This #HubbleClassic image shows the aftermath of a massive star that died in a supernova blast, whose light would’ve reached Earth thousands of years ago.
This supernova remnant, called N 49, is located in the Large Magellanic Cloud, a nearby companion galaxy to our Milky Way. Hubble/NASA
“We are not to simply bandage the wounds of victims beneath the wheels of injustice, we are to drive a spoke into the wheel itself.” ― Dietrich Bonhoeffer
Today was a cold, rainy Monday which fit my general disposition. We are finished packing for the move but the apartment will take another week. Someday, I would like to have a discussion about how we care for the elderly in our society. My church is having the students do a Valentine project in which they will make valentine’s for the elderly who are shut-ins, or like my mother, in assisted living facilities.
Today, while waiting for my mother’s new bed to arrive, I had a nice conversation with a man who moved into this facility to be near his family. I am grateful that some of the residents are like my mother, needing some help with care but are still conversant. Tomorrow is move-in day and coordination of mom’s care with the technicians and nurses. My mom is very politically aware and has some strong beliefs. I have warned her but she has said “I’m 93. I can say what I want!” She’ll keep things lively.
I am exhausted. I moved a few things myself today. I am working with a group called Smooth Transitions which will take over things tomorrow and set up her room. She will be brought there in the afternoon for the “Big Reveal.” I highly recommend this company which understands the fears and concerns of the elderly.
This will be a short post.
What’s going on with Wade Burleson?
I do not discuss politics on this blog. I have my own thoughts on governance but have decided that this is not the place to discuss them. However, it is of general interest when a well-known pastor makes a decision to run for office. Some folks, like Todd, have been subject to my speculation on this matter. In other words, folks, I predicted this one.
Wade Burleson announces his candidacy for the 2022 Oklahoma 3rd Congressional District
I am grateful that he resigned as pastor (after 30 years) prior to moving into the political arena. I will not make any endorsements or whatever the opposite of endorsement is. He and Rochelle will always be my friends. Wade tried for years to get the SBC to set up a database for those pastors who had engaged in sexual abuse. He was well ahead of the #churchtoo movement. I am forever grateful.
Tavner Smith is back in the pulpit and herein lies evangelicalism’s greatest problem…
Evangelical pastors appear to have a great gig. They can do just about anything except getting convicted of a crime (and even then) find themselves back in the pulpit so long as they can con people into thinking that this is what Christian leaders do.
The Roys Report posted TN Megachurch Pastor Returns to Pulpit After Six-Week Absence for Alleged Adultery
ennessee megachurch pastor Tavner Smith returned to the pulpit Sunday—six weeks after allegations surfaced that Smith had engaged in an adulterous affair and eight of his staff quit.
In a short statement read to the congregation at Venue Church in Chattanooga, Tennessee, Smith apologized for engaging in an “inappropriate relationship” without noting specifics.
“I want to say that I’m sorry that I put you through any embarrassment, heartache, or confusion,” Smith said. “I’ve wounded people and I’ve caused devastation that I know I can’t ever take back.”
…Dr. Julia Dahl, an image repair analyst and professor at the University of Michigan, wrote in an email to The Roys Report that Smith’s apology showed little repentance raises multiple red flags.
Dr. Julia Dahl
“This is clear minimization,” Dahl said, noting that if Smith’s “inappropriate relationship” was with a congregant, “it’s spiritual abuse.”She added that Smith’s refusal to be specific about his sin and nearly immediate return to his position are also problems.
“This completely ignores that his actions are at least temporarily, if not permanently, disqualifying,” she said.
Yet, his congregation, obviously ill-trained in Scripture actually cheered his return.
Smith also recognized the loyalty of his congregation, many of whom could be heard cheering after he read his brief apology statement.
What are the problems?
- Many congregants are not trained in reading the Bible and have no idea that there are standards for pastors.
- Many congregants and pastors believe that repentance is cheap. One can simply say “Sorry” and all is forgiven.
- When a pastor sins in such a manner, he is disqualified from the pastorate. He may be restored to membership in the church but he doesn’t get to leap directly into the pulpit. They always skip this step. The pastor must have his pulpit no matter how wretched his actions are.
When I was a new Christian, I read Dietrich Bonhoeffer’s The Cost of Discipleship. It was in this book that I learned the concept of cheap grace and costly faith. I recommend that all congregations read this book. When I became a Christian, I was handed books by CS Lewis and Bonhoeffer. I think I avoided a whole bunch of nonsense by being encouraged to read thoughtful books about the faith.
