Lookout Mountain Presbyterian Church and the G.R.A.C.E Investigation Which Discovered Multiple Sex Abuse Victims. What’s Going on With PCA Pastor and Alleged Abuser Paul Warren?

Stephen’s Quintet- There are 5 and 4 are in the process of merging.-Hubble

“In his study of 561 sex offenders, Dr. Gene Abel found pedophiles who targeted young boys outside the home committed the greatest number of crimes with an average of 281.7 acts …”


Once again I would like to thank a reader for calling attention to the developments in this situation. In so doing, I also discovered that *something is going on* at Paul Warren’s church. Abbot Memorial Presbyterian Church (now apparently known as Abbott Church) in Baltimore. In May of 2020. I wrote the following two posts.

Here is an overview to catch you up on what happened and the good response of Lookout Mountain Presbyterian Church (PCA.) LMPC is the abbreviation that I will use for convenience.

  • In June 2019, an inquiry concerning potential past sexual abuse by an individual previously associated with LMPC came to me. Immediately, I formed a small committee, which was soon approved by the Session, to investigate further. After a careful internal investigation, we learned of multiple incidents of alleged abuse from a summer youth intern over 35 years ago who was also a volunteer during the school year. The alleged offender, whose name is Paul Warren, is now a member of a Presbytery in another state, within our denomination. (Ed. note: Abbott Memorial Presbyterian Church aka Abbott Church in Baltimore, MD.)
  • Two letters (2019, 2010) were sent to the Chesapeake Presbytery notifying them of the abuse.
  • This was a confusing situation for the church because it appeared the activity may have happened about 35 years ago. Also, there was an inquiry as opposed to an accusation. This church notified the Session and started to look into what may have happened. They learned the worst. It appears that there were multiple incidents that had occurred and that these could be traced to one summer intern. (Ed Note: Another abuser, Tony Marcano was identified and other victims were found.)
  • The church even met with the victims offering them support which included professional counseling. Many churches, including one I know very well, refuse to offer professional counseling since their families “can afford it.”They also did the right thing by not releasing the names of the victims, at the request of those victims, which is the right move. Many of these victims had never spoken of their abuse which is quite typical and the emotional pain is significant as this process begins. Kudos to this church which made them feel safe to speak of their abuse.
  • LMPC asked G.R.A.C.E. to come into the church to investigate.

A complete summary of what transpired before and after the G.R.A.C.E. report is available, for now, on the LMPC website.

Go to this link to see the LMPC page. The written Grace report and the response of LMPC can be found there. I downloaded the documents. The following lengthy, transparent, and informative video posted on January 19. 2021 which gives us thorough information from the perspective of LMPC leadership. Show this to your pastors so they can see how the Lead Pastor, Brian Salter, handles this. It is well worth your time.

Some information from the video. Please let me know if I skipped anything important.

  • All abuse was perpetrated on minors.
  • LMPC reported the abuse to the Chesapeake Presbytery twice.
  • LMPC reported the abuse to the police who informed them that the Statute of Limitations has passed.
  • LMPC reported this to the Baltimore City Schools where Tony Marcano is reportedly employed, including all former employers.
  • LMPC revealed that one victim of Tony Marcano allegedly reported this to the pastors at the time.
    Those pastors allegedly did not report this to the police and the current staff was not made aware of this.
  • There has been no substantive repentance on the part of Warren and there has been no contact with Marcano.
  • The pastor gave a great explanation of why Matthew 18 is often misused in cases of abuse.
  • Pastor Salter clearly stated that some sins are worse than others. By doing so he avoided the silly argument that *all sins are equal* argument.
  • Any PCA judicial process must be in the hands of the Chesapeake Presbytery according to PCA church polity.
  • He stressed that this wasn’t just a sin. It was criminal activity by spiritual leaders in the church.
  • Salter claims there are other victims who did not come forward and expressed concern about more unknown victims by these two molesters.
  • He mentioned the two posts at TWW and said that they were favorable to LMPC. He’s correct.

