
The Martin Luther King, Jr. Memorial in Washington. NASA
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Martin Luther King, Jr.
Having grown up in the great city of Salem, Massachusets, I take the accusations of witchcraft quite seriously. According to Wikipedia (and I concur, having been inundated with the witch trials in my history classes growing up).
The Salem witch trials were a series of hearings and prosecutions of people accused of witchcraft in colonial Massachusetts between February 1692 and May 1693. More than 200 people were accused. Thirty people were found guilty, nineteen of whom were executed by hanging (fourteen women and five men). One other man, Giles Corey, died under torture after refusing to enter a plea, and at least five people died in the disease-ridden jails.[1]
I believe poor Giles Corey died of pressing.
With the “dawning of the age of Aquarius,” Salem became inundated with many people who claimed they were witches, including Laurie Cabot, who used to swoop around town in a long black dress. She has made a bank on the gig. Recently, a woman in my church who is descended from one of the stupidly accused witches came back and told me, “Salem is weird.” It sure is and has gotten weirder through the years.
These modern-day witches apparently claim some “connection” with the witches in the past. The problem with all of this is that the ones who died and the ones who languished in prison were the victims of a bunch of hysterical Puritans led by a bunch of men who went for a land grab. If a “witch” landed in prison, their land could be purchased by the good people on the outside.
The accused were not witches. According to Wikipedia again:
The Salem witch trials only came to an end when serious doubts began to arise among leading clergymen about the validity of the spectral evidence that had been used to justify so many of the convictions, and due to the sheer number of those accused, “including several prominent citizens of the colony”.[3]
In the years after the trials, “several of the accusers – mostly teen-age girls – admitted that they had fabricated their charges.”[3] In 1702, “the General Court of Massachusetts declared the trials unlawful”,[4] and in 1711 the Massachusetts legislature annulled the convictions, passing a bill “mentioning 22 individuals by name”[4] and reversing their attainders.
The episode is one of colonial America’s most notorious cases of mass hysteria. It was not unique, but a colonial manifestation of the much broader phenomenon of witch trials in the early modern period, which took the lives of tens of thousands in Europe. In America, Salem’s events have been used in political rhetoric and popular literature as a vivid cautionary tale about the dangers of isolation, religious extremism, false accusations, and lapses in due process.[5
So, the self-proclaimed witches, warlocks, and other assorted strange ones are not “connecting” with the witches of the past because those folks were not witches. In fact, many of those who were so accused would have been shocked by those “goings on.”
What is witchcraft?
Christianity posted What Does the Bible Say about Witchcraft?
The Bible contains several verses that address witchcraft, sorcery, and the practice of magic. These verses take a negative view of such practices, considering them incompatible with the worship of God and often condemning them.
…Generally, witchcraft refers to the practice of using and manipulating supernatural or magical powers, often with the intention of influencing events or people
Witchcraft typically involves practices that are perceived as supernatural or beyond the realm of ordinary human abilities. These practices may include casting spells, performing rituals, divination, and communing with spirits or deities.
There are verses in the Old and New Testaments speaking against witchcraft.
I will set my face against anyone who turns to mediums and spiritists to prostitute themselves by following them, and I will cut them off from their people (Leviticus 20:6).
…The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God (Galatians 5:19-21).
…But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars — they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death(Revelation 21:8).
What’s with Christian calling pesky neighbors “witches?”
OK, we get it. We shouldn’t go to mediums and practice magic arts. So what’s with the following situation?
The Roys Report posted Dallas-Area Megachurch Pastor Calls Neighbors ‘EVIL’ and Demonic in Clash Over Building Project. The neighbors aren’t thrilled with a planned 100-bed facility to house survivors of human trafficking.
Specifically, the Oakhurst Neighborhood Association opposed Mercy Culture’s proposed location to build a three-story, 100-bed facility for survivors of human trafficking. After a two-year battle that culminated in a contentious, hours-long meeting Dec. 10, 2024, the Fort Worth City Council narrowly approved the church’s plan.
