ARE ERGUN CANER AND LIBERTY UNIVERSITY JUST JIVE TALKIN’?

Who knew there would come a day when some internet sleuths called “bloggers” (a relatively obscure bunch) would cause such a ruckus within Christendom? Yesterday, Christianity Today posted an article entitled “Bloggers Target Seminary President”on the Web.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2010/mayweb-only/28-11.0.html

The article begins as follows:

“Liberty University’s board of directors has declined to take public action against Ergun Caner, president of the university seminary, as bloggers raise doubts about Caner’s account of his childhood as a Muslim.

Elmer Towns, co-founder of Liberty University and dean of the School of Religion, says there will be no official reprimand or demotion of Ergun Caner. Towns, who had a hand in hiring Caner, says "the Liberty board has held an inquiry and directors are satisfied that Caner has done nothing theologically inappropriate.It’s not an ethical issue, it’s not a moral issue…”

We wonder whether the mainstream media, which many Christians label as “morally bankrupt”, will see it the same way. We will most likely find out in the near future…

Are the bloggers (including TWW) just being mean-spirited towards Ergun Caner because they don’t like his particular brand of theology? Are they maligning Caner because they are supportive of the New Calvinists or even Islam? What’s going on here?

Dee and I cannot speak for other bloggers, but we’d like to share our reasons for focusing on this ever-growing dilemma involving Ergun Caner. First of all, if you’ve been reading The Wartburg Watch, you know beyond the shadow of any doubt that WE ARE NOT CALVINISTS! The evidence speaks for itself. We have scrutinized the “New Calvinists” – whom we call “Calvinistas” – in great detail here at TWW. It’s extremely important to emphasize that there’s a HUGE difference between “New Calvinists” and “traditional Calvinists”. This cannot be emphasized enough!

Why criticize a brother in Christ like Ergun Caner? For us, it’s very simple. We believe Christians are supposed to hold each other accountable so that our collective witness is not compromised before a watching world. If a Christian, especially someone who sits at the helm of a seminary, isn’t truthful, what happens in the hearts and minds of non-believers? It’s really quite simple – their hearts are hardened and the Gospel seems phony. Heaven forbid that we would bring shame to our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ because of selflish ambition!

One of my great heroes of the faith is Adrian Rogers. I was deeply saddened when he died on November 15, 2005. Although I never met Dr. Rogers, I spent countless hours listening to him on a cable station and through cassette tapes which I ordered from Love Worth Finding Ministries. No other minister has had such a profound influence upon my walk with Christ. He often spoke of how Christian leaders are to conduct themselves. As an English major at Duke, I read Geoffrey Chaucer’s Canterbury Tales. Dr. Rogers liked to quote this 14th Century English poet. I can still hear his words ringing in my ears as he quoted Chaucer:

“That if the gold rust, what shall iron do? For if a priest be foul, in whom we trust, No wonder is a lewd man to rust.”

If Christians, and in particular Christian leaders, are to be taken seriously by a lost world, then they must be ABOVE REPROACH. Dee and I pray that a lesson has been learned from the Caner fiasco. The days of hiding one’s past are gone. The internet has changed that forever…
Unfortunately, the world is watching this situation play out, and the satire has begun. Just take a look…

Ergun Caner – We Had to Turn the Comments Off – Program #2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7WRKgF4grc&feature=related

Now, TWW wishes to address Elmer Towns, the co-founder of Liberty University and the Dean of the School of Religion. He made the following statement : "Caner has done nothing theologically inappropriate. It’s not an ethical issue, it’s not a moral issue…”

First, Towns needs to re-read LU's Honor Code which we have reprinted below. The question we have for this seasoned leader is: “Does he realize he is guilty of not fully disclosing the issues surrounding Ergun Caner as prescribed in Liberty’s Honor Code?”

Honor Code

"WE, THE STUDENTS, FACULTY AND STAFF OF LIBERTY UNIVERSITY, HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO UPHOLD THE MORAL AND ETHICAL STANDARDS OF THIS INSTITUTION AND PERSONALLY CONFRONT THOSE WHO DO NOT."

