypocrisy, all falsehood, deceit and irregular living, all covetousness, vain glory and sloth;
all malice, anger and wrath, all remembrance of injuries, all blasphemy and every motion of flesh and spirit that is contrary to the purity of Thy Will.
Amen
The Apostles’ Creed
I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth.
I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord,
who was conceived by the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried;
he descended to the dead.
On the third day he rose again;
he ascended into heaven,
he is seated at the right hand of the Father,
and he will come to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic Church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and the life everlasting.
Amen.
The following a talk given by Scot McKnight to the Apprentice Institute at Friends University link.
This gathering is described as “A 3-day conference for Christians desiring a deeper relationship with God
through learning and engaging in the teachings of Jesus.”
I’m experimenting with this format and will be featuring different speakers.
I hope you find this thought-provoking and spiritually transformative.
Benediction: (Source unknown – early Scottish) link
Deep peace of the running wave to you,
Deep peace of the flowing air to you,
Deep peace of the quiet earth to you,
Deep peace of the shining stars to you,
Deep peace of the Son of Peace to you, forever.
Amen
good to hear a talk on ‘transformation’ involving service to someone in Christ’s Name
I remember seeing a video of the faces of prisoners when Pope Francis was washing their feet,
and I was thinking that the example being shown was that there is a real power in humility before the Lord and before one another . . .
what I saw in those faces was a recognition that they were being cared for in a kindly humble manner that was personal and gentle . . . a service done in imitation of Christ’s own example long ago
humility is not much recognized as having ‘power’ to draw people to Christ,
but it is said that a humble pastor can draw thousands to Christ through his humble service, as ‘grace’ from God passes to the humble and this ‘grace from God’ has healing in its hands
Thank you, Dee; this is encouraging and useful to hear again.
Good for McKnight!
He gives a good talk.
He’s got the cojones to call out Piper!
An unexpected alignment of seemingly unrelated items (with apologies to Lemony Snicket):
A limitation of SM’s IMO very helpful discussion: it is predicated on the people at the top being of good will and desiring to change the local congregation “from toxic to tov.” This is implied or explicitly affirmed where he says (from memory), “you have to have power.”
What is one to do when that is not the case? Is there anything that can be done by those who do not have power (aside from quitting and looking for something less toxic, or giving up on the whole thing as obdurately and irremediably toxic)?
I think the discussion linked below is relevant; although it is explicitly about social and system transformation in secular contexts. The discussion is oriented towards a “Left” vision of a just society, but I think the principles in view are relevant to transformation (from below) in other contexts — and the transformation that can be achieved this way is not necessarily toward something more just; I think one can discern instances in history in which the changes went in the other direction). It discusses a toolkit for change; what the tools are used for is up to the people who use them.
https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2023/08/what-can-social-movements-learn-from-gramsci-in-todays-uncertain-times.html
(my apologies to the moderator if this transgresses the ban on politics. Feel free to remove it. It seems helpful to me; if experts in ecclesiology can learn from secular theories of “from the top” organizational transformation, perhaps it would not be out of bounds to consider whether the ideas of social theorists such as Antonio Gramsci have anything to say to people who are working “from the bottom.”)
“From the bottom” transformation is not for the impatient. SM mentioned a timescale of a decade for “from the top” change. I suspect that “from the bottom” would be much slower.
Samuel Conner,
Simon Sinek, Rand consultant for the US military, (Leaders Eat Last) and David Marquette, US Naval Commander, (Turn the Ship Around) write that knowledge is at bottom while power is at the top of any hierarchy of command. When they don’t communicate, the ship sinks.
Maybe it also stinks. Note to self: never board a stinking sinking ship.
IMHO, the NT Body of Christ is not a hierarchy but a lateral group of adults under the authority ONLY of our triune God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. We are a circle of HS gifted people, not a pyramid.
Teachers, discerners, admin, evangelists, servers, donors, merciful, etc., all collaborate on equal ground. Gifting from the HS is not personal authority and not a salary. It is a gift to the Body of Christ from the HS. Ananias and Sapphira met their demise by the power of the Holy Spirit not by authority of the disciples.
The Gospel is never sold. No self-help book is necessary, particularly books written by the top who don’t listen to the bottom as they sink the ship.
Ava Aaronson,
I think there is hierarchy in the “ideal church”, the church as it ought to be, but it’s not a hierarchy of control; it’s a hierarchy of self-giving love:
https://thewartburgwatch.com/2021/11/13/is-covenantal-membership-just-another-way-to-become-a-member-of-a-borg-collective/#comment-455039
And I suspect that in groups that live this kind of “love one another” congregational life, the Spirit is pleased to dwell within the midst of those groups. Perhaps there are even mighty works reminiscent of the kinds of things that are reported to have happened in the first churches.
I hope that Prof. McKnight’s vision is widely successful.
Thx for your response. We disagree, obviously, and I’m OK with that.
IMHO,
– you’re referring to an ideal type of org. that is not the Body of Christ.
– the Body of Christ is not an org.
– the Body of Christ requires no capital.
– people with extra capital have lots of accoutrements in their orgs that they label as churches: buildings, programs, personnel. How wonderful for them. Globally, many cannot afford this. The anawim can never afford this. They are the least of the least and they know God best. Through no fault of their own, the anawim rely on God alone. That is Hebrews 11 faith and they are faithful. God is all they’ve got, so God is all they need.
IMHO, and from a class we took from a national evangelical figure, the Body of Christ is 18 gifted faithful adults in lateral position, gifted, filled, and fruited by the Holy Spirit, all following Jesus, all created in the image of God whom all call Father. No middleman. Human hierarchy puts at least one middleman in place. Hierarchy of love? IMHO, no such thing. God’s love, true love, places all adults on equal level ground, equal voice and value.
Discernment is equal to teaching or pastoring, for example.
What person pastoring or teaching or preaching (who seem to be always talking, from a platform with everybody down below listening) then listens to and heeds the discerning? (Is preaching even a HS gift? I’ll have to look that up. Don’t think it is. Rom 12, 1 Cor 12, Eph 4.)
Pastors, preachers, teachers don’t have equal time and value for discerners? Therein lies a problem.
Clarification: not just 18 people but 18 gifts as named in the NT, Rom 12, 1 Cor 12, Eph 4, distributed by the Holy Spirit among any number of followers of Jesus.
I believe all 18 could possibly be present and active in each local group of Jesus followers, but that is up to the Giver.
Administration, IMHO, is organizing, but NOT moving up in a hierarchy.
IMHO, we don’t assemble as Christians to take orders from a human leader.
God uses people to speak for Him, but I don’t believe church participation is reporting to a human leader.