Forgiveness is a virtue of the brave. Indira Gandhi
Will we actually see churches booted from the SBC? Probably not.
I have some bad news. I think it is highly unlikely that any churches will get *disfellowshipped* from the SBC. I now predict that the SBC leaders will meet with these recalcitrant churches who will then produce *crocodile tears.” That church will then adopt the recommended procedures, publicly repent and be forgiven. Standing ovations will be the norm. Watch for the leaders to get on the ground on a stage somewhere and pray feverishly and shed many tears. There is no group who can do this like the Baptists.
I’ve been suspicious about this process since Greear first announced the ten churches they were considering being given the title “not in friendly cooperation* with the SBC. In my previous post, I expressed concerns that Ed Young at 2nd Baptist and CJ Mahaney at SGC Louisville know where the bodies are buried. I believe this could possibly lead to a path in which they would be reinstated.
I also believe that tiny churches with little influence in the SBC could be the ones who might be chosen to be “examples of how really, really serious we are.”
I hope that I’m wrong about this. I would love to see SGC get the boot. The same goes for 2nd Baptist. They deserve to be embarrassed. I’m praying that my prediction for reinstatement (or never getting kicked out) is proven wrong. If so, I will be sure to point it out. If I forget-remind me.
Phillip Bethancourt who serves on the SBC Sex Abuse Study Group released this following information via Twitter. Read this carefully. Make sure you understand that nothing is going to happen now. This will take a minimum of 18 months to work its way through SBC committees.
JD Greear is quoted in Southern Baptist head calls for reforms, potential removal of multiple Houston churches
This is the part of his presentation that caused me to wonder if anything will happen to these churches. It appears he wants to cause them to simply demonstrate that they will go along with certain safety recommendations. JD Greear attempted clarify that he doesn’t want to *disfellowship* (love the Baptist lingo.)
But in his Monday speech, Greear stressed that autonomy was not an excuse for inaction.
He also called on an SBC work group to “take the necessary steps to determine if 10 churches identified in the Chronicle’s report still “meet the standards of having a faith and practice which closely identifies” with that of the Convention.
“I am not calling for disfellowshipping (expelling from the SBC ) any of these churches at this point but these churches must be called upon to give assurance to the SBC that they have taken the necessary steps to correct their policies and procedures with regards to abuse and care for survivors,” Greear said. “Our goal here is never disfellowship, but correction.”
Letter to an SEBTS Professor
I’ve waited a long time to write this letter to you. I was kind of hoping you might reach out to Deb and me to say you were sorry when we were proven correct. I’m trying to figure out if a bunch of your SBC buddies are hoping that Al *Papa Bear* Mohler’s apology was meant for all BFFs for all time. I never really understood the SBC’s unwritten rules of the game.
I’m terribly sorry for the pain that you have endured as a family and I’ve prayed for all of you.Really and truly. As you know, my family walked a similar road. However, years have passed and I think it is time to address an email that you sent to Deb which was also meant for me.
You remember the back story, I’m sure. We trusted you and confided in you since you, at that time, also functioned as a pastor. We shared with you our concerns regarding two situations. One was Mark Driscoll and the other Was CJ Mahaney and Sovereign Grace Ministries. We were trying to figure out why your seminary, and many others, were endorsing these men by inviting them to speak or some of you guys going to their churches to speak.
The problems with these two men were crystal clear in our minds. We couldn’t understand why they received such support from Baptist leaders. Neither of these men were in the SBC at that time but they were members of the vaunted *The Gospel Coalition.* They hung around groups like The Council of Biblical™ Manhood and Womanhood and heartily endorsed complementarianism in increasingly bizarre ways.(You remember Driscoll’s description of women as pe$%# homes, right? )
I know that JD Greear is a celebrity at your seminary. He graduated from there, successfully formed a megachurch and continues to teach. Was it his influence? I found this tweet of his from that same timeframe in which in which Greear says that Mahaney and Driscoll are:
two of my absolute favorite speakers.
What is wrong with us?
