“You never know how much you really believe anything until its truth or falsehood becomes a matter of life and death to you.” C. S. Lewis
Jim Bakker has a history of sexual impropriety.
Today, I called a number that was purportedly Jim Bakker’s cell. When he answered, I asked him, “Are you Mr. Bakker?” The unidentified man said, “Who are you?” I said, “Dee Parsons,” and he hung up. I am still trying to get in touch with Mr. Bakker. Given his history of allegations of sexual misconduct, he should attempt to portray strict moral standards within his ministry. Therefore, it would seem advisable that he explore the credible claims of sexual abuse by five women who were underage when Joe Campbell molested them. In other words, they could not give legal consent to participate in sexual activities. I wonder what Jim Bakker thinks about this?
Last Sunday at Morningside Church, several women who Joe Campbell allegedly abused listened to Sunday services. Here are some thoughts they came away with.
“Rebuke the accusations”
I don’t know if the woman who played the piano and said, “Rebuke the accusations,” understood the implications of her words.
She appeared to be saying that the Assemblies of God’s decision to boot Joe Campbell was worthy of rebuke.
The Assemblies of God confirm that the accusations against Joe Campbell were so egregious that his credentials (his ability to minister as a pastor) were permanently removed. I wrote The Assemblies of God, Southern MO, Botched a Statement on Joe Campbell’s Five Victims. Are Internal Trials Still Ongoing? Still Looking for Joe Campbell and Jim Bakker. Read the statement from Mr. Miller.
In the case of Mr. Campbell, the Southern Missouri District leadership acted upon the evidence presented to them regarding the minister. He was reported to law enforcement, dismissed as a minister with the Assemblies of God, and is barred from ever again being credentialed with the Assemblies of God.”
She appeared to be saying that the pain of the women who claimed to be abused was worthy of rebuke.
I am going to make an assumption. This woman is not trauma-informed. Anyone who has been sexually abused as a child will have lifelong effects from the encounter. Many will need intensive counseling to deal with the trauma they experienced from their trusted pastor, Joe Campbell. Perhaps she is dismissing their pain. No one should ever commandeer a church service as an opportunity to hijack the worship for their personal agenda.
Would Joe Campbell want his family members to fight his battle by attending appropriate church services? Hiding behind a family member or friend could make Joe look weak.
Are we forgiven for all past transgressions without changing? What if it’s a crime? What about repentance?
One person felt this was what was being said from the pulpit.”We are forgiven for our past transgressions.” Unfortunately, these few words are loaded with erroneous assumptions when it comes to sex abuse of underage girls.
- This is not a transgression; it is a crime. Crimes must be reported to the authorities, and the person who commits them must serve whatever sentence is imposed on them. What happens when a believer commits a sexual crime? If the person is genuinely repentant, they must go to the local law enforcement and confess their crime. From what I have surmised, Campbell never admitted to any crime.
- This is not a simple transgression; it’s a serious psychiatric dysfunction. It is also abnormal for an adult man to desire to have sexual contact with an underage child. According to the law, they cannot consent, so any sexual activity is nonconsensual. Sadly, It’s a desire that never truly goes away. There is the hope that, with intensive counseling and possible medication, the person can be helped not to reoffend. Unfortunately, most pedophiles reoffend.
- Repentance from transgression leads to restitution to the victims by the offender. Has Joe Campbell ever gone to his victims and asked for forgiveness? A simple “I’m sorry” doesn’t cut it, just like it doesn’t work when a child says they are sorry after eating his sister’s cookies. In this instance, he should demonstrate his deep sorrow and offer to do anything he can to assist the victim. From what I understand, that has not happened.
- It is silly to say that pedophilia is just another sin that anyone could commit. Most people are not pedophiles. If a person reading this feels like they want to have sex with a child, they must quickly get help. This is not a normal feeling, and carrying out that wish will lead to a crime.
- Transgressions…wait, let’s call it what it is…sin. Sins have implications. Once a pastor misuses his position to cause sexual harm to a child under his care, he must NEVER stand in a pulpit again. He has turned in his credentials for life. It’s hard to let go when someone enjoys the limelight and the attention of people who must “submit” to him.