I’ll leave you with this thought. I hope to return Wednesday with a story about another lawsuit by a wealthy Christian entity against decent, truth-telling Christians.
This quote is from Dietrich Bonhoeffer’s The Cost of Discipleship.
Cheap grace means grace sold on the market like cheapjacks’ wares. The sacraments, the forgiveness of sin, and the consolations of religion are thrown away at cut prices. Grace is represented as the Church’s inexhaustible treasury, from which she showers blessings with generous hands, without asking questions or fixing limits. Grace without price; grace without cost! The essence of grace, we suppose, is that the account has been paid in advance; and, because it has been paid, everything can be had for nothing. Since the cost was infinite, the possibilities of using and spending it are infinite. What would grace be if it were not cheap?…
Cheap grace is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ, living and incarnate.
Costly grace is the treasure hidden in the field; for the sake of it a man will go and sell all that he has. It is the pearl of great price to buy which the merchant will sell all his goods. It is the kingly rule of Christ, for whose sake a man will pluck out the eye which causes him to stumble; it is the call of Jesus Christ at which the disciple leaves his nets and follows him.
Costly grace is the gospel which must be sought again and again, the gift which must be asked for, the door at which a man must knock.
Such grace is costly because it calls us to follow, and it is grace because it calls us to follow Jesus Christ. It is costly because it costs a man his life, and it is grace because it gives a man the only true life. It is costly because it condemns sin, and grace because it justifies the sinner. Above all, it is costly because it cost God the life of his Son: “ye were bought at a price,” and what has cost God much cannot be cheap for us. Above all, it is grace because God did not reckon his Son too dear a price to pay for our life, but delivered him up for us. Costly grace is the Incarnation of God.”
1st
“Smith also recognized the loyalty of his congregation, many of whom could be heard cheering …”
Here we go again … another standing ovation for a disqualified “pastor.” Bad-boy preachers would have no stage if it weren’t for a gullible audience willing to buy tickets to the show.
“Many congregants are not trained in reading the Bible and have no idea that there are standards for pastors.”
Bingo. “Pastors” like Smith depend on a high level of Biblical illiteracy in the pews. All it takes is a touch of charisma, a gift of gab, and a bag of gimmicks to have a successful ministry in America … heck, you don’t even need a working knowledge of the Bible anymore; the pew ain’t got a clue.
And evangelicalism is rich in biblical illiteracy. I taught HS English in a small town where “biblical inerrancy” and a “high view of scripture” were the motto. Most of my students could not identify or explain the most basic biblical allusions or narratives.
“One can simply say “Sorry” and all is forgiven.”
Apologizing is not repenting. Nothing in “Pastor” Smith’s words denote grief for what he has done and that he is cut to the heart in conviction over his sin. No “Woe to me!” No demonstration that he truly feels the depth of the pain he has caused his family, his church, the staff that left and the impact on their families, nor the Body of Christ at large. No genuine repentance = no genuine ministry at Venue Church. The pew can applaud the pulpit all they want to, jump and shout Jesus’ name, sway to the beat of their praise and worship music … but will be doing church without God. They will not rise any higher than the spiritual level of the man they worship in the pulpit, and that ain’t very high right now. But, such is the life of mega-mania in America and the beat goes on. Cheap grace has prevailed once again.
Praying for sunshine for you, Dee.
Psalm 51 is a good beginning for confession.
Add to that the fruit of repentance: Luke 3.8 and Acts 3.8.
In listening to the pastor’s speech to the congregation, he’s all in with his polygamy, partner-switching, partner-hopping, affair, dump his wife and kids in going after the new girlfriend, but just keep going in the church? How strange. Family values? Not so much. It’s all about him and his girlfriend and the loyalty (he expects) from the church in following him down his trail of vice. Anyone who follows after this guy, supports this guy, puts up with his shenanigans has nothing to do with Jesus.
Kick the wife & kids to the curb. At least the wife didn’t end up in her car in a semi off on a lonely road to nowhere only to be “discovered” too late.
From Dee’s post:
“Someday, I would like to have a discussion about how we care for the elderly in our society.”
Excellent idea, Dee!
“The prophets prophesy lies,
the priests rule by their own authority,
and my people love it this way.