…The association claims it opposed the project location because of safety and traffic concerns. Plus, the association alleged that Mercy Culture was not following best practices for a facility of this type.
I think building a facility of this type is a nice idea. I am aware that protests often arise whenever anything gets built in an established neighborhood. People don’t like change. Sometimes, there can be traffic problems and overcrowding. There is a fear of an increase in crime since those who traffic victims are not known for law-abiding behavior. It takes patience, planning, and compromise.
It looks like the pastor at Mercy Culture Church takes no prisoners except he fights dirty and weirdly. According to the Roys Report:
And in a Jan. 1 episode of “Holy Disruption,” a Mercy Culture podcast, Schott labeled the clash with the neighborhood “spiritual warfare.”
“We are in a battle. It’s not against flesh and blood, which means it’s spiritual,” Schott said on the podcast. “So, if we have a group of people that are trying to actively resist us around every corner for two years from helping survivors of human trafficking, this is spiritual.”
Schott’s wife and Mercy Culture Lead Pastor Heather Schott added that the opposition had become personal, and multiple people had tried “to kidnap our children from church.” She said the church even received a $1 million ransom request for the threatened kidnapping of her husband.
According to the post, the police can’t find any reports of kidnapping and ransom requests, and the church ain’t talking.
Schott claimed:
During a May 2023 sermon, he claimed a witch conducted a seance, leaving behind blood and feces, on the front porch of an Oakhurst resident who attends Mercy Culture. The pastor said the church member sent a photo as evidence, but he did not show the image or present any other proof that a seance had occurred.
The neighbors are upset and perplexed by the mean rhetoric. According to the Roys Report:
“It is not the language, attitude or character that I would typically equate with a pastor or anyone that claims to be a devout Christian,” said Lopez, who was raised Catholic. “Everything that they do and stand for is the antithesis of what Christianity is supposed to be.”
Apparently, Robert Morris ( 🙄 ) gave the pastor, Landon Schott, “spiritual authority.” As I read the church website, I could not find any claim of theological education by the Schott.
Mercy Culture’s beginning dates back to 2017, when Landon Schott walked the streets of downtown Fort Worth asking God to make him a “spiritual father” of the city, according to a 2021 article in The Washington Post. It states that Landon Schott said God told him he needed “spiritual authority,” which he received through the blessing of Robert Morris, founder and then-pastor of nearby megachurch Gateway Church.
I took a look at their statement of faith. It is a bit weird, but they want to sound like the bee’s knees. Are they? I’ll leave this one up to TWW’s astute commenters.
My thoughts
I am not in a charitable mood today, so be prepared.
- The pastor has no idea what the Bible says about witchcraft.
- I wish I could call his statement slander, but I think he is plain out-to-lunch with a side of mean.
- He must prove his statements, including the ransom notes, etc. If he doesn’t, he must apologize and consider resigning.
- He should be removed from his pastorate for bearing false witness against his neighbor. I have recently become versed in Luther’s Small Catechism, which says this about bearing false witness. “We should fear and love God, so that we do not lie about, betray or slander our neighbor, but excuse him, speak well of him, and put the best construction on everything.”
- As a Christian, I am embarrassed by all of this.
“Hey, Pastor Schott, study your history. You have become just one more example of an ill-educated, weird pastor actively violating the commandments. No wonder people are fleeing the church.
Discussing witches who spoil milk, eggs, and butter in farm-yards:
“I should have no compassion on these witches; I would burn all of them. We read in the old law, that the priests threw the first stone at such malefactors, ‘Tis said this stolen butter turns rancid, and falls to the ground when any one goes to eat it. He who attempts to counteract and chastise these witches, is himself corporally plagued and tormented by their master, the devil. Sundry schoolmasters and ministers have often experienced this. Our ordinary sins offend and anger God. What, then, must be his wrath against witchcraft, which we may justly designate high treason against divine majesty, a revolt against the infinite power of God. The jurisconsults who have learnedly and pertinently treated of rebellion affirm that the subject who rebels against his sovereign, is worthy of death. Does not witchcraft, then, merit death, which is a revolt of the creature against the Creator, a denial to God of the authority it accords to the demon?”