One disagreement I have with Salter’s comments.

He claims that sexual abuse has risen due to the sexual revolution/Hugh Hefner. I disagree. I believe that sexual abuse has always been around and has always been hidden because *good people don’t talk about these things.* People who abuse minors are not *sexually liberated.” They are molesters and pedophiles. People with normal sexual drives will only have sexual relations with other consenting adults. Pedophiles and molesters have serious psychiatric disabilities. They have a desire for non-consensual relations with adults (like rape) or relationships with minors who, by law, cannot give consent. Many people with these abnormal desires will struggle with them for a lifetime, even with intervention.

The sexually violent, pedophiles, and those with other paraphilias have been around for millennia. These persons are even found in the Bible. Pederasty and pedophilia were found in ancient Greece and Rome,  Women have been abused and raped throughout history. There was a reason that God gave the Law condemning rape. See this link regarding Genesis 19, Genesis 34, and many more passages. I wish we could blame this on the 60s and Hugh Hefner. Sadly, it is part of the Fall.  That is why we need to get smart. Churches will attract those who molest and rape. It is a trusting environment. Who could imagine that a nice youth pastor would ever molest a student? Jules Woodson, a high school student, learned that hard lesson.

I would like to recommend two papers from the NIH for consideration.

Is something going on with Paul Warren and his church?

The link in my initial post took me to Abbott Memorial Presbyterian Church. Now it takes me to a website called Join My Church. Each time I check it, information is disappearing. In the meantime, this website has popped up for Abbott Church. I double-checked looking at the address and church affiliation to see if it was the same church and it is.

Now, here is where it gets interesting. On the Abbott Church site, mash the *staff* button. The only staff member noted is Julius Fisher who appears to be in charge of the music. On the other site, scroll down and Paul Warren is listed as pastor. 

So what’s going on? I was told by one source that Warren is still active as a pastor in the PCA because the abuse happened long ago and he has had no further claims against him. However, concern was raised after more victims came forward. Paul Warren’s name and Abbott Memorial Presbyterian Church are still listed on the Chesapeake Presbytery’s website.

So, what’s going on? Are the recent statements by LMPC and G.R.A.C.E having an effect? Let’s watch and see. I would appreciate any input from readers as they learn new information. I will post it as it develops.

Finally…

Once again, I am grateful to LMPC for demonstrating how to be transparent, while taking positive steps in dealing with a terrible situation. That lengthy video was great! I listened to the whole thing. Please, LMPC, don’t ever take it down. I will use it as an example to other churches.

My heart goes out to the victims and it is my hope that Paul Warren NEVER disgraces a pulpit again. Chesapeake Presbytery…the ball is in your court. Do the right thing.

Comments

Lookout Mountain Presbyterian Church and the G.R.A.C.E Investigation Which Discovered Multiple Sex Abuse Victims. What’s Going on With PCA Pastor and Alleged Abuser Paul Warren? — 58 Comments


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    1


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    When I was 15 a teacher appeared to be carrying on somehow, with a boy (a boys only non-church school) and the teacher left.

    Later when I was doing the born again thing as it was being fashionably construed at the time, I joined a Christian Union at the school and found it hysterical and manic (a meme that stayed with me decades); the same man ought to have been supervising it and they hadn’t replaced him.

    Tracing back to when a large denomination was setting a bad example by abolishing not only belief but prayer, that perhaps was when a larger hole got torn in the spiritual ozone layer, or when the cells that keep spiritual candida down to level 2 weren’t sustained enough.

    I think God planned the sexual revolution and the concomitant phase of the charismatic, and the environment movement, and improvements to business ethics, without christians cramping the style of secular agnostics – but what with some christian leaders urging diminished method, reason, belief & prayer in parallel, the christians weren’t as well able to collaborate wholesomely and unobtrusively as God wanted, except in some cases for some time (and continuing).