But what will you do in the end?” (Jeremiah 5:31)
There are congregations in the American church (e.g., Venue) who love to have preachers that live no differently than they do. It makes them feel better about themselves.
And, as you note, they have “nothing to do with Jesus.” They are doing church without God and His Son.
Venue Church member: what will you do in the end?
I once did some lay-preaching in Southern Baptists ranks (before I was done with SBC). When I would go into churches, to test the water for Biblical depth, I would occasionally ask the congregation to turn to 2 Thomas:1-1. There was always a flurry of pages being turned in desperation trying to locate the passage before I began my sermon. Only a few precious souls would catch it immediately and smile at me. There is no 2 Thomas in Scripture.
God’s people simply don’t read the Word nor pray as they ought. They are easy targets for aberrant theology and counterfeit preachers … New Calvinism being the most popular diversion from Truth right now.
(as a side-note, my daughter at age 9 knew where all 66 books of the Bible were located, had a sizable portion of Scripture memorized, prayed daily, and witnessed Jesus to her friends … disciplines she has passed to her children)
Good grief! Even evangelical universalists, some universalists who are Eastern Orthodox, and even the Primitive Baptist Universalists or “No Hellers” do not accept cheap grace. All of those believe in reaping what you sow, and in God not being mocked. Some like the PBU see hell as in this existence, others see it at death, or after death. They see it as horrific, and yes our actions here have a bearing on it. They just believe eventually all come to repentance and cleansing.
But this idea of sinning all you want, a quick “sorry” and there are no consequences, are nuts. Yes, you can retain salvation while living like the devil, but there will be hell to pay.
Or as a famous SBC put it once, Payday Someday.
The story also reports that this one time Mega is now down to a few dozen people, so the people are not as stupid as one might think from your post. Thousands have left, which is good. At this point I consider this to be non-news because the congregation is now smaller than the average or mean. It might become news if he reinvents himself like Driscoll did, but this church cannot even afford the bills on their big building. It is effectively dead.
Totally off topic prayer request: about a year ago I had a routine checkup. In Sept. I was finally billed my portion of the labs, which I paid the same day I received the bill. In the late fall I received another bill. I sent in a copy of the cancelled check from my bank and thought it was settled. Yesterday I was contacted by a debt collector wanting that payment. I contacted both them and the lab, and they are “investigating.” I have the copy of the check, and the date it “cleared” with the lab. It isn’t a huge amount of money but I do not want it on my credit report, and the bill has been paid. Appreciate prayers! The same medical center recently turned me over to this debt collector regarding a procedure I had done two years ago. Medicare pays for this at 100%. The hospital, dr, lab all signed off to accept what medicare pays and I could not be billed for the rest. Only they tried about a year ago and medicare advantage plan we have got that straightened out. Then a couple of months ago they tried to get me to pay part of that again. When I called and told them I still had those old explanations of benefits it promptly “disappeared” and “was taken care of.” I am assuming they are not trying to be deliberately committing fraud, and that it is a matter of being so short staffed mistakes are being made. But I still would appreciate some prayer cover for this annoyance!
Thanks!
Burleson’s pieces over the last several years (on TWW’s blog-roll) have been mostly right-wing propaganda screeds. Mayhap it’s a good thing then (in a relative way) that he’s left the Pastorate to pursue his new endeavor.
Thanks for sharing this info.
linda,
That intersection of medical care and money is a stressful place. Add in insurance claims, invoice confusion, and bill collectors, and it’s more like a spaghetti junction. Blessings to you as you patiently straighten out somebody else’s mistakes. I often worry about people who don’t have the means or understanding to resolve such matters.
linda,
Let’s hope it is not fraud, but if not they are awfully incompetent! And something that affects your credit rating is more than an annoyance. Good job with your record-keeping, and I hope they get their act together soon!
linda,
You can report this to the AG in your state.
linda,
I prayed for you just now … that this would be resolved soon and that the Lord will give you peace.
Then I would say thousands exercised wisdom in Chattanooga.
I guess we shouldn’t be so hard on Mr. Smith … from the photos posted in The Roys Report, looks like he wore the knees out of his tight pants sorta repenting.
Thank you all for the prayers. I am sure it will be resolved. Our local medical center is slammed with people with covid and health care workers with covid. Hopefully we will untangle it soon. Always keep those records for at leat 5 years!
I think this “pastor” just wants to be a stereotypical rock star ———- he just thinks he can play the Bible as
like an air-guitar.