“Liberty University is an institution of higher education, espousing Christian values and ethics. Each student is required to maintain an exemplary testimony and fulfill his/her responsibilities to the Honor Code.
Purpose
Liberty University seeks to promote a positive Christian community. In maintaining the standards of the University, we each have a responsibility to one another. Therefore, the Honor Code above has been established. Students witnessing or having knowledge of a major infraction of school policy have the responsibility to confront the student and request that he/she report himself/herself to the appropriate Conduct Office r or Resident Director within 48 hours and/or report the alleged infraction and those involved to the Division of Student Affairs.
Any student who fails to uphold the Honor Code by ignoring major infractions of school policy, and by not giving full disclosure, may be deemed as responsible as the person who violates the policy and will receive appropriate discipline.”

http://www.liberty.edu/index.cfm?PID=17112

Secondly, Mr. Towns needs to read the definition of the word "lie", which we have provided here from the Merriam Webster Online Dictionary:

“1: to make an untrue statement with intent to deceive
2: to create a false or misleading impression

In case those definitions are confusing to anyone, we provide from the Merriam Webster Thesaurus the following list of synonyms and related words:

"Synonyms: fabrication, fairy tale, falsehood, falsity, fib, mendacity, prevarication, story, tale, untruth, whopper\
Related Words: distortion, exaggeration, half-truth; ambiguity, equivocation; defamation, libel, slander; perjury; bluff, pose, pretense (or pretence); humbug, jive, nonsense; fallacy, misconception, myth; misinformation, misrepresentation, misstatement; deceit, deceitfulness, dishonesty, duplicity, fraudulence

http://www.referencecenter.com/ref/thesaurus?query=lie&invocationType=tl1clk&flv=1

Thirdly, we would like to refer Towns, whom we assume holds to a literal interpretation of Scripture, to the Scripture. Here are some verses that specifically address the sin of lying.

http://www.grace4u.org/Topical/landrum_ss/Lying.htm

"Colossians 3:9-10: Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices, and have put on the new self who is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created him

Proverbs 14:5: A faithful witness will not lie, But a false witness speaks lies.

1 Kings 22:16: Then the king said to him, "How many times must I adjure you to speak to me nothing but the truth in the name of the LORD?"

Proverbs 19:5: A false witness will not go unpunished, And he who tells lies will not escape.

Revelation 21:8: But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."

Please visit the above site for a more exhaustive list.

Now, we are women and mothers and we have only one thing to say to Elmer Towns. "You weren't raised right or your poor mama is turning over in her grave. If any of our children told others such whoppers as "I was raised as a jihadist" they would be told to apologize and then they would be grounded and forced to clean the toilets."

Ergun Caner and his brother have been jive talking (see above list of related words) for a very long time. They have lied by any definition — Biblical or otherwise. Elmer Towns and the administration at Liberty University have demonstrated to the world just what value they place on both Scripture and truth. This raises serious questions about who is minding the hen house. Is this a political institution or a Christian institution? Frankly, TWW is unsure. Until this issue is resolved in a Biblical fashion, we would urge both contributors and potential students to consider extremely carefully whether the goals of this university are in line with their expectations.

If the Board of Trustees and Jerry Falwell, Jr. are confronted with the truth about Ergun Caner and choose to ignore it, then according to the Liberty University Honor Code, they themselves should receive appropriate “discipline”.

Comments

ARE ERGUN CANER AND LIBERTY UNIVERSITY JUST JIVE TALKIN’? — 33 Comments


  1. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    I am not at all surprised by the statements of Towns. Reading his theology textbook and the way he misrepresents views other than his own gives me the impression that he either is daft or lying.

    The longer they let this go the harder it is going to come down on all of them. As it currently stands this is going to be very, very ugly when a real investigative reporter gets a hold of it.


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    Matthew 18 principle should be applied here if you REALLY believe what you are writing is true. Anyone can say anything they choose, write anything they choose…doesn’t mean it’s truth, right? Check your sources, find out if they are credible and where the sources collected the information. Have you ever seen a movie? Some of those scenes look so real…don’t they? Could almost believe they were true…


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    Hmmm. Don. Many are trying to contact Caner and he is not responding. So, I guess Matt 18 is a great dodge for celebrity Christians!