A man who sexually molests young girls is most likely a pedophile.
The following must be read by everyone who believes the sexual abuse of a child is just one of those icky little sins, like gossiping about Gert’s dress that makes her look fat.”
Here is something I wrote about 3 people in the news with probable paraphilias.
What is a paraphilia? Isn’t it just another sin?
I have used this blog to expose pedophiles in the broader Protestant church. However, my goal in writing has little to do with exposing “one more pedophile.” There always seems to be more than one more pedophile. I have hoped that the reader will understand the complicated topic of paraphilias. Comprehending the difficulties inherent in such behavior is essential to protecting you and your family.
Here is a link at the National Institutes of Health: Paraphilia by Kristy A. Fisher and Raman Marwaha that explains this.
Paraphilias are persistent and recurrent sexual interests, urges, fantasies, or behaviors of marked intensity involving objects, activities, or even situations that are atypical in nature. Although not innately pathological, a paraphilic disorder can evolve if paraphilia invokes harm, distress, or functional impairment on the lives of the affected individual or others.
…The DSM-5 diagnostic criteria for paraphilia states explicitly that the patient must have experienced intense and recurrent sexual arousal from deviant fantasies for at least six months and must have acted on these impulses. A paraphilia becomes a pathology, or a paraphilic disorder, only when this behavior causes significant distress and impairment of functioning to the individual or if the paraphilia involves personal harm or risk of harm to others
…However, due to the patient’s reluctance to seek treatment or the legal obligation to obtain treatment, psychiatrists are often forced to exceed the call of duty to the patient to reduce distress but rather focus efforts on protection against potential victimization.
Those with paraphilia are often reluctant to seek treatment. Even when they do, the counselor must focus on preventing harm to another victim.
Read the section called Prognosis. It appears that those with paraphilias are likely to reoffend.
Despite the psychological and pharmacological interventions designed to manage paraphilias and paraphilic disorders; an ultimate treatment or change has yet to be established. Existing interventions merely allow for increased voluntary control through self-management skills over sexual arousal and reduction in sexual drive, with the best-yielded prognosis only from those individuals who are actually motivated to change.[2] Those who do participate in either therapy alone or, ideally, the combined management of psychological and medicinal intervention show improvement with a marked reduction in the intensity and frequency of deviant sexual arousal and resultant behaviors.[18] However, the literature suggests that most sexual offenders are likely to re-offend.[2]
Sexual harm to kids is seen in many forms, as these three women will recount. I believe their stories.
I have suggested that the women involved seek the assistance of a lawyer. The laws across the US are changing as we, as a nation, become aware that many do not report their abuse until they are decades older. This is normal and should be reflected in our laws.
Let me leave you with this quote from the information on paraphilias. Pay attention and think about it.
However, the literature suggests that most sexual offenders are likely to re-offend.
We’ve come to a place in the church where we have decades of wolves preying on children with no repercussions and we wonder why young people aren’t sticking around. (Obviously, many reasons there that don’t include molestation but the entire model is whack.) The Carl Lentz’s of Christianity look like stellar characters of morality in this cess pool of church pedophiles. I’m chiseling millstones in my backyard.
EW66(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
It will be a full-time job.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Appears that Joe Campbell and his church are in “Ignore it and it will go away” mode. Campbell may start preaching Robert Morris’ famous sermon “Blogs are Satan’s Hit List”, demanding that his congregation not read “gossip.”
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
With two crews
Herringbone(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Until leaders of various “flavors” of church realize that they, collectively, are responsible for the actions of various preachers/leaders, we will see these stories over and over.. Bad things will happen, that is just “the way it is”.. but Christian orgs should stand out as being “leaders” in caring for the abused.. instead, they are examples of “what not to do”… Think good old John MAc: “we need to circle the waggons since we are going to now be attacked”…. sigh…
… think how shocked we would all be if John MAc did the opposite???
Jeffrey J Chalmers(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
“Do not hurry to lay hands on anyone, ordaining and approving someone for ministry or an office in the church, or in reinstating expelled offenders, and thereby share in the sins of others; keep yourself free from sin.” (1 Timothy 5:22 AMP)
Covering, protecting, enabling, and restoring “pastors” to the pulpit who have sexually abused a child is sharing in their sin.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
“I don’t know if the woman who played the piano and said, “Rebuke the accusations,” understood the implications of her words.”