Muff Potter,
He should fit right in the Republican Party and it’s current membership. Perfect match.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
As his rockstar gig or church dynasty crumbles, will the girlfriend (already married) still be after this so-called pastor?
A prominent local leader (married with kids) had an affair with a younger constituent. He lost his community standing, the election, his wife and kids, and his status. So the girlfriend dumped him. He was no longer a god, a rockstar no more. Loser. Stupid choices.
Propping up this foolish pastor is completely without merit.
Jesus has real leaders in His Church, however.
Nancy2(aka Kevlar),
Good one Nancy!
And right you are.
He ain’t no Eric Clapton either.
Maybe… SPINAL TAP?
Or The Ruttles</i?
“And He gave them their request; but sent leanness into their soul.” (Psalm 106:15)
This goes for both pulpit and pew at Venue Church. They are on their own. This mess is so not God.
I have the impression that this problem is quite widespread, and was common even before the recent pandemic-related worker shortages.
I think one should assume that this might actually be ‘policy under cover of deniability’. If you pay, they keep the money. If you protest, they plead ‘oops’.
Keep protesting.
—-
The problems aren’t just in elder care.
I’m sure Mr. Smith will be preaching sermons about David to the Biblically illiterate at Venue Church, how he sinned and was restored. Fallen pastors seem to always drag David into their mess. The deal is, however, David was not in the ministry – he was in the military. There are no examples in the New Testament of pastors being restored to ministry after they have failed morally. Trust has been broken, family and staff have been betrayed, Jesus’ name trampled in the streets of Chattanooga. Forgive Mr. Smith if he demonstrates ‘genuine’ repentance? Certainly. Restore him to ministry? Absolutely not!
Thanks for all the prayers! I do believe the Lord used them, not necessarily in the way I asked or that you prayed. Last night my husband tripped on a very hard surface floor and fell, hard, while carrying a sharp kitchen knife. It could have been tragic. He basically “bounced” right back, cleaned up the mess he made, and all is well. We are very thankful!
“Tavner Smith Represents the Problems with Leadership in Evangelicalism”
Mr. Smith is the product of the “cheap grace” message Dee refers to in this piece. It is rapidly becoming the prevailing message that you will hear in churches across America … some more blatant about it than others. “Sin” and “repentance” are seldom mentioned words. The Cross of Christ has become lost in all the noise. The Holy Spirit has been relegated to the back pew. The authority and influence of Jesus in the average church are waning. Flesh preaches from the pulpit, unrepentant sinners populate the pews.
In addition to the cancer that is cheap grace, and its spread throughout the church, we must also deal with the related concept of “sin leveling.” That is, ALL sins are weighed the same. “Yes, what Hitler did was evil, but did you cut someone off on the road today? If you are a Christian, God sees that as just as bad.” Or put it another way, “We are all sinners.” I was told that as my wife, who was and still is involved in “music ministry” at a very famous evangelical church in San Diego (and whose pastor is a renowned author), engaged in an affair with a man who was also involved in “music ministry.” They received exactly zero accountability, and in fact were allowed to continue on their merry little ways, playing their instruments “for the glory of the Lord.” In fact, it was ME who was thrown under the bus, and was reprimanded by 2 of the senior pastors for bringing it to their attention, and asking for accountability for both of them. I remember a while back being forced to sit through a Todd White video at my small group in my new church. Bro. Todd, from the stage, reprimanded people who had been hurt by the church. His closely paraphrased words were, “Bro, you’ve done stuff too.” Hmmmm…. last time I checked, I didn’t commit adultery. I’m also not a serial killer, nor am I a child molester. While it is true that, yes, we all have a sin nature, God doesn’t view all sins the same. Would you tell sweet Corrie ten Boom that her “sin” of being angry at the Nazis was just as bad as what the Nazis actually did? There are certain “sin” that you simply don’t commit when you are in ministry, or when you are a pastor. Once you’ve crossed a certain point, you have forfeited all rights to remain in ministry or to remain as a pastor.
Indeed! Sin leveling is a common teaching within New Calvinist ranks (Piper et al.). NeoCal’s grace-this and grace-that theology never touches real Grace and in some corners of the movement it approaches antinomianism, where it is believed that Christians are released by “grace” from the obligation of observing the moral law. Without a correction, sin leveling will eventually merge into stinkin’ thinkin’ where nothing is considered sin for the elect.
