“There are a dozen views about everything until you know the answer. Then there’s never more than one.”- C. S. Lewis.
As I was doing some background reading for this story, I read the following at The Roys Report from 2/22: Survivor Reveals New Details of How Southern Baptist Leaders Mishandled Abuse Allegations.
Christa says the following:
An Executive Committee member told Brown he disagreed with Paige Patterson calling her and other survivor advocates “evil-doers” and “just as reprehensible as sex criminals,” she writes. However, she says the unnamed committee member pressured her to promise she would never reveal the member had talked with her. “It would be the end of me,” Brown recalled the member telling her — a sign, she said, that he was still unwilling to speak up publicly on behalf of survivors.
That should raise a few alarm bells. I think that it is pretty bad that this unnamed source is afraid to speak up when Paige Patterson said that survivor advocates are “just as reprehensible as sex criminals.” Why? If this fear is endemic in the leadership, could it cause problems with the rank and file getting behind the Task Force recommendation?
Christa has continued to express concerns that the SBC will follow through with its promises. On 6/24/22, Baptist News Global posted an Op-Ed by David Clohessy (long-time director of SNAP and a really good guy, IMO) and Christa Brown, whom I have long admired: Progress on sexual abuse in the SBC? Not so fast.
As the dust settles from last week’s Southern Baptist Convention gathering in Anaheim, Calif., this is essentially what Southern Baptist leaders are telling people: “Yes, for decades, we kept secret the identities of many hundreds of dangerous child molesters. Our organization did virtually nothing to disclose these countless crimes. In fact, we often took steps to hide them. Nor have we held accountable the hundreds of ministers who committed or concealed these crimes. But trust us. For one-year, we’re saying we’ll turn things around. But next year, we may go back to business-as-usual.”
Let’s repeat part of that quote.
Yes, for decades, we kept secret the identities of many hundreds of dangerous child molesters. Our organization did virtually nothing to disclose these countless crimes. In fact, we often took steps to hide them. Nor have we held accountable the hundreds of ministers who committed or concealed these crimes.
Think about it. For decades the SBC hid the abuse and, at times, even promoted pastors who took part in the abuse of children. DECADES. Will the SBC corporate culture change in the next year or so? I’m not so sure. I stopped reading for some time and meditated on that fact. I remember taking a course on corporate culture while getting my MBA. Corporate culture tends to be entrenched, even when it appears fairly modern. Just think about the recent spat between Elon Musk and Twitter. Think of the old version of the IBM manager and the requisite manner of dress. CNET posted IBM’s stuffy dress code through the ages. IBM has evolved, but the change came slowly, over years.
What does this have to do with the SBC? SBC has had its own entrenched culture that, in my opinion, went something like this. “Don’t cause embarrassment to the SBC or any of their churches because it will hurt the spread of the Gospel.”
When confronted with rampant abuse, many of those found in all aspects of SBC life might choose to say, “Is it that bad? Let’s go with business as usual. It feels better.”
Could some in the SBC leadership begin to say, “There’s really nothing to see here?” Yep. Look at a Daily Wire post by Megan Baham Southern Baptists’ #MeToo Moment. This article is highly critical of the Guidepost investigation and hints that the problem really isn’t that bad.
Lyman Stone, demographer at the Institute for Family Studies, told me the actual data contained in the abuse report, the result of an eight-month investigation by Guidepost Solutions, does not come close to meriting the hyperbolic terms that are peppering coverage in The Washington Post, The New York Times, and CNN.
“Statistically speaking,” he said, “there were not that many cases. This is not actually that common of a problem in this church body.”
Stone went on to estimate that there are about 100,000 to 150,000 staffers in SBC churches, but many thousands more volunteer in their ministries. Of all the allegations that Guidepost investigators reviewed, they found only two that appear to involve current SBC workers.
If you wanted to argue that based on this report, executives of the SBC mismanaged the cases that were brought to them, then fine,” Stone said. “But if you want to say this shows that [the SBC] is corrupt, hypocritical, and rife with sexual abuse — the report doesn’t demonstrate that.”
Stone added that he was shocked that Guidepost investigators only found two current cases, given how many exist in the general population. “I mean, if I had been betting beforehand, I would have bet for a couple of hundred,” he said. “Because if you’re talking about 100,000 to 150,000 people who are disproportionately men, just your baseline rate of sex offenders tells you, you should have gotten a couple thousand sex offenders in there just by random chance.”