    Show-offs in churches, parachurches and churches-within-churches increasingly devised fleshly ways of throwing their weight around vis-a-vis the public as well as their own. This falls broadly into two identical groups, those who deny Holy Spirit flat out, and those who attempt to ration Him to those “gifts” that fulfil their image, with crossovers & chameleons for non-variety. Of course not forgetting those who pretend to be outside all that.

    I’ve said an Our Father and a Glory Be this morning for just quality of government everywhere, and for belief and prayer among christians.


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    Michael in UK,

    I meant to add at penultimate para., that like the fathers Paul addressed, towards their children, intolerant attitudes provoked counterreactions, to which many agnostics of true goodwill have sincerely attached themselves. Christians are the ones called to pray, not the dominions of society.


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    From the opening post:

    I believe that sexual abuse has always been around and has always been hidden because *good people don’t talk about these things.* People who abuse minors are not *sexually liberated.” They are molesters and pedophiles.

    That.


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    ” was told by one source that Warren is still active as a pastor in the PCA because the abuse happened long ago and he has had no further claims against him.” (Dee)

    There should be no statute of limitations for child abuse. There should be no pastors in American churches who “were” pedophiles and molesters, with or without a show of repentance. There should be no American churches which restore them to the sacred office of pastor. They have permanently disqualified themselves from ministry.

    Otherwise, “Churches will attract those who molest and rape. It is a trusting environment.” (Dee)

    Restore them to ministry? NO! Have we become so open-minded in the American church that our spiritual brains have fallen out?!!


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    Max: Otherwise, “Churches will attract those who molest and rape. It is a trusting environment.” (Dee)

    And church is their sacred, IOW, protected hunting ground.


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    Max: “Churches will attract those who molest and rape. It is a trusting environment.” (Dee)

    Protect or ignore or hide or mask or “understand” or explain or “forgive” this behavior (or silence/gaslight/bully/shade/blame the witnesses, i.e. victims) and you have created a sanctuary for this behavior: pedos, bullies, power mongers, narcissists, evil doers, rapists, predators, etc. Church.


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    Still more proof that Sexual Predation is a Privilege of Pastoral Rank.
    i.e. For PRIESTS Only (even if they don’t call themselves by that Romish title).
    “TOUCH NOT MINE ANOINTED!!!!!”


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    He is no longer the pastor – in his most recent sermon from 1/24 , he said it was his last.


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    Headless Unicorn Guy: “TOUCH NOT MINE ANOINTED!!!!!”

    Well, they are gonna’ get touched, and if it’s shown in a court of law that they did indeed sexually molest minors, they’re goin’ to jail for a spell.
    How’s that for the ‘anointed’?
    So how’s them apples?


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    Ava Aaronson,

    You make an interesting observation…
    . I have now spent 41 years in the secular humanist world.. ( undergrad through 33 years as a faculty member). While I am not saying my “world” is pious, I do not know of any sexual predators, or significant crimes..
    However, at my fundy 7-12 grade, I know at least two predators, one that was gromming me in the 7th grade (and years laters was CONVICTED and sent to prison, for hideous crimes to underage boys at another school after being passed along).
    Given all the exposure over the last couple of decades, I really do think the “ Church” (all flavors) is a “breading ground” ….. sigh…


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    Max: There should be no statute of limitations for child abuse. There should be no pastors in American churches who “were” pedophiles and molesters, with or without a show of repentance. There should be no American churches which restore them to the sacred office of pastor. They have permanently disqualified themselves from ministry.

    This.^^^^^


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    Ava Aaronson: And church is their sacred, IOW, protected hunting ground.

    And this.^^^^


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    As of this past Sunday, he resigned.


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    Muff Potter: if it’s shown in a court of law that they did indeed sexually molest minors,

    Unless the SOL has run out which is the problem in this situation.


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    Anon.,

    In the most recent sermon, he said it would be his last.