(Cited in Henry Burgess, ed., The Journal of Sacred Literature and Biblical Record: Volume V (London: Alexander Heylin, Paternoster Row, 1857), 31.)
……..and all because they spoil eggs, milk and butter!
And this is also from the Small Catechism –
“ The Second Commandment.
Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord, thy God, in vain.
What does this mean?–Answer.
We should fear and love God that we may not curse, swear, use witchcraft, lie, or deceive by His name, but call upon it in every trouble, pray, praise, and give thanks.”
Lowlandseer(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I tired of reading the statement of faith after the first bullet point. So, I can’t comment other than to say, there’s a lot of them. My only comment is; the picture they’ve used on their statement of faith page looks more like an exorcism than a baptism. I actually felt creeped out and had to click off that page. The longer I live the more I cling to the truth of, “thou dost protest too much.”
EW66(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Lowlandseer,
I wish I had had this Catechism when my kids were growing up. It has taught me much about the commandments. The kids at our church must memorize Luther’s explanation for each commandment. I like the first commandment and thank you for reminding me of the admonition against witchcraft. I wonder how different that looked in Luther’s day.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I’m with you.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I can hear the attacks now against this blog piece coming from the faithful at Mercy Culture: “The devil made you do it!”
I don’t know which are scarier: the pastor or his followers.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Robert Morris gave him “spiritual authority” – whatever that may be -, and that’s why we know it’s real, ofc.
Gus(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Loo-tair’s day?
You (generic you) could get burned alive for not believing that the Sun goes ’round the Earth.
After all, isn’t that what Scripture teaches? (Geocentrism)
I am exceedingly glad that the founders of our nation made sure that religion will never have unrestricted power.
Muff Potter(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
It should be clear to all by now, that Robert Morris himself didn’t have spiritual authority to be blessing anyone!
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
“Lean Into Awkward” is one of their values, so at least they practice what they preach.
Jim Johnson(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
To give a bit of scale to the witch hunts. There is now a general consensus among scholars that in Europe, between the years 1500 and 1700, 70,000 people were tried for witchcraft. At least 40,000 were found guilty and executed.
There is an interesting talk by Gresham College about the trial of Johannes Kepler’s mother for witchcraft in 1615 at https://www.gresham.ac.uk/watch-now/keplers-mother
davewis(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Yes, back in Luther’s day a woman could be charged with witchcraft if she did NOT get the plague, if I recall a SS lesson from an ELCA church years ago. If a woman was old, and alone, she might heaven forbid have a pet cat for company. Said cat might keep the rodents out of her house, sparing her the plague spreading fleas. And if she had the audacity to stay well, just burn her at the stake! Must be a witch!
I’m glad today some of us can get our religion with a side of science.
linda(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
The Monty Python reutine is one of my favorite comedy reutines of all time… “I got better”!
Jeffrey J Chalmers(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Let me see if I’ve got this correctly: In a nutshell (according to Schott), he wanted spiritual authority over the city, God told him how to get it, he got it, and yet is incapable of having spiritual authority over the witches down the street.
I sense there’s a troll in this scenario. Clearly, it must be Robert Morris.
Benny S(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
It’s a narcissistic temper tantrum. He’s not getting his way because the neighborhood is preventing him from achieving his goal and he’s lashing out at them.