He concluded that while the report may show the need for reforms in responding to allegations, it does not show an endemic problem of sexual abuse, adding, “It is important to distinguish these.”
Why is Dee posting this critical article? I fear that this reasoning will be used by one side in the deeply divided SBC who would like to see this “messy” task force go away. Please read this entire post because I fear Christa Brown and David Clohessy are correct in their expressed concerns.
Bare Minimum
According to Brown and Clohessy, the SBC is simply doing the “bare minimum.” Be sure to read the links.
the SBC voted last week for reforms that are strikingly limited and fragile. Bruce Frank, chair of the task force that drafted the recommendations, described them as “the bare minimum of what can be called reform.”
The “bare minimum.” By their own admission.
A problem this enormous and entrenched should have launched immediate transformational reforms. Instead, we see the creation of yet another task force, authorized for only one year, and the promise of a database — at some undetermined point down the road — that is structured to be church-dependent and survivor-unfriendly.
…Still, many are proclaiming it “a first step.” But let’s remember what happens when a minimal-by-design response system fails: More innocent children are raped and sodomized. Their trust is shattered, often leaving them incapable of meaningful friendships or stable marriages. And with faith having served as a complicit partner to child-rape, victims often are left as spiritual orphans for life.
Clohessy and Brown: Let’s involve the state and federal secular authorities.
Specifically, state attorneys general must launch thorough investigations into sexual abuse, institutional enablement and survivor maltreatment in the Southern Baptist Convention.
…Investigations like this already have been done, or are in progress, in roughly half the states in the U.S. with respect to the Catholic Church, and this is what must come next for the Southern Baptists as well.
…Also on the state level, legislators must relax or repeal archaic, predator-friendly statutes of limitations that prevent civil lawsuits.
…Ireland, Australia and other Western nations and set up well-funded totally independent inquiries into clergy sex crimes and cover-ups. Such inquiries must be focused on exposing wrongdoers and writing well-documented reports.
Why civil lawsuits are essential.
Civil lawsuits also are the most sure-fire way to prevent abuse and expose child molesters, because when civil suits are filed, the names of wrongdoers are nearly always made public, which allows parents to safeguard their kids.
SBC churchgoers: Do not be complacent. Not much has happened as yet.
Every caring person in the SBC should step back from the understandably tempting assumption that, last week, their faith group did a turn-around on abuse and that it will keep moving in the right direction.
I love this ending sentence.
Real reform — reform that can truly reverse decades of dangerous deception — takes a long-term commitment and a healthy skepticism.
I choose to remain, along with Christa and David, watchful and skeptical.
I voted with my feet and finances, but I am only a drop in the ocean. The SBC is beyond saving. It’s time to abandon ship
Real change will quickly happen if higher ups start facing criminal charges.
Change will be slower if only civil judgements are handed down (unless they are high profile or high expense).
No change will happen otherwise.
Afterburne,
I tend to agree with you…. These perverts do not see to have “ the fear of G$d” …. Maybe fear of prison will work?
The above referenced “ Critical article” misses the point…. No one will ever know the true “numbers”… The issue, at least to me, is the COMPLETE FAILURE of the church “system” to properly deal with these abusive leaders…
That may happen fairly soon.
The little people in Baptist land are starting to lose their fear of upsetting the apple cart and making waves.
It happened to the Catholic Church, and there’s no reason why it won’t happen in a large Protestant denomination.
“However, she says the unnamed committee member pressured her to promise she would never reveal the member had talked with her. “It would be the end of me,” Brown recalled the member telling her — a sign, she said, that he was still unwilling to speak up publicly on behalf of survivors.”
+++++++++++++++
You stand for what, then, unnamed committee member who pressured Christa Brown to never reveal your name?
seems to me you stand for your career. and for nothing else.
you represent the reason I no longer am part of the church institution. integrity is sacrificed for ministry career.
“Will the SBC culture change?”
“The story of sexual predation as an inconvenience in the popular music industry is a story as old as the centuries. Nobody wants to give up the music they love, and nobody wants to say/believe/think anything bad about the artist they love.” Ann Powers, Music Journalist, on the doc Surviving R Kelly
Music culture. Church culture.
Surviving the SBC. Surviving church.
I think that is literally the only thing that works.
There is a QI maxim by W. Edwards Deming that states, “Every system is perfectly designed to get the results it gets.” That’s why it’s so hard to change organizational cultures…you have to change structures, processes, and hearts/minds. The SBC is getting the results it was designed for, leaving the leaders to justify the human toll that occurs so that they can maintain the system/their power.