In Scripture, Satan is called “the accuser of the brethren” (Revelation 12:10). When a pentecostal “rebukes”, they are rebuking Satan for doing this or that; they are essentially saying that Satan is behind accusations against church leaders (e.g., Robert Morris and “Blogs are Satan’s Hit List”). That’s why they will usually stick with a bad-boy pastor, until the potato becomes too hot to handle. Scripture says such rebuke is the Lord’s responsibility (Jude 1:9); He knows what is true and what is not regarding “accusations” and whether or not Satan’s hand was in it.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
But calling it a Transgression(TM) makes it Sooooo SPIRITUAL(TM)!
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Maybe Jim Bakker and his church have been hitting the Silver too hard.
Observant Outsider(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
You said it Max! Agree 100%. We were at a church once and it was “get to know the pastors” time. A lady raised her hand first and the lead pastor told her “don’t make it a hard question.” I think these pastors are in that camp, thus Dee getting hung up on. IF they are grandfathers, shame on them. They should want to do everything to protect that generation. All generations.
JJallday(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Hello?
Nancy2(aka Kevlar)(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Yah!!!
I can comment again! I had probs with the internet sending me to a “We’re sorry, this page does not exist” for while.
Jim Bakker, Joe Campbell …. and the rest of the sorry excuses the claim to be men of God, and the people who defend them…… Ha!
I have a question: If a female SS teacher was having sexual affairs with, or was assaulting, young men, would people defend the female aggressor the same way they defend the males?
I don’t think so.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar)(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
If you have windows, do a shutdown, and then physically unplug the computer and the wi-fi.
Let em’ sit for awhile, plug em’ back in, and then fire up the stuff.
This usually works like a charm.
Muff Potter(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Hell no they wouldn’t, if anything, they’d want to burn her as a witch.
Muff Potter(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Welcome back, Nancy2(aka Kevlar). 🙂 🙂 🙂 I missed you!
researcher(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
TWW commenters appear to be unaware of church history? You really don’t think all this stuff is new do you?
Senecagriggs(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
> Sadly, It’s a desire that never truly goes away. There is the hope that, with intensive counseling and possible medication, the person can be helped not to reoffend. Unfortunately, most pedophiles reoffend.
It seems to me a plausible hypothesis that part of the issue in churches characterizing paraphilias as not meaningfully different from garden-variety sinful desires is that, if faced squarely, they present a significant challenge to theological anthropology, soteriology and even ecclesiology. If there are incurable and unrepentable predispositions to certain kinds of sins, … that seems a problem for conventional visions of the power of the Gospel and the working of the Spirit. Alternately, one could maintain one’s vision of God’s power to save from sin (“save” in the sense of actual, concrete change in the here and now), but concede that God doesn’t exert this power in certain cases (perhaps these cases should be considered forms of “reprobation”) or, even more worryingly, He doesn’t exert it in the context of these present assemblies (the “Harold Camping” interpretation of the churches, that the Spirit has departed from them).
I don’t have answers, but the reluctance to notice the problem can only make the tensions worse as time passes and these stories continue to accumulate.
Samuel Conner(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
JESUS’ recommended penalty for unforgiveness is almost as severe as the penalty for harming one of HIS ‘little ones’.
Crimes, violations, transgressions, iniquities are all sin.
Gal 6:1 Bear One Another’s Burdens
1 Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. ESV
1 Tim 5:21-22 21 In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus and of the elect angels I charge you to keep these rules without prejudging, doing nothing from partiality. 22 Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, nor take part in the sins of others; keep yourself pure. ESV
Matt 18:15-21 15 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. 18 Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. 19 Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. 20 For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.” ESV
There is a recommended process available for dealing with unrepentant sinners. But the goal of the process is not punishment. The goal is repentance, forgiveness, healing and restoration.
1 John 1:7 7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin. ESV
Kenneth Brisges(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Kenneth Brisges,
Be careful with your “proof” about forgiveness. This is precisely why the pain and suffering continues. Kids are molested and then told to shut up and forgive. According to the law, there is punishment for a crime, and these abusers have skated throughout history. It is the children and the women who are told to “forgive,” and yet there is no repentance and sorrow on the part of the abuser.