    Actually, Deb is right. It is NOT a Matthew 18 situation. More like a 1 Corin 5 situation since Caner is unrepentant and going to great length to pull the videos of Khans and even got Ankerburg to do likewise. He pulled his own bio and claims he ‘misspoke’ for 9 years (over and over. yeah, right)

    When studying Matthew 18, the process starts at verse 1 chp 18. You know, some are even saying that since it is Liberty’s job to discipline him we have no right to say anything. Patriarchy alive and well! Problem is, the leaders are more depraved than most of the followers these days. And the leaders protect one another in their sin. Saving face and all that.

    Don, you have been hoodwinked by a celebrity Christian. Welcome to the club. Problem is, there are tons more examples out there. Follow Christ. Not man.


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    Don said,
    “Check your sources, find out if they are credible and where the sources collected the information.”

    Don,

    Take a look at these legal documents which were recorded in Franklin County, Ohio and are available to the public.

    Separation Agreement
    http://www.witnessesuntome.com/caner/caner-separation-agreement-web.pdf

    Divorce Decree
    http://www.witnessesuntome.com/caner/caner-decree-web.pdf

    Is it your contention that these legal documents are not credible?


  5. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    Matthew 18 is often used as the last refuge for scoundrels!


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    Dee,

    Have you noticed which “gender” most often quotes Matthew 18?


  7. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    It is great to see how well you seem to know me…truly amazing.


  8. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    “Follow Christ. Not Man.” Not sure if that is a charge against me or a command for me to follow but certainly an assumption on your part nonetheless. Question: Would Christ “blog” about others in the manner you have chosen? Would He use the sarcastic tone in dealing with issues such as this as you have? I don’t think so. Pot meet Kettle. Log meet Speck. By the way, I hate “celebrity.”


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    Lydia says,

    “Many are trying to contact Caner…”

    Please define “many” and name names. I find it odd that there is no “blog” noting names, dates, times, etc., of people attempting to make contact with Caner. General, undocumented statements are not proof of anything.


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    Don
    You were the one making an accusation that TWW is not checking their sources. In fact, you are the one who started the whole judgement thing. We were merely responding. We know you are from the Lynchburg area and assume you are defending Caner.

    The bottom line is this:Liberty U is bankrupt if it retains a man who has lied as the seminary president. It is a lousy witness to the Muslim world who looks at Christians to see if we really care about following the one who is the Truth.

    In case you haven’t followed this blog for any length of time (probably you have signed on for the Caner stuff) you would know what Lydia was saying about “Follow Christ, Not Man.”That is how our friend, Doug Pittman, signs everything he writes (Hey Doug, reading this)? We all happen to like it and use it regularly. So, you are the one making assumptions.

    Would Christ blog?Hmmmm…..there is this thing called the Scriptures. In it we read of kings who had affairs, a man who slept with his step mothers, a couple who were killed for lying, do I really need to go on and on. Yup, our Lord wrote it all down for time and eternity.


  11. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    Don, I can only go by your own words here.


  12. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    These are people I know, Don. And no, I will not put their names on a blog. It matters not to me whether you believe it or not.


  13. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    Come to think of it…..yes! And we’re the gullible ones? Great Scott!!


  14. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    Good, then stop defending it. Now, go back and read your first comment. Me thinks you did not do your homework on Caner before commenting. Or perhaps you do know and are trying to attack the messenger?

    Would Christ blog? Ever read 3rd John? Was that nice to say about Diotrephes for all the world to read for 2000 years? How about Paul writing about rebuking Peter publicly (He did not follow Matthew 18 first?) and then putting it in a letter to another church? And now we are reading about it 2000 years later.


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    Deb

    Do you remember when we started this gig that you weren’t sure that we would have enough to write about??By any calculations, at this moment, with no further stories, we are booked into next fall.