It’s a step beyond that. If you THOUGHT about cutting somebody off in traffic, but refrained from doing so, it’s even WORSE.
Pardon the shouty caps, but this all-too-prevalent mindset drives me crazy because it 1) actively discourages self-restraint, and 2) promotes lawless behavior… but I repeat myself.
This mindset also encourages Christians to live entirely in their imaginations. We really don’t need that.
I love the Wartburg Watch and am an activist against abuse in the church. I was involved in fighting on behalf of an abused victim which was very costly in lawyers fees combatting the vicious and sustained threats from the accused and very wealthy perpetrator. I am Arminian, egalitarian and evangelical. I say all this to protest the attacks made on politically conservative or libertarian readers like me. Someone referred to the ‘right wing screeds’ of Wade Burlesob. This is a pejorative comment. We may have conservativepolitical views and write about them but they are not ‘screeds’ just because this person doesn’t agree. It should be possible to discuss the issues without such language.
Wade Burleson belongs to, and promotes, the John Birch Society.
The longer one lives and acknowledges specific consequences for specific sins, the less one engages in those sins.
Learning the hard way is a fact, as we err, then change.
Cheap grace is the false illusion that it doesn’t matter and there are no consequences. Jesus died and rose to put us on a higher path but not to provide a pass for anything goes, i.e., the low life.
Sorry about what you went through in church. Thx for sharing.
Nowadays, part of church engagement requires sorting out myth & magical thinking from higher ground and what is, from God’s POV. (This observation is not meant to victim blame.)
Marketing 101. The customer is always right.
Definitely not Jesus’ message, nor John the Baptist (Luke 3.8) nor Peter (Acts 3.8).
Zacchaeus repented with fruit via reparations to all he violated. He did NOT do a mega tithe, which is another false teaching from church leaders (get you on your knees then empty your pockets).
Friend,
As a Brit I knew nothing about the John Birch Society so I have researched it, looking first at the JBS page which sets out their governing idea and their aims. It also deals with various myths and attacks made upon them. What exactly do you disagree with?
McCarthyism.
Birchers used to visit my family and corner me as a small child. They do not practice traditional American conservatism.
Christianity Lite prospers in the American church when the pew is driving the pulpit message. Bill Hybels was successful with his Willow Creek model for doing church because he asked the people what they wanted and then got out in front to lead them. Give them what they want sells everywhere … don’t talk about sin, don’t talk about repentance, don’t talk about holiness, make me feel good. Big screens, fog machines and skinny jeans will draw a crowd, but Jesus doesn’t join them in their display of cheap grace.
Thank you, Max, for this list. Lite and feel-good church services have been a problem for a long time in the US and elsewhere. It’s also a problem when a service is designed to make people feel bad, to detest themselves and others.
But there is another way, an uplifting way. The services that work best for me are those that inspire confidence: I can get through this daunting week, I can be kinder and more patient, I can recover from this misfortune, I can help others. Jesus met people where they were, and gave hope to the willing. Some repented swiftly and dramatically, but others sat at his feet and listened, and slowly changed.
IMHO, the core problem in most churches is the absence of the Holy Spirit at work. We have grieved and quenched the Spirit in many churches, relegating Him and His ministry to the back pew. We don’t seek Him as we ought, indicating we can do church without Him. When the Holy Spirit is present and active in a Body of Believers, He will draw the unsaved to Christ, convict both unbelievers and believers of sin, teach us, draw us closer to the Lord, help and comfort us, bring us joy in the Lord, anoint us with His power. Sometimes we feel bad before we feel good … it’s sorta like my recent bout with Covid.
Friend,
Dear Friend,
I am so sorry you had some very bad experiences at the hands of”Birchers”when you were a child. However, you have not pointed out what is wrong with their philosophy as delineated in their writings. Could you point out their errors please.
It is interesting that you seem to be defending a group you just heard about today, and implying… what? That the Birchers I knew for decades were not representative of the group? That I do not grasp what they were doing?
I will assume that you genuinely want to understand. Birchers believe that communists are everywhere. Their approach to anyone who questions them is this: “You must be a communist! Prove you’re not!”
That is McCarthyism in a nutshell. McCarthyism damaged the United States. That is a topic worthy of study.
Since you are from the UK, I will offer a very rough parallel from my own time there. Under Margaret Thatcher, there was a distinction between the Conservative Party and the National Front, with perhaps some overlapping sentiments. I never saw anyone ask supporters of the Conservative Party or the Labour Party to use National Front literature to explain their own viewpoints. (To be clear, I have no idea what the NF is doing today.)