C.S. Lewis said, “I think we must fully face the fact that when Christianity does not make a man very much better, it makes him very much worse… Conversion may make of one who was, if no better, no worse than an animal, something like a devil.” If the shoe fits…
Do I think they will deal with it? In my opinion they haven’t even dealt with the past problems in a real way. There are a few cases that are missing from sexual abuse task force. They don’t even get a mention. Why isn’t Albert Mohler reprehensible statement mentioned about the Sovereign Grace Victims? Mohler supported the “Apostle” CJ Mahaney when all the allegations were swirling. How did the President of the “Premier” Seminary get a pass? Wasn’t the Sovereign Grace abuse one of the things that compelled Rachel Denhollander to such prominence? What happened?
Also what happened to when Albert Mohler tried to silence Janet Medford? Others trying to intimidate Joni Hannigan over the so called pastor privilege of Kevin Ezell? So no. Don’t look for anything much to happen. In my opinion the “good ole boy” network is alive and well.
SusanK,
Love that quote. And the shoe fits…
Oh, are you figuring things out? Mohler only got worried when he knew the media was paying attention to Mahaney. Few if any of The Gospel Boys have ever retracted their support of Mahaney. And many of them are pastors in the SBC,
As for what happened with Rachel and Sovereign Grace, I don’t know. Todd was ready to. go forward with a story and was asked to wait for the big reveal. Still waiting…
One thing of note: The SBC has approved and is implementing the longstanding demand of survivors and advocates for an independently administered database of convicted, confessed, and credibly accused perps.
As for what happened with Rachel and Sovereign Grace, I don’t know. Todd was ready to. go forward with a story and was asked to wait for the big reveal. Still waiting…
Dee, Not holding my breath. That is for sure.
EXACTLY.
What is the point of having a board if they can’t actually keep leaders accountable?
From the Daily Wire article: “Stone added that he was shocked that Guidepost investigators only found two current cases, given how many exist in the general population. ‘I mean, if I had been betting beforehand, I would have bet for a couple of hundred,’ he said. ‘Because if you’re talking about 100,000 to 150,000 people who are disproportionately men, just your baseline rate of sex offenders tells you, you should have gotten a couple thousand sex offenders in there just by random chance.’”
Maybe someone who understands statistics better than me can answer this question. But couldn’t this just as plausibly mean that the investigation was cursory and not at all thorough?
Wild Honey,
“Two current cases” are The Propaganda Number.
I’m sure you’ve heard of Propaganda Numbers.
“They gave them the Propaganda Number. Two thousand Roentgens, not Fifteen.”
— Minster B. Ye. Shcherbina, HBO’s Chernobyl
Bootlicking and brown-nosing The Anointed One on top, of course.
“With a ruler, you can lay the Flattery on with a trowel.”
— Benjamin Disraeli, Prime Minister of the UK under Queen Victoria
I think the article has got confused as well as the low number. Further up above the bit you quote it says there are only two cases *involving current staffers*, not two active current cases. It then also says two current cases full stop.
I think there are also things confusing it further.
1. The tendency of SBC to inflate membership numbers repeatedly comes up here.
2. There is no clear record of how many staff or volunteers there are. The number between 100 and 150,000 may also be inflated.
3. I would lay money cases have been raised and not recorded.
4. I keep reading comments that the database released omits known victims.
Basically it would be surprising if the number was realistic. Between not wanting to deal with it, refusing to believe people, incompetence, failure to record…. this will not be going away in a year because the leadership don’t have the competence to get on top of it even if they had the will.
Incidentally I gather SBC is congregational in governance – if this means there are no/few central records of personnel they’d better get on top of that quickly.
From the article: “But trust us. For one year, we’re saying we will turn this around.” That sounds disgusting to me, like forgiveness and reconciliation all rolled into one without the groundwork of trust earned, just lip service called “first step.” It’s suspicious, to me, that they even ask for trust.
I saw a movie, based on true events, that demonstrated what reconciliation work may look like. A museum of remembrance had been made filled with photos and stories of the war crimes and the tour guide of the museum was a repentant big player perpetrator of some of the criminal acts/war crimes. This tour guide asks a victim for forgiveness, not before, but after years of working toward reconciliation, agreeing the events happened and were actually war crimes. Maybe a sequel, if it would be made, would show the guide leaving the museum after receiving his victim’s forgiveness, but “trust me” wasn’t the repentant perpetrator’s “first step.”