    But wait, there is the new “Rent a Boy story. We’ll write about this one next week. Just when you think it couldn’t get worse….!These folks just bring it on themselves. They act quite holier than thou and then show they can get down and dirty with the rest of them. And we Christians have the audacity to complain that we are discriminated against? We deserve the derision at times.


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    Don
    If I were you, I would not question Lydia further on this one. She knows whereof she speaks.TWW vouches for her and are really glad that she is on our side!


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    Don,

    You are either new to the accusations against the Caner brothers, or you haven’t done YOUR homework. Others have discovered, from public records, from recorded sermons – both audio and video – and from PERSONALLY sitting in sermons where Ergun Caner, in particular, made his claims, that Caner is LYING. These sources, and Caner’s lies, have been reported at length in other Christian blogs with far greater traffic and weight than TWW has. (No offense meant, Deb and Dee.)

    Have you gone to some of these other blogs to stir things up? Or have you targeted just this particular one? Have you accused the pastors who have researched and blogged about this of not being credible? Have you accused those who sat in Ergun Caner’s sermons and listened to him live of not being credible? Deb and Dee have linked you to some of the public records that prove Ergun Caner has lied about his past, and has been lying about it for years.

    If you think they’re wrong, why don’t you do the work that they and other bloggers have done. Listen to the sermons, read the interviews, look up the public documentation. Prove that Deb and Dee’s sources are “not credible”. Then come back and list where they’ve fallen down on the job. But until you do that, your words aren’t very credible either.


  18. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    Tikatu said,
    “These sources, and Caner’s lies, have been reported at length in other Christian blogs with far greater traffic and weight than TWW has. (No offense meant, Deb and Dee.)”

    Tikatu,

    Actually, I laughed when I read your comment. Remember, TWW is an “obscure” blog (according to one commenter) managed by two obscure Christian women who are extremely serious about their faith. I must say the hit counter (at the bottom) which was added about three weeks ago has been fun to check from time to time.

    By the way, I really liked your concluding comment:
    “Prove that Deb and Dee’s sources are “not credible”. Then come back and list where they’ve fallen down on the job. But until you do that, your words aren’t very credible either.”


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    http://aomin.org/aoblog/

    Check out these hysterical cartoons someone sent to James White about Caners. If you have been following the debate debacles from back in 06, you will better understand the first cartoon. if you want to read about White’s experience trying to set up a debate with Caner ( bizarre in his blustery bad boy childish responses and reasoning if you read the email exchange. it is like conversing with Eddy Haskell when Ward and June are not home)

    Here is a link to most of the email exchange about the debates:

    http://mp3.aomin.org/docs/Caner3.pdf

    Here is a post after that pdf was published:

    http://www.aomin.org/aoblog/index.php?itemid=1435

    BTW: I am no fan of White, either. he is a patriarchal authoritarian calvinista.


  20. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    http://www.aomin.org/Caner2.pdf

    Sorry! This is a better link and provides all the correspondance about trying to have a debate. What struck me in this exchange is that Liberty prides itself on it’s debate training. What I am seeing from Ergun is someone who is doing all he can to look for a way out of doing this.

    the Liberty debate prof who was brought into the exchange must have been privately appalled but would never dare express that openly. The King must never be told he is naked! You could get fired over something like that!

    This exchange gives a bit of insight into how Caner operates when backed into a corner. All the usual tactics are there: Bluster, bravado, exaggerate, ad hominem, red herrings, kill the messenger, change the subject, etc.


  21. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    There is nothing good that can be said about any of this. I have not researched all of this carefully, but what I have seen indicates that Dr. Caner spun a story about his past and background to inflate his credibility after 9/11. If that is not the proper summary, one would see Dr. Caner and his supporters refuting the allegations made against him point by point. Instead, there are generalizations. And, significantly, there is an admission of sorts that some of the facts are wrong.