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    Jeffrey Chalmers: While I am not saying my “world” is pious, I do not know of any sexual predators, or significant crimes..
    However, at my fundy 7-12 grade, I know at least two predators, one that was gromming me in the 7th grade (and years laters was CONVICTED and sent to prison, for hideous crimes to underage boys at another school after being passed along).
    Given all the exposure over the last couple of decades, I really do think the “ Church” (all flavors) is a “breading ground”

    I am in total agreement with you. Can you describe how he groomed you? I don’t think most people understand that the key to catching these pedos is to be able to spot the initial stages.


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    So, do you all think something is going on at Warren’s church? Th. change in websites, the change in name, his removal at the more *trendy* website, etc. seems out of the ordinary.


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    dee:
    So, do you all think something is going on at Warren’s church? Th. change in websites, the change in name, his removal at the more *trendy* website, etc. seems out of the ordinary.

    He has stepped down as of 1/24/21 sermon indicates.


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    yes, Paul Warren and his bio have been disappeared from the Staff page of the Abbott Church PCA website.

    were there when you first wrote about this last year:

    Internet Archive, May 2020, Abbott Church PCA, Pastor Paul Warren
    https://web.archive.org/web/20200529160414/https://abbottchurch.org/about/staff/

    But he’s still there preaching (per current Sermons and Bulletins):

    https://abbottchurch.org/bulletins/


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    dee,

    In some states, sex offenses involving minors, or violent crimes like kidnapping or arson, have no statute of limitations.


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    Jeffrey Chalmers: the “Church” (all flavors) is a “breeding ground” …

    … for “They have no sense of shame. They live for lustful pleasure and eagerly practice every kind of impurity” (Ephesians 4:19). Unfortunately, “They” = the pulpit in far too many places!!


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    Oh…video from last Sunday at Abbott Church PCA:

    https://www.pscp.tv/w/1yoJMArmjNOJQ

    35:30
    “This is my farewell address, this is my final Sunday in the pulpit as the Pastor of Abbott Church. I know that this comes as a shock for many of you…”


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    40:15 “Significant sin that I committed when I was a college student has been brought to light in a very public way, and it’s caused significant pain for many people.”

    41:25 “My heart is broken over this. I want to say clearly, that I acknowledge this impact, and the pain some of you are feeling right now, and I ask for forgiveness. My hope and my prayer is that my resignation will bring healing and grace to many, particularly to Abbott Church.”


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    dee: Th. change in websites, the change in name, his removal at the more *trendy* website, etc. seems out of the ordinary.

    That.


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    Jerome: 40:15 “Significant sin that I committed when I was a college student has been brought to light in a very public way, and it’s caused significant pain for many people.”

    41:25 “My heart is broken over this. I want to say clearly, that I acknowledge this impact, and the pain some of you are feeling right now, and I ask for forgiveness. My hope and my prayer is that my resignation will bring healing and grace to many, particularly to Abbott Church.”

    The quote time-stamped 40:15 sounds more like “Ooops….they found me out.”

    The quote time-stamped 41:25 sounds like a load of horse-puckies (aka horse poo-poo).


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    The Bible passage at the beginning the sermon uses Paul’s farewell address as he headed to Jerusalem, where Paul proclaimed his innocence… and good intentions. (the farewell address at Abbott Church)


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    Sounds like a repeat of the old mantra (like in Jules’ case) “over 20 yrs ago” – as if that makes it non-important.


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    Jeffrey Chalmers: 41 years in the secular humanist world… (undergrad through 33 years as a faculty member). While I am not saying my “world” is pious, I do not know of any sexual predators, or significant crimes…

    Higher Ed?

    “No university or charity or scientific society has been more closely associated in the public eye with Jeffrey Epstein than Harvard University, which received approximately $9 million from him over the years.

    “And no organization has seemingly been more adamant that it had nothing to explain, nothing to review, nothing to refund — even after Epstein later became the nation’s most notorious sexual predator.

    “That silence ended Thursday.” – Miami Herald: “After ‘deafening silence,’ Harvard opens review of Jeffrey Epstein’s ties to university” BY ROB WILE SEPTEMBER 13, 2019.