Observant Outsider(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Interesting about Salem and the land grabs; I’ve done a little academic digging after stumbling across The Museum of Scotland’s exhibit on witch hunting in Scotland (ten years ago)and how it dovetailed with views on women by the Reformers and the fight for power over an area. Catholic vs Protestants, with women (folk healers or stronger women with influence) being targeted in the fight for religious supremacy and a lot executed. It seems like accusing someone of being a witch is just an easy way to annihilate (literally or effectually) your opponent. Schott seems to just be playing the easy hand to get people on his side.
MT(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Funny.
The Jews define it as claiming God’s Command or Sanction for doing Evil.
Like God is saying “You do your own dirty work! Don’t drag Me into it! Not even by mentioning my Name!”
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
How does this differ from an Appalachian Witch-Man or Pennsylvania Dutch Hexen from controlling a town or city by his Magickal Power?
Because isn’t Magick and Sorcery and Witchcraft wielding power over Supernatural beings and forces to do the Sorcerer’s bidding for the Sorcerer’s personal gain?
Guy thinks he can do a LOT more than bake bread, and is butt-hurt that Reality didn’t bow to his Will.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
And most of these were in War Zones, whether the freelance Witchfinders General of the English Civil War, or the more-or-less sanctioned witch-sniffers who Cleansed central Europe while the last and bloodiest of the Reformation Wars was depopulating same.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Which I was not surprised to learn was by a Chinese sculptor – it fits the style of recent Chinese Monumental Sculpture.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
What do you think was H.P.Lovecraft’s inspiration for Arkhame?
There’s even a model railroader in Los Angeles who took that and went all the way with it:
http://www.ottgalleries.com/WelcometoArkham.html
The downtown railroad station which is the centerpiece is copied directly from old Salem’s.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Whatever the Witchfinders General say it is.
Just like “Hooliganism” in Russian Law.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Dee says: “Sometimes, I think I belong to a different Tribe.”
Me: You do, dear friend. You do.
Believer(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I was young and now am old. The closer I get to Heaven, the more I realize that I am a “stranger in this land, citizen of another world” (1 Peter 2:11).
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
One of the problems with a 100 bed facility for victims of trafficking is that the address has always been revealed. That will probably attract all the oppressors these poor victims are trying to escape. Most facilities of this type try to look for an out of the way location and keep it private as much as possible. I worked for a Christian women’s drug rehab years ago, and intake had to be at a separate location before you were allowed into the facility, which was located in a semi-industrial part of the city. Even with those precautions, pimps and pushers would show up at the door, but they had a security person and fencing around the facility. That gave them some margin until the police could be called. Their intake was about 15 clients at a time. How do these people expect to manage 100?
Linn(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Linn,
Yes, welfare and community ministries are highly commendable and those that specifically support vulnerable men, women and children, are best managed by competent people
and the locations and services being somewhat incognito.
Concerning the welfare ministry in question, are we to assume that this is a significant service within the heart of the church and its leadership or tokenism to enhance image?
Excuse any perceived cynicism. Honest question in light of witnessing where money related to welfare services is often re-channeled. Hoping the former and not the latter.
Ian Docker(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
A neighbor, according to the Roys Report article: “Everything that they do and stand for is the antithesis of what Christianity is supposed to be.”
This is the first big red flag that your church is way off track. I remember signing as a teen, “They will know us by our love.”
And wouldn’t it have been way more productive for everyone involved to discuss options and compromises? Church: “Neighbors, we really want to do this because we feel it would help so many who are in desperate situations. We’re sure you’re concerned about this issue as well. How can we work together?”
Susan(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Believer,
Thanks for not making feel too weird!
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Great omment.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I love the way he scratches the back of his head as if considering this deeply.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jim Johnson,
Leaning into the very weird whilst messing with the comandments.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Muff Potter,
At the moment there are people who seem to care little about what the founding fathers had to say.
Bridget(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Vanity Fair has an article about another one of these types who was a star history teacher at an elite private girls’ school over decades. The VF reporting sounds very familiar. Like churches, a private school is a little community all its own that apparently does not have to follow the normal rules of a normal civilized society. So elite, so special.