    As for the “Rent a boy” story, I just learned of it on the Grace and Truth to You blog. I don’t post comments there because I have never set up a blogger profile. At any rate, I cannot see how Dr. R (can’t remember his name, and I have never heard of him) would think it would be a good idea to travel with this young boy. I read the criticisms of Dr. R for misrpresenting his credentials, but I could not see that clearly described in the article. Anyone can claim expertise in an area and not necessarily be lying. “Expertise” is a judgment about whether a person’s background, education and experience qualifies them to be knowledgeable about a particular subject. If he wants to claim expertise because he has studied the Bible on a subject, fine. But be clear about the background and education etc. Similarly, if Dr. Caner wants to claim expertise in Islam and jihad, fine. Just be accurate about background, education, experience.

    I, also, agree with the Matt 18 arguments. I was recently involved in attempting to mediate a church dispute. One of the parties was trying to invoke Matt 18, but it was clear why. Invoking that passage, under the circumstances in that situation, gave that person an advantage. I have found that Christians often become hypertechnical about rules and regulations and the use of Matt 18 and other Bible references when they get busted.

    In this situation, you have 2 public figures who work at a nationally known university. They have made public statements and may have written things (I am not an expert on the particulars) that are or may be untrue.

    It is not up to every Christian in the country to contact them before writing or talking about untruths that have been discovered. That is not what Matt 18 is about at all.

    We can go down a list – Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker, Jack Hyles, (the Bourbon Street pastor – can’t remember his name), Mike Warnke, and the list goes on. When these public figures with large public ministries are caught having done wrong, it is not inappropriate to point out or discuss their situations publicly. Matt 18 does not apply. II Cor (the entire book) probably does. Paul rebuked the super apostles who had come to that church. They were proud, had financial issues and were teaching unsound doctrine. Ananias and Saphira (sp?) were rebuked and exposed publicly to the entire congregation for their lying regarding their giving. They did not get a Matt 18 process.

    I could go on and compare lots of scriptures etc.

    The point is that when public leaders make public statements that are untrue or do things that are not appropriate, they pay a public cost, whether it is brought up by non-Christians or Christians.

    I don’t think that we should rush to judgment with glee (and I have to say that there may be some of that out there – but each person will have to deal with that). But nor should people be told to be quiet because they haven’t followed some church discipline procedure set out in Matt 18 that is not designed for and would not apply to situations such as these.


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    Anonymous,

    Thanks for your thoughtful comment, and I wholeheartedly agree with what you have written.

    I want to assure all of our readers that Dee and I are deeply grieved by all of this. We take no pleasure in writing about the problems of Christian leaders, but we believe serious issues must be addressed.

    Where are the humble, self-sacrificing, godly leaders who model their lives after Jesus Christ? That’s who I want to follow.


  23. Notice: Undefined variable: button in /home/guswo2wr8yyv/public_html/tww2/wp-content/plugins/quote-comments/quote-comments.php on line 127

    Questions do not equate to accusations, for the record. So if a person lies (sinned) they are no longer fit for ministry?


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    Don, yesterday afternoon you wrote:

    “Anyone can say anything they choose, write anything they choose…doesn’t mean it’s truth, right? Check your sources, find out if they are credible and where the sources collected the information. Have you ever seen a movie? Some of those scenes look so real…don’t they? Could almost believe they were true…”

    That sounds a lot different from your most recent comment, especially the question you posed: “So if a person lies (sinned) they are no longer fit for ministry?”

    Have you changed your tune in less that 24 hours? Lying is no worse a sin than any other, but God holds Christian leaders to a higher standard.

    Remember James 3:1?

    “Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.” (NASB)


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    Don

    Consistent lying over a long period of times is grounds for dismissal from the ministry. Here is a prediction. If Caner lied about things that he didn’t need to lie about, he probably has lied in other situations as well. A pattern of lying indicates some sort of personality disorder and he may need psychiatric intervention.


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    Christianity Today said that they had attempted to contact Dr. Caner–see their article for specifics. There have been a number of bloggers who have made efforts to contact Dr. Caner–some time ago. You can find them if you look back a couple of months in some blogs–Jason Smathers is a name that comes to mind but I am not sure about that. I am “naturally” skeptical about these things, but the efforts to make contact seem quite real.