    Weinstein? Ronan Farrow walked across the street to the New Yorker & wrote “she said”, “she said”, “she said”, etc. after years of having been unchecked.
    Epstein? Thank God for Julie K. Brown at the Miami Herald. Beating the legal system repeatedly until … finally …
    Cosby? A standup joke went viral (comedian Buress), dozens of women came forward, after a failed trial… but went to trial again.
    Savage? From Savage’s comment about Matt Lauer (?) to Jules Woodson to TWW to the NYT to a Memphis(?) church resignation … tip of the iceberg. Tip. One ice crystal.

    Evangeo goons, graft, greed? Dee, the TWW community & others shine light. Julie K. Brown recommends: keep at it. The Tipping Point? Not evident. Yet.

    Podcasts like “Chasing Cosby” or “Broken” (re: Julie K. Brown’s) document the long haul to raze strongholds. Pedos & predos have the upper hand in “church” right now – their sanctuary, as documented by the Houston Chronicle.


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    Ava Aaronson,

    I was referring only to the faculty I personally, or professionally interact with in my years in higher ed..
    Of course there are plenty of faculty that commit sexual crimes at the Big U!!
    Just that the rate seems high at Churches, AND my only personal experiences was when I was groomed by MY 7 th grade teacher at my fundamentalist school.
    I will post later how he did it..


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    cite=”comment-440373″>
    Of course there are plenty of faculty that commit sexual crimesat the Big U!!
    Just that the rate seems high at Churches, AND my only personal experiences was when I was groomed by MY 7 th grade teacher at my fundamentalist school.
    I will post later how he did it..

    This is sooo important! The grooming process should be emphasized in this type of thread so red flags will be more apparent by parents, teachers, etc. The grooming is the way the predator gains the trust of the victims.

    I’m interested in hearing your experience, Jeffrey.


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    Victorious,

    I like what Dee has said on several occasions on TWW, namely that these “predators” seek out Churches which have loose rules, and are gullible….


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    Jeffrey J Chalmers: I will post later how he did it..

    Victorious: This is sooo important!

    Yes!

    Just putting this out there – the “gawd” angle or theological heresy bent or the danger of church trust in how it plays out in Evangeo or as you write, “fundy” circles. Your insight.

    Better to be wise as serpents as to how to prevent, and innocent as doves.

    Victorious: This is sooo important!


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    Jeffrey J Chalmers: Churches which have loose rules

    loose rules for some and strict discipline for others …


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    Ava Aaronson,

    But even those with strict discipline, in many cases, only apply to the oew peons, not the ruling elite… the same in the heathen, secular world..


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    Jerome: 41:25 “My heart is broken over this. I want to say clearly, that I acknowledge this impact, and the pain some of you are feeling right now, and I ask for forgiveness. My hope and my prayer is that my resignation will bring healing and grace to many, particularly to Abbott Church.”

    As usual, no mention of the devastating impact of his sin on the victims, .and no prayer for their healing and grace most of all


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    SarahM,

    Exactly…. it shows you where their heart is…
    Just like all the other church abuse… think of the “spiritual devastation” to children when priest/preachers molest them!!


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    Muff Potter: Well, they are gonna’ get touched, and if it’s shown in a court of law that they did indeed sexually molest minors, they’re goin’ to jail for a spell.
    How’s that for the ‘anointed’?
    So how’s them apples?

    They already anticipated you, Potter:
    “PERSECUTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!”


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    Max: There should be no statute of limitations for child abuse. There should be no pastors in American churches who “were” pedophiles and molesters, with or without a show of repentance. There should be no American churches which restore them to the sacred office of pastor. They have permanently disqualified themselves from ministry.

    But…
    “All these Pastors said one to another:
    ‘Pastor unto Pastor o’er the world is Brother!'”
    P.S. “HE SCOOOOOOORED! HEH-HUH! HEH-HUH! HEH-HUH!”
    (dudebro fist-bump!)