“The Sex Abuse Scandal That’s Rocking Miss Hall’s, an Elite Berkshires Boarding School for Girls” by Evgenia Peretz, January 16, 2025.
Decades. One girl student after another. And one “fabulous” history teacher guy who kept up his gig for a loooong time. Admin knew. Did nada.
Very familiar.
Ava Aaronson(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Nor do they give a rip about what the Bible has to say about godly leaders.
Deuteronomy 17:16-17. Israel’s kings, leaders, were NOT to have 3 things:
1. Multiple horses
2. Multiple wives
3. Accumulation of wealth, silver & gold.
Kings were civic leaders. Should godly spiritual leaders have a higher or lower standard than godly kings? Our spiritual leaders today accumulate not just horses but fancy cars and pastor AIRPLANES! Pastors also accumulate wealth, and some bounce from wife to wife, or have multiple liaisons with women under the umbrella of “grace.”
In the OT, Saul, David, and Solomon all disobeyed these godly requirements for kings. No wonder troubles followed.
Godly leadership in no way resembles run-of-the-mill worldly leadership. Obviously.
Ava Aaronson(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Paul and Silas encountered a slave girl with demonic powers that her owners were leveraging for profit$. She was annoying Paul and interfering with the disciples’ work. Paul wasn’t histrionic. No big deal. He simply cast out the demon. Problem solved. Acts 16.16ff.
If the above pastors are annoyed, they, too, could do the practical thing in the power and name of Jesus, just as Jesus’s disciples. No grand antics. No big deal.
That is, IF these modern day pastors are actually Jesus’s disciples. Big IF.
Good luck casting out demons without the power of Jesus. Seems like there were examples where the demons responded, “We know Jesus. We know Paul the Apostle. But who the Dickens are you?”
Ava Aaronson(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
dee,
🙂
Jeffrey Chalmers(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Ian,
I personally think they want to have a bigger building just to have one…if they don’t have 100 women, the church could use it for something else. It’s just a program for 100 women with all the wrap-around services required (medical, counseling, educational) doesn’t sound tenable. The neighbors have a right to be wary.
Linn(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I wish it didn’t have to be said anymore that the Jesus of the written Gospels was flat-out wrong about demons.
If demons are truly at the root of any of our problems, and casting them out was the solution, then this entire dialogue, and each of our lives, should be centered on that fact.
(Of course demons are metaphorical as well. Those are indeed real in context. I am referring to literal demons of the type we are informed of in the Bible.)
Sandy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jesus is the way, the TRUTH, and the life
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
“Build MY Steeple Higher
Than that other guy”?
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Sounds very matter-of-fact, like what happened to me during my 1980 Fullerton Freakout.
Doesn’t fit what became the Standard Christianese Script, so that makes it more credible.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
“A clergyman who engages in business, and who rises from poverty to wealth, and from obscurity to a high position, avoid as you would the plague.”
— St Jerome, over 1600 years ago
(To which Megapastor Superapostles tweet from their private jet “That’s not SCRIPTURE! Show me SCRIPTURE!”)
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
And yet they fawn and hang on every word that the great orange…
Oh well, I’ll just leave it there.
Muff Potter(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Well, in Faith Healing Ministries (including Deliverance), if it works, the Mighty ManaGAWD gets all the credit and if it doesn’t, the one being healed gets all the blame (with all the chuch gossipy justifications). Win-Win for the ManaGAWD, Lose-Lose for the lowborn tithing unit.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jerome also said: “It is no fault of Christianity that a hypocrite falls into sin.”
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jeffrey Chalmers,
One of the funniest dinner coversations I ever had was with an executive of British Airways. I was eating with my father in a good restaurant in Moscow. Back then, there were not many. The line was quite long to get in and we were at the front. This guy approached us and asked if he could eat with us since he was at the end of the line. This guy was a Monty Python expert and could nail the characters. He drank a bit too much vodka and began to act out the scenes, standing up and moving around. My father and I laughed so hard, I couldn’t eat. So did everyone in the place. I never saw him again but I always think of him when I see something about British Airways. The guy was a genius.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
You do you Max, and may the Lord be with you always.