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    Bennet,

    Until he is ready to speak publicly, I will refer to him anonymously. I personally know a gentleman who is well-known in certain Baptist circles. He was so mad about the Caner matter that he visited Liberty’s campus last week. Caner was “out of town”, but this gentleman spoke with some others at the university. Soon after his visit, the “official” investigation was launched. I hope he will be willing to speak this week.

    Frankly, the minute some Muslim groups claimed Caner was a fraud, LU should have felt morally bound to investigate, if only to keep lines of communication open with Muslims.

    LU has only demonstrated that they are afraid of the truth. Their arrogance that they are not responsible to the watching world is a sign of the times in certain circles.

    Do they truly believe that Christians must always be willing to give a reason for the hope that they have? LU risks losing that witness when it refuses to take a hard look at a man who has been accused of lying for a long time.


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    I am truly disappointed in Dr. Caner and LU’s initial response. Elmer Towns is an embarrassment to the university for stating that Dr. Caner did not do anything immoral or unethical.

    Dr. Caner did apologize on the internet, but then nullified it by saying he never intentionally misled anyone.

    But the evidence from his own mouth says differently. Watching him speak from the videos on the internet and listening to audio tapes of sermons proves that he has said the following:

    I was born in Istanbul, Turkey. He was not.
    I was raised near the Turkey/Iran border. He was not.
    I came to America in 1978. He did not.
    I came to America through Brooklyn at age 13. He did not.
    I was trained to do what the terrorists did on 9/11. He was not.
    I was in the Islamic Youth Jihad until age 15. He was not.
    I learned English by watching the Dukes of Hazard. He did not.
    I spoke broken English. He did not.
    I debated a specific Muslim in Nebraska. He did not.
    I have debated Muslim leaders. He has not.
    I have debated religious leaders of other religions. He has not.

    His falsehoods revolve around three areas: when he came to America, where and how he was raised, and who he debated. This is not complicated. He has intentionally misled others in these three areas. The true facts are as follows:

    He was born in Sweden in 1966.
    He came to America before 1970.
    He was raised in Columbus, Ohio.
    He was educated in America.
    He spoke fluent English.
    His mother was Lutheran.
    His father was Muslim.
    His parents divorced when he was nine.
    He was raised Muslim.
    His father was active in a mosque.
    He came to Christ around age 15.
    His father disowned him.
    He attended evangelical colleges and seminaries.
    He had evangelistic encounters with people from other religions.

    LU has taken action. They have corrected Ergun Caner’s bio. They have removed the inaccuracies. They removed when he came to America, mention of Turkey, and mention of his numerous debates in 40 states and 13 countries. They are investigating his background. But their previous statement by Towns is more embarrassing then Caner’s falsehoods.

    Dr. Caner at the very least needs to apologize. He needs to state clearly and unequivocally that he misrepresented his background. We may assume that he did so to capitalize on his Muslim background in the wake of 9/11. The evidence is that E. Michael Caner became Ergun Mehmet Caner after 9/11, another falsehood.

    The sad truth is that his actual testimony was sufficient enough. He could have said that being raised by a devout Sunni Muslim father gave him a unique perspective into the mind of the Muslim terrorists and on indoctrination. He didn’t have to lie. That is what is so sad.

    But the more I think about this, he did have to lie. His understanding and presentation of the basics of Islam is woefully inadequate. In order to become an expert on Islam, he had to enhance his Muslim identity. But his attempts at explaining Islam would be akin to an ex-Christian making the following statements about Christianity:

    A key verse for Christians is Bible 3:15.
    The Lord’s Prayer, “The Lord is my shepherd,” was foundational to my prayer life.
    The Eucharist is a depiction of how a believer is baptized into the body of Christ.
    Before we listened to the sermon, we sang verses.
    The Lord’s lunch is celebrated weekly or monthly in the churches.

    Ergun does not know what he is talking about. If an ex-Christian stated the above, he would be laughed at. If he presented himself as an expert in Christianity, he would be soundly ridiculed. So the more I think about it, Ergun Caner had to lie in light of his abysmal knowledge of basic Islam. So there is a fourth area in which he lied – what he knew about Islam. Sad.