Abusers will continue to abuse unless there is a punishment for their crimes. Churches will continue to cover up sexual abuse unless there is a punishment in the form of lawsuits.
Your comment reminds me of the time, years ago, that CJ Mahaney forced a two-year-old child to “forgive” in person their abuser. The child hid under the chair and was forced to be dragged out to “forgive.”
Be careful when you say that the lack of forgiveness is just as alarming as the crime of sexual abuse forced on a child. The consequences are not the same.
Are you even aware of the long-term consequences of sexual abuse? Do you know why it takes decades for some to come forward?
Maybe I don’t understand your comment, but it sure seems you are equating people who suffered the pain of sexual abuse for decades to be on par with the abuser unless they forgive. Maybe you can clarify.
dee(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
As in “EVERYBODY’S DOING IT!”?
Ever hears of the Yiddish expression “Shaanda fur die goyim”?
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
If it comes from a Grudem “Bible”
Michael in UK(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Piano player joe campbell daughter Wendy
Bonnie Ohlinger(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Kenneth B,
Your misunderstanding of God’s good character is embarrassing. God loves His little ones. Forgiveness is a gift from God to the wounded victim to help them heal. It is not a club to beat the victim over the head. It is not a get-out-of-consequences free card for the perpetrator.
God’s own declaration of what should happen to abusers involves a big rock and deep water and the neck of the perpetrator.
You “forgive me or you’re sinning” creeps are a special breed. I think it’s time you put the shoe on the other foot. You need to be told that you must forgive your victims for their unforgiveness against you. You must forgive their righteous desire to take their dignity and honor back. You must forgive the slights to your egos and the damage to your reputations and pocketbooks when others see who you really are. You just need to shut up, sit down, and forgive those poor victims! Or you will go to hell for your lack of forgiveness.
Overcomer(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
To this day my anger burns within me at this real-life incident.
The molester should have gone to jail, and Mahaney along with him as an accessory.
You (generic you) can make the Bible say just about anything you want it to, even to the negation of real-world jurisprudence.
Muff Potter(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Maybe I missed it … did Joe Campbell confess and repent of the multiple cases of child sexual abuse reported here?
You sound like a proponent of “sin leveling”? … where child sexual abuse is no worse than any other sin? Jesus taught that harming a little one was a HUGE transgression, worthy of a “large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea” (Matthew 18). I don’t recall millstones being stacked and ready for any other crime, violation, transgression or iniquity.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Forgive if there is ‘genuine’ repentance? Certainly. Restore to ministry? Absolutely not! You will find no example in Scripture where a pastor who committed child sexual abuse (a crime in all 50 States) is restored to ministry. Such sins/crimes are permanent disqualifiers from Gospel ministry. AOG attempted to do that by stripping Mr. Campbell of his pastoral credentials.
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
Jesus said “Go and sin no more!” We are dealing with alleged child abuse in Oklahoma, alleged child abuse in Missouri, and an Assembly of God hearing which stripped Mr. Campbell of his ministry credentials and reported him to law enforcement. The fruit of genuine repentance is “Go and sin no more”, but he allegedly abused in Oklahoma, leaving there to abuse more in Missouri. Until genuine repentance is demonstrated, there can be no forgiveness, healing and restoration. Genuine repentance in this case might look like voluntarily removing himself from ministry, seek forgiveness from victims, submit himself to church and state for his sins/crimes. A solemn warning: church leaders who were aware of this (who covered, protected, restored) share responsibility for his sin (1 Timothy 5:22).
Max(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
And GOD Hates ALL Sin with such a Perfect Hatred, remember.
“I THANK THEE, LOOOOOORD, THAT I AM NOTHING LIKE THOSE FILTHY SINNERS OVER THERE…”
Headless Unicorn Guy(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)
What is amazing is tht even with all the proof, Jim Bakker refuses to remove Joe. He is still there.
https://jimbakkershow.morningsidechurchinc.com/guest-bios/pastor-joe-campbell/
Bob M(Reply & quote selected text) (Reply to this comment)