There are several ways to define Truth, including as compass, wheel, photograph, text, voices, analytic, and many other ways. All can be useful. Some can be contradictory. None are absolute.
In the future even believers must arm themselves with skepticism in order to protect against abuse.
As I taught my children, to their benefit I believe, the truth welcomes skepticism as its traveling companion. At least they will never be raped at the altar by a priest peddling the Truth.
If Jesus was a supreme healer, one wonders why just a little bit of germ theory isn’t recorded, and why literal demons were insistently invoked, and why even today some people think that Jesus is the jab.
Sandy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
dee,
Did he do the “director of the funny walk agency”?
Jeffrey J Chalmers(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jeffrey J Chalmers,
got it wrong.. Ministry of Silly walks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV2ViNJFZC8
Jeffrey J Chalmers(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Sandy,
the problem in the church is with truth-tellers not Truth
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Nearly 70 years ago, I found Christ (some say He found me). He promised me then “I will never leave you nor forsake you.” I believed that promise then and now. Always is a long time.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Sandy,
https://news.gallup.com/poll/394262/fewer-bible-literal-word-god.aspx
Davewis(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Calling people witches is a great way to set up a distinction between “us” and “them”. Same as calling someone a communist or a jezebel or a leftist. Its the same thing with different labels swapped in and out; a convenient way to dismiss anyone who doesn’t look or think exactly like ME.
It appears the pastor at Mercy Culture church sees the world in very black and white terms where he is the hero and everyone else is evil. The Roys Report article quoted him on multiple occasions demonizing those different from himself including the strong pronouncement Democrat voters can’t be Christian. Uh huh. It is no surprise neighbors near that church have grave concerns.
As for being in an uncharitable mood Dee I for one say amen. Being “nice” and keeping quiet is how older women with cats ended up accused of witchcraft, tried and dead. Being “nice”has gotten us to today where hateful men lead many of our churches, and our nation, men who glibly use the name of God to promote schemes which prop up their petty egos.
Fisher(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Linn,
Thanks Linn. Somewhat out of the loop these days, but have witnessed churches and para church groups engaging in welfare and community projects while claiming tax concessions, even for new cars, and also
receiving government grants, with little or no expertise and use unorthodox care and support methods. Unfortunately, all this unethical behaviour indirectly stains the reputation of reputable community & welfare ministries.
Ian Docker(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Years ago I volunteered with a church organization that was supposedly helping sex-trafficked women. I spent a week in FL helping to fix up a house that was suppose to house trafficking victims. For the entire week, I saw how the leader of the organization gave overt favoritism to the male volunteers and treated the female volunteers with contempt. I was too brain-washed at the time to put it all together but should’ve been asking questions such as: If you dislike women so much, why do you care about women who have been trafficked? I suspect it was more about getting free renovations on a water-front property than any concern for vulnerable women. This is the kicker: the leader had all the lingo down pat; he knew what to say to make it sound altruistic and convincing.
Ariel(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Remember a certain Josef Goebbels?
PR flack and spinmeister for a well-known Austrian cult leader with a funny little mustache some 80-90 years ago?
Last year out of morbid curiosity, I did a web search for quotes attributed to him and made an interesting discovery: Before the 1933-34 coup-from-within, the vast majority of Goebbels quotes sounded like a Culture War preacher – Traditional Family Values, God this, God that, God God God.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Revenge Jesus didn’t return on schedule to SMITE SMITE SMITE all their enemies real & imagined, so they found a new god who WOULD. And they get to sit as his left and right hands.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Ian,
Unfortunately a lot of cheating goes on with both religious/secular organizations with government grants. The organization I worked for still only takes private donations, so their programs are smaller but effective.
