“Mary Kassian is one of the most outstanding scholars in the entire Christian world [in] defending, defining and teaching biblical womanhood…We are looking forward to her joining us [as ‘Distinguished Professor of Women’s Studies’]…It is another sign of God’s favor and blessings to us."
Mary Kassian – LinkedIn (Screen Shot)
In some ways, it seems like yesterday because I remember it so vividly. I was leading Moms in Touch (now Moms in Prayer) at the Christian school my daughters attended, and every Wednesday morning I would go into the teacher workroom to make copies of our prayer sheet to hand out to our praying moms. I led this ministry for ten years (until my younger daughter graduated from high school), and it was such a blessing. There were so many answered prayers!
As I entered the workroom on this particular morning, I noticed a small stack of brochures promoting a ladies' retreat at one of our local churches. I was familiar with this women's event (held annually) because I had participated a couple of times years before and enjoyed it. I opened the brochure and saw the name of the speaker. It was Mary Kassian.
Dee and I launched our blog on March 19, 2009, and I remember that it was just days later when I saw the brochure. By then I was well aware that Mary Kassian was part of the Neo-Cal crowd and that I could not in good conscience attend. Mary arrived in Raleigh the following month to address conference attendees. The women's event took place a year and a half after the court settlement (discussed in the previous post), and I wonder if Mary confided to the ladies in attendance that she was off the hook until 2022 for meal preparation (among other housekeeping duties). See screen shot below.
How in the world could someone incapable of cooking meals and doing housework travel from Alberta, Canada to Raleigh, North Carolina and speak at a women's retreat? Of course, this wasn't an isolated event. Mary Kassian had been speaking at other conferences following the settlement of the lawsuit stemming from a 2002 car accident.
On October 10, 2008, Mary Kassian spoke at the very first True Woman event held by Revive Our Hearts, a ministry founded by Nancy Leigh DeMoss. It took place in Illinois – not exactly a hop, skip and a jump from Mary's Canadian abode. Here is a 9-minute clip of Mary Kassian's talk. My sincere question for our readers is — does this look like someone who is incapable of cooking and performing household chores? Perhaps Mary is on heavy doses of pain killers??? Who knows? Keep in mind that the Kassian v. Roy court case was finally heard 11 months and 11 days prior to her presentation below.
When a commenter 'Jerome' alerted us about these court documents earlier this week, I paid special attention to the description of the accident. Let's take a look at those details again (as provided in the legal document).
The details that caught my attention were: (1) the air bags did not deploy (2) Mary declined any assistance from the ambulance workers (3) the other occupants of the car in which she was riding only had minor claims which were settled outside of court.
As I read about this minor traffic accident and how it appeared that Mary Kassian went for all she could get from her 'injuries' (over a period of five years), I began to reflect back to a horrific car accident I was involved in almost 44 years ago that could have cost me my life.
When I was a month away from turning thirteen, a friend invited me to go to Myrtle Beach with her and her parents, which they regularly did on weekends. I begged my mom and dad to let me go, but they were extremely reluctant. I was blessed with protective parents, and this would have been my first time away from home without them. They finally gave in…
That Friday afternoon in July was sunny and beautiful! We drove from just outside of Raleigh toward the beaches of South Carolina. Back then there were no interstate highways in the eastern part of North Carolina, so we traveled on two-lane roads. I can still remember passing corn field after corn field as we made our way toward the ocean. My friend's mom was so kind to me, and I can still remember some of the things she said along the way. She talked about her friend who shared my first name, she explained how Benson has a Mule Day every year, and she explained how Spivey's Corner was known as the the Hollerin' Capital of the World (as we passed through it).
Then on a straight stretch of road just outside of Whiteville, North Carolina, our GMC pick-up was struck HEAD ON by a drunk driver. Both vehicles were traveling around 60 mph. It was 7:30 at night and still daylight. The woman who hit us had just stopped at a liquor store to buy more booze, and the store clerk refused to sell her anything because he could tell she was intoxicated. She managed to leave and he quickly phoned the police, who immediately began searching for her. When the officer closed in on her, he witnessed the horrific crash.
My friend’s parents were thrown through the windshield and killed instantly, and my friend and I were pinned inside the truck. None of us were wearing seat belts (shoulder belts were not standard equipment at that time). It took about two and a half hours for the rescue workers to extricate us from the mangled wreckage with the 'Jaws of Life', which had only recently been invented. Fortunately, I did not see the vehicle approaching and was unconscious the entire time we were pinned in.
My friend’s injuries were so severe that she was hospitalized for months and months. I suffered a serious skull fracture, broken bones in my left foot, a broken pinky (at the joint), deep gashes in my forehead, both above and between my eyes, and scalded patches of skin caused by the exploding radiator, but my injuries were NOTHING compared to my friend's.