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    Ava Aaronson: Jeffrey J Chalmers: Churches which have loose rules

    loose rules for some and strict discipline for others …

    RANK HATH ITS PRIVILEGES.


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    Headless Unicorn Guy: They already anticipated you, Potter:
    “PERSECUTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!”

    They can howl persecution all they want, sex abuse of minors IS A CRIME in all 50 states, and law enforcement will agressively enforce the law.
    All parishioners have to do is report it instead of being scared to do so out of fear for their own so-called ‘salvation’.
    The predators count on this fear to give them the cover they need in order to operate with impunity.


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    I agree with every word but one

    | “Pedophiles and molesters have serious psychiatric disabilities”

    that last word should be “disorders” in my opinion


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    Because the SOL runs out, doesn’t mean he stopped molesting young boys. Would a class action suet by all of his past victims be effective? Wasn’t that what brought out victims where the SOL didn’t out?

    Yes, I do think the his church is still doing damage control.


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    Brian:
    Because the SOL runs out, doesn’t mean he stopped molesting young boys. Would a class action suet by all of his past victims be effective? Wasn’t that what brought out victims where the SOL didn’t out?

    Sorry, Bill Cosby’s victims.

    Yes, I do think the his church is still doing damage control.


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    d4v1d:
    I agree with every word but one

    | “Pedophiles and molesters have serious psychiatric disabilities”

    that last word should be “disorders” in my opinion

    The word disabilities implies lack of accountability.


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    alaska shivers: The Bible passage at the beginning the sermon uses Paul’s farewell address as he headed to Jerusalem, where Paul proclaimed his innocence… and good intentions. (the farewell address at Abbott Church)

    It should be clear to all that “Pastor” Warren is no Paul! A more appropriate passage from Paul would be “I am grieved that you have sinned earlier and have not repented of the impurity, sexual sin and debauchery in which you have indulged” (2 Cor 12). Farewell, Mr. Warren, farewell.


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    Muff Potter: All parishioners have to do is report it instead of being scared to do so out of fear for their own so-called ‘salvation’.
    The predators count on this fear to give them the cover they need in order to operate with impunity.

    The threat of Eternal Hell can be quite a motivator or inhibitor.
    During my time in-country, that type of Fear Manipulation (“Don’t be Left Behind!”) was so common I was surprised when I DIDN’T encounter it.


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    Headless Unicorn Guy: The threat of Eternal Hell can be quite a motivator or inhibitor.

    Which is the whole reason for ‘getting saved’ in the first place.
    To keep you (generic you) from being cast into the lake of fire along with the beast and the false prophet on judgement day.
    It’s a fear based religion.


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    Jeffrey Chalmers,

    https://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/sep/24/john-lydon-says-he-was-banned-from-bbc-over-jimmy-savile-comments

    (TOTP was a pop music TV show and Savile its host for a while; its live audience was mainly girls in their early teens. He later posed as “fixing it” for selected children and had his own suite at a children’s hospital.)

    I met a traumatised BBC (studio) cameraman in the mid 1980s.

    When I was 14 a new crop of teachers at my (secular) school told us boys we should consider having sex outside marriage. Was this meme planting an attempt at moral equivalence and smoke cover – well the young boys are going to be doing things to them anyway.

    Well obviously some of this went on before but it was “our” idea and not the authorities. Authority pushing this onto the young is very different from us swopping innuendoes amongst ourselves.

    At least one other boy spoke of being predated by a non-teacher after that.

    Some theologians have commented that previous to this was when the more allegedly “mainstream” evangelising took a bigger turn to shallowness indicating lesser ability in churches to help uphold morale, with results Jeffrey has also testified.


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    Muff Potter,

    Here’s an imagination broadening exercise to challenge the Leaders of the Designer Outlet Churches. Suppose a hypothesis that a lake of fire was what might befall Earth in nature (and astronomers for example still don’t know a lot of things until days before they happen), how then would God devise a way of getting as many as poss. of the public out from it through us Christians?