Linn(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Sandy,
“Jesus of the written Gospels was flat-out wrong about demons.
If demons are truly at the root of any of our problems”
+++++++++++++++
i don’t think Jesus operated as if demons were at the root of people’s problems (aside from a few recorded descriptions when ‘they’ were causing trouble). i don’t think he ever said anything along those lines.
Paul mentions such things once or twice – but doesn’t mean that’s the sum total of his thoughts on the problems of life.
i dunno – i use the word ‘marvel’ a lot because i can’t think of a better word…
i marvel at how my co-religionists take a smattering of verses & turn them into an thesis of absolutes, reducing an entire universe of everyone’s life experiences down into a mousetrap game in a very small terrarium of sorts.
you turn the crank which tips the marble which zigzags through a chute which triggers another marble to drop on a seesaw to flip a plastic-man into a cup which knocks a basket to shimmy down a pole.
and that’s how life works for everyone all the time.
(ridiculous)
elastigirlq(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I think this is where Sigmund Freud comes in, concerning all those male (ofc) pastors and their wish for a bigger … steeple (?)
Gus(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Well said.
Gotta go, here comes my marble.
Sandy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Checking out of curiosity.
One apologist counts 13 episodes involving Jesus and demons in the synoptic gospels. This does not include Satan sightings. Satan is the ultimate demon, right? So it seems a super important topic if taken as “the Word of God.” Which, you know, it has been called that.
Apparently gJohn makes zero mentions of Jesus and demons. Which is strange, in context. John had different fish to fry. Or John may have been sick of demons at that point. I mean, I regard John as possessed by … something … on encountering his florid imagination.
And a quick check says that Jesus mentions “microscopic disease-bearing organisms” zero times, though wisely avoiding the pork and the shellfish.
Sandy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Sandy,
“One apologist counts 13 episodes involving Jesus and demons in the synoptic gospels. This does not include Satan sightings. Satan is the ultimate demon, right? So it seems a super important topic if taken as “the Word of God.” Which, you know, it has been called that.
…
And a quick check says that Jesus mentions “microscopic disease-bearing organisms” zero times, though wisely avoiding the pork and the shellfish.”
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
ok, i didn’t actually go through each of the gospels and index it all. it could be that said apologist counted the retellings of the same story each as “1”.
(but i roll my eyes at apologists… they remind me of everything i had to listen to at the multi-level marketing pyramid-scheme convention a friend dragged me to)
well, this is how i see it. progress in technology & science means we don’t need to resort to mystical & magical & religious explanations for things.
(such as the eras when the stuff in the bible was written)
i believe in God/Jesus/Holy Spirit and spirituality, spiritual things (a combination of my own empiricism, common sense, and where those end a modicum of faith kicks in – which i put limits on, to keep it from becoming stupid & monstrous)
i think a certain amount of what’s in the bible was processed through the human writer’s culturally mystical interpretation of what happened.
i can even conceive of Jesus the human doing this, too. I believe that Jesus is God (whatever that means), but for his humanity to mean something it has to include human limitations to some degree.
elastigirl(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
I agree with a lot of what you say.
You seem to have a healthy attitude.
A healthy dose of reason-based skepticism is essential to a love of Jesus.
Lack of it leads to abuse.
Again just out of curiosity I checked.
Not including Paul, there are about 27 descriptions of 13 different demonic episodes in the synoptic gospels.
Too many for “sacred scripture” in my opinion.
Maybe god knows best.
Maybe not.
And—I hold Jesus accountable for each and every prayer not answered from abused altar boys.
I just do.
We still love each other.
But it’s “trust but verify” from each of us.
Jesus may be god but neither of them is omnipotent, nor omni-anything.
(I didn’t count but it says about a billion times in the NT to “pray pray pray.” I certainly think that “lead us not into temptation (WHAT??) and deliver us from evil” is not too much to ask for. So what happened?)