I regained consciousness inside the ambulance at 10:10 p.m. They first took us to a local hospital, but the emergency room workers realized our injuries were far too severe for them to handle. Then they rushed us to New Hanover Hospital in Wilmington. I remember laying in the emergency room and being fully conscious. I was able to provide the doctors with all the contact information they needed. It was the worse night of my parents' lives. As soon as they got off the phone with the hospital workers, they drove over three hours, arriving in Wilmington in the middle of the night.
As I lay in the emergency room, I felt something wet just above both of my eyes. I touched those places and looked at my fingers. They were red. My skin was split wide open, and I will never forget what those deep cuts felt like. Incredibly, I had a sense of calm throughout that horrific ordeal. The neurosurgeon operated immediately to lift the right front part of my skull off my brain. I still have an indentation in my skull, which feels really creepy! By the grace of God, I was hospitalized for just six days.
it took the rest of the summer (and beyond) for me to recuperate. I had to wear a cast on my foot for five weeks, which came off on my birthday. Best present ever! The cast on my right hand stayed on for three weeks, but the hardest parts of the recovery were living with the front half of my head shaved during surgery and having the 50+ stitches removed from above my eyes, between my eyes, and in the middle of my forehead extending several inches above my hair line (where the surgical incision was). These were ugly black stitches that had to be cut with scissors, then pulled out.
As a thirteen year old, I was extremely self-conscious about my appearance, so I wore a wig to school for the first half of the year until my hair grew out a few inches.
My friend, who lost both of her parents in an instant, had a long, difficult road to recovery. A couple from her church moved into her home and took care of her for the rest of her growing up years. We had a close friendship through high school but went our separate ways in college.
After almost forty-four years, it’s still difficult for me to process the thought that one minute I was having a wonderful conversation with my friend and her parents and in a split second her mom and dad were gone! Can you imagine growing up through your teen years, as my friend did, without your parents?
In recent years, I have come to realize that had the car hit us closer to the driver's side (rather than the passenger side), my friend's parents would have been pinned in, and I would have been the one thrown through the windshield since none of us were wearing seat belts.
Throughout high school and college, I was self-conscious about my facial scars, having had three plastic surgery operations. Even though my facial scars are still somewhat visible (I have other scars on my legs and my feet from the accident), they are a constant reminder of God’s faithfulness in sparing my life on that fateful night.
Did my parents sue? No. I did receive a settlement of around $3,700 which was not released to me until I turned 21.
Getting back to Mary Kassian, I have NO EMPATHY FOR HER WHATSOEVER!!! What she did in the aftermath of her accident absolutely disgusts me! According to the judge, she was not a particularly credible witness and I firmly believe she bilked the insurance company (I presume). In the aftermath, it's plain to see that Mary Kassian's injuries haven't prevented her from jetting around to speak at conferences. That takes a lot more effort (in my opinion) than cooking and doing household chores.
Mary Kassian will once again be speaking at the upcoming True Woman event in September. And I have no doubt she'll be using her skills of persuasion to get attendees to sign the True Woman Manifesto. Is Mary really a TRUE woman? You be the judge…
She was truthful when she explained her involvement with the Danvers Statement in a post entitled Complementarianism for Dummies. (see screen shot below)
Yes, Mary Kassian has been involved with 'complementarianism' from the very beginning. I'm still puzzled why this 27 year old wife and mother of two youngsters was involved in the drawing up of the Danvers Statement. Oh look, next year will be the 30th anniversary of that clandestine meeting in Danvers, Massachusetts to hammer out the final document. More on that next year!
We leave you with another video featuring Mary Kassian that was uploaded to YouTube on December 10, 2009. Remember, Mary is being awarded special damages to the tune of $5,278 per year for meal preparation until the year 2022 since she has some sort of physical impairment…
The fields are ripe for harvest ……
Lottie Moon was working and harvesting, while Mary Ka$$ian is bragging about how neat and orderly her closests are. And you can tell MK I said that!
Nancy2 wrote:
The current SBC leaders should be ashamed they no longer seek missionary candidates like Lottie Moon instead of silly women like Mary!
Velour wrote:
If I recall correctly, Paul’s nine marks of a healthy church were love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. None of which really describe Dever or his “ministry”.
Lowlandseer wrote:
Ranting along with you. I am somewhat surprised, though I should not be, that Leeman is apparently (i have no plans to read his book) advocating what the Rushdoonyites of various stripes (Reconstructionists and Federal Visionists) have been advocating for a long time. About that spirituality of the church thing…
Lowlandseer wrote:
I really, really like the way you put that. It does seem that they want us to find our identities as members of the LocalChurch (and its associated gurus) rather than in Christ.
Dr. Fundystan, Proctologist wrote:
Spot on.