I still can’t get TWW to load on my phone. It comes up on my laptop no problem.
Have you read the op ed piece by David Clohessy and Christa Brown? The SBC is calling this the “bare minimum” of what they can do to reform. This is apparently a 1-year effort. And as Clohessy and Brown denote, the SBC MO in dealing with abuse includes stonewalling, lying, and attacking victims.
When little kids get caught with their hands in the cookie jar, they can act quite contrite. So is the SBC acting (somewhat) contrite because they were caught? Much time is needed to see if they are actually going to change.
The devil is in the details. As we explain in linked text in the op-ed column, the database model that the SBC has approved is a survivor-unfriendly model that depends on local churches to initiate independent inquiries. Imagine: The typical survivor has ALREADY been abused within the church and then betrayed by the church as a kid, and often betrayed even by family within the church, and often has ALREADY been betrayed by the church a second time, and often repeatedly, in trying to report as an adult, and now they’re expected to report into an SBC system that, rather than initiating an independent inquiry immediately & directly, will refer their report to the relevant church to obtain an independent inquiry to determine whether the pastor’s name should go into the database. I can hear survivors screaming.
Like that one Tsar who made a lot of fanfare about “Ees No Death Penalty in Russia” by substituing 1000 lashes with the Knout (10 being enough to kill). Or the other Tsar who bragged “Ees no Slavery in Russia; here we call it ‘Servitude’.” Or the current Tsar with his Special Military Operation”.
I’ve also seen them turn the contrition and sincere tearful remorse on and off like a light switch. Click On, Click Off.
I have to disagree with you, Muff.
Having been one of those “little people in Baptist land”, I just don’t see it happening. Most SBCer’s don’t even know when the convention is going on, let alone what is going on during the convention. Oh, sure, attention may have increased a bit with the recent revelations of the shenanigans and cover-ups, etc ….. but that will slack off. People are too easily distracted. By and large, pew peons will be distracted by something else shiny, and the upper echelon will assist in the distraction.
You’d probably be floored to know how many people still almost worship Paige Patterson, Adrian Rogers, Bailey Smith, etc.
These men are still quoted by pastors in local pulpits.
Thinkin’ ‘bout quotin’ ‘em some myself, but they sure won’t let me do it from a pulpit!
I don’t believe they have any intention of changing hearts or minds. They like the system just as it is…… with male, mostly white, superiority and control.
And what better way to prove they have the power and to protect that power than by exerting it occasionally — in whatever way they deem necessary, or whatever way is convenient at the time. I am afraid that sort of thinking may have been their reasoning behind the cover-ups and gaslighting that went on for decades.
“For decades the SBC hid the abuse and, at times, even promoted pastors who took part in the abuse of children.” (Dee)
The Patterson-Pressler connection … the Mohler-Mahaney connection … the Conlee-Savage connection … etc. etc. etc.
Australia’s response to institutional child abuse was not as good as you might think. Why do I say this? Because all the testimonies from survivors of Ritual Abuse and Satanic Ritual Abuse were kept hidden by the people who ran the investigation.
Effectively, Australia’s Royal Commission was a cover-up for the perpetrators of ritual abuse, and a sop to the do-gooders who wanted to believe that Australia was addressing the problem of institutional child abuse.
Of 13 million members, I dare say that only a few thousand have any idea about the SBC abuse revelations … their pastors ain’t going to tell them about this denominational shame, that’s for sure!
Yep. See if this stacks up:
47,000 plus SBC churches, with anywhere from 2 to 12 messengers allowed to register and attend per church (number of messengers allowed depends upon CP donations, the more your church pays, then more members can play.)
Even with all of the commotion and bad publicity……
2018 in Dallas – 9,632 messengers (that’s 1/5th of a messenger per church)
2022 in Nashville (home of SBC headquarters) – 15,726 messengers (1/3 rd of a person per church)
2023 in Anaheim – 8,133 messengers (17/100 ths of a messenger per church)
How many churches don’t send messengers, and what percentage of the members are clueless.
John,
Thank you for the explanation!
Wild Honey,
My understanding is that the scope of investigation is very limited. It includes EC members and staffs. Personally, I think the investigation need to include IMB, NAMB, Seminaries, etc., all the institutions that are under SBC.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
Oops, wrong years….it’s not 2023 yet.
2021 in Nashville; 2022 in Anaheim.