Sandy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Sandy,
“And—I hold Jesus accountable for each and every prayer not answered from abused altar boys.”
+++++++++++++++++++++
why not.
i think God/Jesus/Holy Spirit (very clumsy name i have for them) are as grieved about the problem as evil as we are.
perhaps it’s just part of the laws of everything – lack of free will would mean lack of resistance – lack of resistance would mean we’re all fat undeveloped balls of flesh that only develop physically but stay 1 minute old in all other respects.
i dunno… pontificating here….
elastigirl(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
But what happens when Prayer becomes a way to do nothing and feel absolutely Pious and Holy about it?
Isn’t that a description of the Worship Bot version of Heaven a lot of Christians gush about?
No free will, no people, just Holy automatons Worshipping Worshipping Worshipping?
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
During the late Seventies runup to the Satanic Panic, I was heavily into Dungeons & Dragons. (D&D pulled me out of an End-of-the-World Cult that was love-bombing me in.)
So… Been there (on the receiving end), done that, got the T-shirt.
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Which was inspired by a popular cartoonist of 80-100 years ago whose name became a household word: Rube Goldberg.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
All,
Minor nit, which I am sure Dee knows. The Salem Witch Trials did not take place in Salem. They actually took place in the village later known as Danvers.
Ras al Ghul(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Ras al Ghul,
My grandmother and great-grandparents lived in Danvers. The Witch House in Salem is the only direct connection to the trials. It is a quick drive from Salem, about the same as the distance between North Raleigh and Midtown Raleigh. However, Gallows Hill, where many witches were hung is in Salem and I used to pass by it every day going to Salem High School. Most of the trials took place in Salem Village which is now modern day Danvers. And the whole debalce started in Danvers.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jim Johnson,
;D Hahaha in my day it was called “Sign Of Contradiction”! LOL ;D
Michael in UK(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
As an aside, What else burns? Answer: “More Witches!!!”
The good old Satanic panic with John Todd, Mike Warnke, and Jack Chick. I remember those days as well as the hysteria over Dungeons & Dragons and “Satanic” rock music (complete with back masking). This latest news once again confirms that the Tragedy of the Evangelicals’ (or rather Fundegelical) Minds is the complete lack of one. Hence the fascination with conspiracy (D & D, Rock Music, Satanic Panic, COVID, vaccines, the 2020 Election, pedophile rings in pizza restaurants, graphene, 5G cell towers, chemtrails, and so on.). I am sure other folks on this forum can add to my list.
Ras al Ghul(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
HUG,
I forgot to add the Council of Foreign Relations, the European Union (the 10 horns), the Bildebergers, and while we are at it, the Gnomes of Zurich, the UFOs, the Illuminati, the Discordian Society. These latter 4 (and others) via for control Fiendish Fluoridators (HT: Purity of Essence from a Stanley Kubrick movie), Orbital Mind Control Lasers, Boy Sprouts, and other groups (HT: Steve Jackson Games).
Ras al Ghul(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Which had one thing in their favor:
Unlike the Satanic Panic/Spiritual Warfare Christians, they did NOT take themselves too seriously.
Worshipping Eris the Goddess of Discord, canonizing Emperor Norton as a saint, preaching the “Rule of 23” (picking a number at random, claiming it had great Occult Significance/Illuminati Recognition Code, and seeing how many people start seeing it everywhere).
E Clampus Vitus with a Golden Dawn coat of paint. FNORD!
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
ILLUMINATI CARD GAME, STEVE JACKSON GAMES, 1982!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illuminati_(game)
Two-three expansion packs, plus one bootleg expansion pack in Space Gamer called “The British Illuminati” where every card was based on a Monty Python skit — Ministry of Silly Walks, Upper-Class Twits, The Spanish Inquisition (which always achieved Surprise = “Nobody Expects the Spanish Inquisition!”)
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)