Fringe groups do exist, and sometimes they look wholesome in their best clothes and polite language.
The John Birch Society contends that the United States is a republic, not a democracy. Republics are defined by who is a citizen vs people in general who make up the country.
Given that the John Birch Society opposed the civil rights movement, you can extrapolate who they consider a “citizen”.
That’s only one thing that’s wrong with it.
Where did you get that definition? Ive always seen if defined like this:
https://www.britannica.com/topic/republic-government
I’m saying the same thing. The US is not a direct democracy but is defined by who is or is not a “citizen”.
From the definition you cited
“Because citizens do not govern the state themselves but through representatives, republics may be distinguished from direct democracy, though modern representative democracies are by and large republics. The term republic may also be applied to any form of government in which the head of state is not a hereditary monarch.”
Based on what the JBS has believed in the past, a certain demographic should have more citizen rights than the others.
I’m no fan of JBS. It sounded like you were making a connection between JBS and people who believe we are a republic. If so, that is a false connection. In some ways I think one could argue we are more like an oligarchy, given how politicians from all sides become multimillionaires by the time they leave. Right now there is a scandal over whether or not people in congress should be blocked from insider trading. Why does that even need to be a discussion?
Does Canada allow non-citizens to vote? I’m wondering how different the voting rules are from the US.
Nope, only citizens can vote in Canada but our system of voting is different since it’s a constitutional monarchy with a parliamentary government. No electoral colleges.
From Wikipedia on JBS
“The John Birch Society supports limited government and contends that the United States is a republic, not a democracy.[19] It opposes collectivism and, by extension, communism and big government.[20] It also opposes wealth redistribution, economic interventionism, totalitarianism, and anarchism.”
Rome was a republic too. But not all inhabitants could vote. Seems to be what the JBS leans towards. Select few voting, probably a certain demographic.
Let me clarify since the US has the green card and Canada has landed immigrant status.
If JBS is anti democratic then it seems they propose only a select few could ever be defined as citizens with voting rights.
No doubt, the “right” people.
I know very little about JBS, but I don’t see any red flags in that quote. A huge number of Americans would agree with that quote. Also, recognizing we are a republic is not anti-democratic. It just recognizes we have a system where not every issue is voted on by every person. True democracy means the minority doesn’t have a voice, so there is also that. I should probably research JBS, but I don’t have time and they are not getting any attention in the current news as far as I know.
Jack,
The group promotes its views through fear and rumors. To oppose civil rights, they claimed there was a huge plot to turn the southeastern US into a Soviet Socialist republic ruled by African Americans. That might sound kooky, but it frightened a lot of southerners. This also played out in shrill, sustained efforts to keep schools segregated, and very personal pressure to prevent teens and young adults from doing what was called interracial dating.
Every citizen in the United States has a vote and inalienable rights enshrined in the constitution.
By defining “citizen” you can alter who controls the conversation.
As mentioned, Rome was a republic (for a while anyway) – but not every “citizen” had the right to vote. And not everyone in the empire was considered a citizen.
There’s lots of ways a group can agitate in such a way to ensure the marginalized do not or have a challenge to excercise those rights.
The US has the “one person, one vote” concept, by contending the US is not a democracy tells me JBS does not believe in this principle.
Alternately though, it’s possible they prefer “true democracy” where the majority steamrolls the minority, meaning they are against the constitution.
Either way, optics aren’t good.
I’ve long held to this view, that we (the US) are an oligarchy.
But the US is is technically a constitutional republic rather than a democracy. We use the word democracy loosely, but it is not the correct term. One person one vote only applies to state and local elections, which includes voting for representatives. The only people who vote on federal issues are our elected representatives (which includes electors). That is what makes us a republic rather than a democracy. I don’t doubt that JBS has problems, but I don’t see how calling the US a republic is one of those problems.
Ken F (aka Tweed),
Agreed, there are elements of both republican and democratic practices, with a gradual trend toward more direct representation. Some of these issues seem antique, since women and African Americans can vote. But a few folks here will remember the huge arguments about lowering the voting age to 18.
There’s constant low-level skirmishing about voting rights for people who live within the boundaries of Washington, DC. Since they are not a state, they lack US representatives and senators. They could not vote in presidential elections until the 23rd Amendment was passed.