Less than 10% of SBC churches send messengers to the annual SBC convention … thus, 90+% of the denomination’s 47,000+ churches have little say in convention matters while the few call all the shots. Most SBC members have no clue about the SBC sex abuse scandal … but still send their offerings through the Cooperative Program to finance things they have little knowledge of or influence over. For example, majority SBC members are non-Calvinist in belief and practice, but they unknowingly financed the New Calvinist takeover of all SBC entities (seminaries, mission agencies, publishing house, church planting program, etc.) by sending their hard-earned dollars to the national office. They think they are giving their tithes and offerings to Jesus! It’s the darnedest thing I’ve ever seen!
Sure you don’t men “kept h9dden by the SATANISTS who ran the investigation”?
When the Satanic Panic hit here in the Eighties, eventually it was found to be a combination of True Believer Activists and Recovered Memory spectral evidence. And making the Satanic Conspiracy bigger and deeper as explanation. Completely wrecked any credibility they night have had, which was blamed on an even Vaster Conspiracy of Satanists. As a D&Der, I was on the fringe of the blast radius.
Paige Patterson, Adrian Rogers, Bailey Smith — the New Holy Trinity?
Those are the Propaganda Numbers.
Two Plus Two Equals Five.
In its current spiritual condition, the SBC has no power over the world, the flesh and the devil to turn around wickedness in the camp. Short of a widespread denominational solemn assembly of prayer, repentance, and seeking God for the days ahead, I don’t hold out much hope that the SBC will have enough wisdom and power to “turn this around.”
You might should tack an exponent onto that Trinity. There’s more, from Criswell and Spurgeon all the way to Piper, Falwell, and even non-SBC MacArthur.
Propaganda, does seem to be the way they operate, words without substance, from what I read here.
On the other hand, victim/survivors and their advocates, courageous and authentic as they seem to me, have a different formula for the dynamic of their relationship with the SBC: 0+0+0+0+…= continued public heat
Yes, and they don’t seem to be afraid,at all, or heartbroken, of being in that state. IMO they seem more like Xerxes “wise” men than wise visionaries. I would say, though, they have a lot of money and its influence to tie up heavy loads and put them on other peoples’ shoulders, IMO.
Here’s a straightforward opine:
No, the SBC won’t do a dang thing until they get their a$$es sued off and the court(s) award a huge monetary settlement to the plaintiff(s).
You’d think they’d be smart enough to see what’s coming down the pike and take steps to avoid such a financial catastrophe.
Even criminal charges didn’t stick in the 1st round in Court with R Kelly… and there were tapes. (2005?)
As mentioned in my comment above, sexual violations against minors have been merely a longstanding “minor” inconvenience for superfans who love their music celebs and their music hits.*
(*Religious celebs have masses of superfans, too.)
However, journalist Jim DeRogatis, in Surviving R Kelly Doc #2 (2021?), says television is powerful. When Lifetime put out Surviving R Kelly Doc #1, (2019?) there was IMMEDIATE widespread reaction and a 2nd arrest, Court case, and today a sentencing of the pedophile predator.
“Surviving the SBC” needs a television documentary. Or maybe, “Spotlight” on the SBC. That film, too, was powerful.
Journalist Jim DeRogatis had been reporting on R. Kelly for decades, he says, everything. Derogatis says it took the film series to make it stick, regarding what had been happening for 30+ years, in plain sight.
Find a “Michael Moore”* and go for it. A film, a documentary.
(*Moore famously decided to make a film, out of the blue, ‘cuz he said he’d been going to the movies for years… “can’t be that difficult”.)
In all the rhetoric coming from SBC leaders about the god-awful sex abuse in their ranks, I never sensed that any of them were truly heartbroken … concerned, upset, distressed perhaps, but not heartbroken.
Indeed. IMO, the report that was released is just the tip of the iceberg. All SBC entities should be included in the investigation.
Wild Honey,
Barbara Roberts,
Max,
These were mere cherry picking, just like IICSA. Going through the motions of a shot across the bows but not genuinely even that.
Their best thinking got them to where they are today…
One cannot drive more than a few blocks where I live without driving by a SBC church. I am thoroughly disgusted by the SBC and have to be reminded of it whenever I drive anywhere.
Al Mohler made it clear that his primary (and probably only) concern was for the welfare and reputation of the SBC.
And just count the Executive Committee members who resigned in protest of waving their privilege to keep secrets secret – Ronnie Floyd among them.