Is that what prompted you to write us an email questioning what was *wrong with the two of us?* I wish I had saved it. I showed it to my husband and a few other people at the time. All were rather taken aback. Basically your slap-upside-our-heads went something like this. You listed all sorts of famous SBC leaders like Papa Bear Mohler. You included the names of SBC seminary leaders who supported them and also the names of famous SBC pastors and various hangers on.
Your argument went something like this. Look at all of these fancy pants leaders. If they support Driscoll and Mahaney, what is wrong with the two of you? Wow. That sure was a way to make your point. But it was a bad point since it is not found in Scripture.
The *what is wrong with you* fallacy.
I know you know your Bible. I am a big picture person when I view Scripture. I try to see how a particular argument fits into the overall trajectory of Scripture. So, as I contemplated this, I discovered that God rarely used the so called intellectuals of the day or the well-placed celebrities to get his messages across. That even includes the One who came to save us.
- David- a kid with a rock and slingshot and a trusting heart
- Jesus-a no account from Nazareth
- Fisherman -to be His disciples
- A tax collector
- John the Baptist: a rather oddly dressed man of the desert who had an unusual diet
- A prostitute who thought Jesus was the most precious person she had met
- A woman who had many husbands who told the world about this man who knew all about her.
- Esther who was essentially trafficked by her uncle
There are so many more but you get the picture. God gives ordinary people like me the Holy Spirit who reveals some rather unusual things to regular people.
Sadly, your final response was to ghost one of us on Facebook. I’ve since learned that this is a common response in your tribe. You ghosted someone who cared deeply about your family. I know you know that is true. So, why?
There was nothing wrong with us.
I remember speaking with news media in Seattle who were trying to figure out why Driscoll was so widely revered. I told them it was a tribal thing. The tribe decides who’s in and who’s out.When this happens, the only thing one can hope for is that a man like Driscoll goes so over the top, he can’t be ignored. While you guys were so excited to have Driscoll come and discuss the so called skanko Roman sexual culture of UNC, I was wondering why you didn’t see how odd he was? Why you didn’t see the skanko sexual culture of Mars Hill which was being driven into the ground.
We were right about Driscoll. Marks Hill imploded.
Then the reports of abuses in the Sovereign Grace Ministries churches were reaching a fevered pitch. Yet Mahaney was a vaunted speaker. Did you ever listen to him? I did, quite a bit. If his sermons are any indication of what is taught at SEBTS, then I can well imagine why people are fleeing the church. Did you ever wonder about the victims? What if it had been one of your kids? Do you know your support brought more pain to the victims? Do you care?
We were right about Mahaney. He fled the east coast and joined the SBC. Now, this favorite preacher may get booted. For sure, he’s been kicked to the curb for the moment. Would you still invite him to address whatever church you worship in at the moment?
Why did all of you bright men allow this to occur?
I have to ask the question. Because of your views on strict complementarianism, have you relegated women to the back of the room where you don’t have to listen to them? I’ve received a number of emails from female SEBTS students claiming they feel like second class citizens. Do I have any reason to doubt their complaints? Given the way you responded to us, I can empathize.
Did you not listen because we were women and only men can remark on those in leadership? I’ve seen this taught in your tribe. I even think an SGM woman said something similar. It seems to me that women trumped you on calling out these two celebrities. Why is that? Where was the Holy Spirit in your life?
I’m not mad. I’m grateful.
I know you are Reformed and believe that God is sovereign. I’m not Reformed but I also believe God is sovereign. Of course I was hurt by your email. But that was a decade ago. I’ve since come to the conclusion that God wanted me to see the way top Baptist seminary professors try to sideline women who challenge the status quo. It prepared me to minister to the number of people who have been treated in a similar fashion.
I forgave you a long time ago. I want you to know that I’ve thought about your email many times in the last number of years. I was able to put it under “hard things I’ve learned about Baptist evangelical intellectuals.*
In the end, I don’t know if you still believe that Mark Driscoll and CJ Mahaney are wonderful speakers and pastors. If you do, then I give up. If you don’t, wouldn’t it be the right thing to let us know?
PS-I think SEBTS should tell what really happened with David Nelson. The health thing was bogus. I know and I may say something in the near future. I’ve told people who’ve written me already.
To our readers: I’m willing to answer questions about this post. There is a good reason I won’t put his name out there. He, and others, know who he is.