    But then, here comes Norm Geisler and John Ankerberg to the rescue. Geisler claims that Caner has been libeled and slandered. Ankerberg claims that Caner’s testimony is completely true. Both claims are completely and utterly false. Caner has not been libeled or slandered. He has been caught frabricating his background and knowledge of Islam. Caner’s testimony is so twisted that Ankerberg’s defense of Caner brings his own credibility into question. So is this what it means to be an apologist for Jesus Christ? Disregard the truth when lies have been uncovered? This is nothing but Christians acting badly for the sake of their money-making name brands. Just ask Mehmet.

    So why are Geisler and Ankerberg covering for Caner? Could it be because they have a stake in the lies? Caner claims to have debated Abdul Saleeb. Geisler and R. C. Sproul have coauthored books with Abdul Saleeb. Ankerberg has coauthored books with Caner. There is a lot of money to be made in those books. But the real question remains, who is Abdul Saleeb? Does he exist? If Caner can fabricate his testimony, why can’t Geisler and Sproul fabricate an Arab convert? It is quite possible that the Caner lies are only the tip of the iceberg.


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    I just listened to Ergun Caner’s message given at Prestonwood Baptist Church in 2001 as replayed on Focus on the Family.

    Ergun Caner stated the following:

    I was born in Sweden.
    I was raised in Turkey.
    I was trained in Islamic Jihad to do what the terrorist did on 9/11.
    I was like a preacher’s kid.
    I was taught to believe that Americans hated me.
    I came to America in 1978.
    I arrived in Brooklyn.
    I spoke broken English.
    I went to a revival at the invitation of a friend.
    I was saved in 1982.
    I preached my first seven minute sermon and my younger brothers got saved.
    I led my mom to Christ in 1991 over the phone.
    My brother led my grandmother to Christ in 1995.
    He defined rakats as prayers.
    He defined injeel as angels.
    I rolled out my rug and prayed in the bathroom at school.
    I wore a turban on my head.
    I had an accent and spoke broken English.
    I was not made fun of by Christians because of what I wore.

    What is the truth? Who knows, but the following contradictions exist. Ergun Caner has stated on The John Ankerberg Show that he was born in Istanbul, Turkey. In other places he states that he had nothing to do with his brothers coming to Christ. Court records indicate that Ergun immigrated to America in 1969 and was raised in Ohio. His high school yearbook shows that he was very active in school, including drama. There are no pictures of Ergun wearing a turban on his head. Since he was raised in Ohio from age three on, he speaks fluent English. Rakats means verses, not prayers. Injeel means Gospel, not angels. His dad was not like a pastor in Islam. He wasn’t trained in Islamic Jihad in Turkey or Europe. He didn’t meet Americans for the first time in 1978 and discover that they didn’t hate him. He was not disowned by his family, only his non-custodial father.

    From just one sermon, given at Prestonwood Baptist Church in 2001 and replayed on Focus on the Family in 2010, flows numerous falsehoods. Did he just misspeak all of the following? Is that even possible? Or was he intentionally misrepresenting his testimony to make it more appealing to the audience?


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    Starstruck

    I am “struck” with the thoroughness of your comment. I might like to use it at some point in a post. Awesome.


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    Breaking News . . .

    Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary has just announced that the Law of God will no longer be referenced as the Ten Commandments. From this day forward, the Law of God will be known as the Nine Commandments. “In light of the Ergun Caner controversy, we just felt that it would be better to delete one of the commandments,” Elmer Towns stated. “This will allow us to keep Ergun as our president.” Where there is no law, there can be no sin. No sin, no problem.

    Dr. Caner stated that he was relieved to have been found innocent of all wrong doing. “I always knew, deep down in my heart, that I had done nothing wrong, “Caner explained. “Now I can continue to tell my testimony with the full support of Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary.”


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    Starstruck

    hahahahaha! I heard they were discussing an addendum to the big 10.
    “Ministerial Discretion” in a cool sermon is pleasing to the Lord.