    (I don’t know if anyone can cope with imagination, or hypothesis, any more.)

    Now suppose another hypothesis, apparently fairly different, but with God still wanting to achieve the same result. Have Leaders of the Designer Outlet Churches ceased to promulgate P for Perseverance in Holy Spirit strength, which the public are longing to catch sight of in us? Have Leaders of the Designer Outlet Churches ceased to promulgate belief and prayer? Are Leaders of the Designer Outlet Churches blaspheming Providence with their image of ease?


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    This may be only somewhat related, but this NY Times article showed up in my home newsfeeds. It’s about Toxic Masculinity (baptized as Biblical Manhood(TM)), a root cause of a lot of the churches and attitudes of the Godly called out on this blog:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/us/masks-toxic-masculinity-covid-men-gender.html

    Keep attacking the root causes, not the symptoms.


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    Michael in UK: (I don’t know if anyone can cope with imagination, or hypothesis, any more.)

    Christians(TM) sure can’t.
    “SCRIPTURE! SCRIPTURE! SCRIPTURE! FACT! FACT! FACT!”

    Never mind that most of the Bible was written down from oral tradition at a time when there was NO “Math Truth”, only “Poem Truth”. Today we read and verse-by-single-verse exigete the Poem Truth as if it were Math Truth.

    P.S. Have you heard that the term “Lake of Fire” could have been a period idiom for a volcanic vent? (Lots of volcanoes in Italy and Greece, i.e. the Empire.) Take a look at any livecam of Halemaumau at Kilauea’s summit for a contemporary example.


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    Headless Unicorn Guy,

    Sadly those Leaders haven’t a wholeome vision for our perseverance near those either.

    Christians (TM-not) need more:

    – imagination
    – philosophy
    – repetition

    It’s only the vain kinds we don’t need.


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    Headless Unicorn Guy,

    My comments are usually just fragments of what is going on in me. Reeling from several successive rounds of cognive dissonance resultant upon spiritual teachers’ and peers’ messing with my credence, I’m now determined to forgive them rationally (there might be “something in” all their water supply) (which forgiveness I may not be able to communicate to them however). I equally have to double check the rationality of the content of my beliefs: what might we be saved FROM, WHO does God wish to be eligible, to what extent are we involved in helping OTHERS be saved. Certainly the cosmic and seismic events we discussed may be metaphors; they may be parallels or they may be analogies. They are almost certainly more than one layer of meaning. What does “everlasting” mean outside or beyond or in parallel to time? It is truly dismaying and sad beyond compare, when we get to know, or to know of, spiritual teachers that traduce the gospel that is hard won to each of us. In the case of those who weren’t in my own life (but reading about them “triggers” me) I have to detach all the more and the only remedy within my grasp is to live out my gospel all the better – especially by praying (TM-not). To care for others’ integrity I have to first look to my own.

    researcher,

    These behaviours are now boasted of in order to prove that the elite (in whatever movement) aren’t elite (and to heavily imply that the rest of us are just as bad).


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    Headless Unicorn Guy: Toxic Masculinity (baptized as Biblical Manhood(TM))

    While other authoritarian religious groups exhibit this toxin, the New Calvinists have a particularly bad dose of it. Driscoll’s bad-boy legacy is still apparent in NeoCal ranks. The “freedom from” attitude within certain segments of the church is an abuse of Christian liberty if it affects the health and well-being of others. MacArthur’s (et al.) resistance to government mandates designed to stop COVID spread is religious malfeasance, IMO. Wearing a mask, sanitizing yourself, and maintaining a social distance are some of the most Godly, “masculine” things you can do during this health crisis.


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    Max: The “freedom from” attitude within certain segments of the church is an abuse of Christian liberty if it affects the health and well-being of others. MacArthur’s (et al.) resistance to government mandates designed to stop COVID spread is religious malfeasance

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/us/masks-toxic-masculinity-covid-men-gender.html