How many people never batted and eye at the idea of sacrificing victims for the sake of the SBC?
SBC’s elite didn’t want the denomination to look bad, when it ‘was’ bad!
When the doo-doo hits the fan, it’ll be big news with all the indictments.
There was a time (and no offense to you Southerners) when it would have been unthinkable to go after the SBC below the Mason-Dixon line.
But I think those days are rapidly drawing to a close, and it will turn out much like the film Spotlight, which portrayed sex abuse in the Catholic Church.
Abusers and the people who enabled them get a lot of press: “Shame on what they did! They need to be held accountable!” Survivors get press too: “How devastating! They should be believed and helped, not silenced!” BUT, we ignore the biggest component of all: The People in the Pew. Until church members understand that abusers target churches on purpose and groom everyone – including them – so they can target kids, nothing will change. Until parishioners understand that childhood sexual abuse is not something that happened in the past TO a kid’s body but something that can change the trajectory of that kid’s entire life, nothing will change. People at the top alone can’t bring change. Survivors can’t either. It takes a village – and the village is in the dark. #missionstoo
The village superfans their predator celebrities. R Kelly, now sentenced, was acquitted 1st time around, even though there were tapes. Because, superfans. It took the Lifetime series x 2 to turn this around, finally, and fast.
Predation of minors was an inconvenience, until it was plastered on the big screen of television, in the village.
There are still members of Willow Creek-model churches across America who idolize Bill Hybels … countless thousands who will always think highly of Ravi Zacharias … superfans who will support unrepentant comebacks of fallen “pastors” … mega-maniacs are getting away with crimes … the American church in some corners is a royal mess; worshiping the creature, rather than the Creator.
… lots of idols.
Predators know how to amass credentials and crowds for credibility. These cons work.
I am not from the South, but I have lived in the deep South for the last 15 years. I had sworn I would never be southern baptist, but the church that fit us best when we got here was SBC. It was a great church, until it wasn’t. I will never ever again be a part of anything related to the SBC. Fortunately, there are othere options here, even though SBC churches are so plentiful.
Bless their hearts…
As I’ve said before, anyone can have a successful mega-ministry in America if he has a touch of charisma, a gift of gab, and a bag of gimmicks.
After 70+ years as a Southern Baptist, I can say “It was a great denomination, until it wasn’t.” Patterson’s Conservative Resurgence initiated its downfall; Mohler’s New Calvinist movement finished it off.
The creators and even creatures of pre existing untruths which they derived dutiful glee from potentising at the expense of humanity and Holy Spirit by mass electronic power.
“What better age to put an end to a life than the 14 to 17 age bracket”.
But that happened to the FLESH, not the Spirit. And never the twain shall meet.
Yet another corollary of the Christianese wall of separation between flesh and spirit, physical (BAAAAAAAAD!) and spiritual (GOOD!). With the two totally separate and the physical on the bottom (“It’s All Gonna Burn”), why should they care? Why should anyone care?
And of the Instantaneous Total Sanctification upon Being Saved (walk the aisle and say the words) of the Sinner’s Prayer Salvation crowd. Upon saying the words (and really really meaning them), all that baggage you’re coming in with just goes POOF! New Creature in Christ, already Perfect! Like a belated Predestined Election, with all the same attitudes and effects!
Even the predators’ molestation fits right in. Ask any of the Manicheans St Augustine was involved with in his younger days. They had become so Spiritual, anything of The FLesh (like sexual predation) couldn’t touch their Spirituality or their Salvation (for that was Of the Flesh and they were so far beyond that), so let ‘er rip!
“Igonrance is Bliss, and I WANT EUPHORIA!”
(And those church potlucks/gossip sessions…)
I don’t know how that’s going to happen if parishioners are expecting blind guides to lead them into that understanding and blind guides are expecting parishioners to do all the care work, and survival work and … The structure just seems off, to me, as being something fitting for facilitating a refocusing on the main thing.
I wonder, too, if “the mind body connection” terminology is just too “new-agey” for deep consideration by some Christians. But then again, some “villages” seem to give a lot of consideration to the terminology “they’re just wired that way” as if that’s fact that justifies particular role assignments made by….blind guides and/or their enablers.
Pastors who invite Mike Warnke as guest speaker KNOWING the guy’s a Fraud!
(Because he’ll Save lots of Souls with his TRVTH about the Vast Satanic Conspiracy…)
The church potlucks/gossip sessions continue without interruption.