(I’m not arguing for or against DC statehood, but it’s a current example. In case anybody does not know, DC has a larger population than two states, yet there’s long-standing reluctance to give even more influence to the capital city. Countries around the world struggle with this issue in different ways.)
On August 27, 2021 just before midnight Wade Burleson wrote a post on Facebook which included the following EXACT wording:
“Our Founders feared a democracy. One person, one vote – no, they said. Only the educated, the self-sufficient (land owners), the intellectual and moral should vote. We scoff at them now? Why? They formed a Republic. They recognized that a Republic only stands as long as its citizens are a moral people. The moment a Democracy takes over and every person realizes they can vote for whoever promises them the most free money, the Republic has fallen.”
He soon deleted that post. I have a screenshot of it saved on my computer, as I was appalled to see that he was promoting limiting ANY voting rights to only a subset of citizens. This is his idea of a Republic. I consider it an oligarchy. And now he is running for a Congressional office. I think people should be aware of his personal beliefs on voting rights.
It seems like it could use some updates to take into account new realities, but any attempt to change it would be like trying to sort a box of loose hangers.
Ken F (aka Tweed),
It’s a republic sure, but each citizen has the right to cast a vote. For all levels of government.
Federally there are the electoral colleges, which aggregate votes but a vote is still a vote.
That’s a form of democracy.
Not saying it’s perfect but when an organization starts to play word games with that concept, they’re up to something, usually a centralized power structure that benefits their agenda.
If you can get people believing their vote doesn’t matter then all the better.
That’s how elections work. That’s how administrations change.
The US may not always live up that ideal in realpolitik but the concept is democratic.
🙂
The actual period word was “Miscegenation”.
“You’ll always have Nazis among you,
You’ll always have Nazis among you;
Next time they won’t come in brown shirts or boots,
They’ll come speaking softly in three-piece suits,
But you’ll always have Nazis among you…”
— Donna Barr, The Desert Peach: The Musical, closing aria
That’s also the Cold War-era John Birch Society. Seeing COMMUNIST Conspiracy in every closet and under every bed.
Just like Spiritual Warfare types seeing DEMONS in every closet and under every bed.
Or the David Icke branch of QAnoners seeiing shapeshifted cannibal alien lizards in every closet and under every bed. (which these days overlaps with the one immediately above.)
THEY’RE AFTER YOUR CHILDREN! THEY’RE HERE! THEY’RE THERE! THEY’RE EVERYWHERE! SO BEWARE!!!
We could argue about this all night, but there is no getting around the fact that the US is a constitutional republic and not a true democracy. As far as vote counting goes, they only count for state and local elections, nothing at the federal level. Our votes here for anything at the federal level, including presidential elections, is through the representatives we vote for at the state level. We have no popular vote for the president or for any other federal issues. It does not mean our votes don’t count, they just count in a different way. For example, if someone votes red in a heavily blue state (or vice versa), their vote won’t make a difference, but it still counts.
On paper, sure. In real life, it was a woman asking her friend’s daughter, “Susie, you’d never date a black guy, would you?”
All answers were traps.
Your Honour, the prosecution rests it’s case….
You still have a vote.
Anyway apparently Wade said it best himself what type of republic he want to be part of. See Ruth’s post above. I rest my case. Always a pleasure, Ken.
I don’t understand why you keep poking at me. I never denied people having a vote, I was just explaining the realities of our system. Some votes certainly make more of a difference than others, and those votes are typically in states that are somewhat evenly divided. For example, in the last US election it would have only taken a difference of a few tens of thousands of votes in key counties to change the outcome for president, and even less for control of the senate. Whether or not the system should work like this is a topic of debate right now. Neither side is happy when the system results in their loss.
If JBS is currently pushing something that would limit voting, I am not aware of it because I barely even know about the group, and it’s not making any waves in the main stream media that I am aware of. If Wade is pushing something that will limit voting I hope he states it clearly so that voters can make an informed decision.
Ruth,
Thank you immensely for posting this. It fits with other solid information.
No poking intended. Rest easy, Ken. We’re cool.
I now return to my lurking already in progress.
Take care.
Dee,s Mom: “I’m 93. I can say what I want!”
Haa! I remember my Grandad saying the same thing in his 90’s
Where he’s one of The Highborn Elite who’s allowed to vote.
“I’m 71. I have a right to be alive, Lady. I’m going to die soon.”
— Mel Brooks, “The Critic”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PramR5oxn50