Mark Dever preaches “another Gospel”.
And honestly, I can’t get worked up over water. I don’t care. It’s the same water that flows through the tap, that we drink, bathe with, swim in, water the garden with, clean with.
People are willing to fight…over H20 ? It just goes to show how many of them get caught up in the traditions of men.
Mara wrote:
That seems to be the way the Mary’s system works. It looks like a classic double bind to me, but I am a mere woman whose judgment is impaired due to an inherent rebelliousness against God and men.
Todd Wilhelm wrote:
Somewhat OT, but one thing that is interesting from a Baptist POV about the 9Marks philosophy of baptism is that they delay baptism until the young adult is under their own authority. Typically Baptists do not delay baptism very long after a profession of faith as long as the child is mature enough to be conscious of their own sin and their need for a savior. In my case that happened well before the age of 18, and I cannot imagine my parents would have assented to delaying my baptism. Perhaps that has something to do with the 9Marks flavor of congregationalism.
Gram3 wrote:
So….women cannot be not baptized there…
:o)
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“Back On Da ‘NineMarx’ ™ Chain Gang, Perhaps?” [1]
hmmm…
Mark Dever: “Christian pastors like SGC’s Reverend Charles Joseph Mahaney have no need to demonstrate ‘conspicuous holiness’ ™ . His filling of our pocket$ with his church group’s money has not changed our opinion of him one single bit. C.J. Mahaney is certainly fit for ‘pastoral service’ (c) , and continues to be a ‘guiding light’ (R) among those who seek to present the ‘Reformed’ ™ tradition…”
(grin)
hahahahahaha
Sopy
__
[1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=okvl-9svtS0
🙂
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Lydia wrote:
Touche!
Abi Miah wrote:
Lydia, That will preach.
Ken F wrote:
I will never forget a picture from the early to mid 90’s of Mohler and Graham at this Billy Graham school and I thought Mohler looked like a Sylvester who had swallowed a Tweety. He looked very satisfied in that picture. Carl F H Henry, was also in photo. It was a very flattering picture.
Lydia wrote:
Ha! I imagine they are baptized under the authority of the elders. Or something. I don’t know. Maybe LLS or DaveAA can help with that info. It is also possible that I misstated the authority part. Perhaps it is more along the lines of parental influence. In fairness, I think the point is to avoid kids getting baptized because it is the thing to do or to please their parents. I get the problem from their POV. I don’t think their solution is a solution to their perceived problem.
Catholic Gate-Crasher wrote:
Teresa of Avila is one of my favorite people ever…..She fell off the horse into a stream of icy mountain water on a cold, rainy, windy day, soaking her to the skin. And then uttered those famous words.
Typical of Teresa, who had more gumption in her little finger than MK has in her whole body.
Gram3 wrote:
Only if she has her husband’s permission. 😉
Christiane wrote:
Christiane, I saw these comments of yours, and others as well, last night (my time). I wanted to say something in reply, but was working late and needed to get to bed. I hope you don’t mind my interjection here, and that it’s arriving fairly late at night your time.
I understand your willingness to show compassion to those who have been victims of sexual abuse, even if they’ve chosen to engage in abusive behaviours themselves. And if there are self-styled leaders suffering from ailments, we should try to understand them. At the same time, I think we need to refrain from being too gentle with toxic personalities, even those who are sick and wounded, until they show some measure of remorse and repentance for their deeds.
A few years ago, a relative of mine gave me a book by Dr. Terence Real, entitled “I Don’t Want To Talk About It”. In this book, he outlines his thesis that abusive and anti-social behaviours in many men have their basis in what he calls covert depression. Citing a number case studies (most of them amalgams of actual patients of his) and research from various fields, he sets out to demonstrate that there are people who hurt others in an attempt to medicate their own pain and trauma, rather than out of a desire to hurt. The case studies are highly emotional and sobering, and a heartbreaking window into the pain that many men try to hide.
Based on my reading of his work, I think I can offer you the following to consider:
1) I think Dr. Real would admit that there are numerous abusive people who are neither sick nor wounded. They’re simply evil. They don’t need to be “cured” or “healed” — they need to be kept away from society. A vast number of pedophiles might very well fall in this category.
2) For those abusers who are sick: As I understand his theories and technique, Real always demands that abusive and dominating men first stop their toxic behaviours, as a condition to further treatment. Not because he doesn’t want to help them, but because he can’t do so until his patients stop trying to self-medicate, with alcohol or violence or other addictions. These behaviours aren’t symptoms of their disease; they’re manifestations of a refusal to seek help. And they are capable of choosing to seek help.
I think we believers need to take a similar line… Willing to extend mercy, but without squandering it on those who don’t want it, and without being afraid to call snakes and vipers what they are. That is part of being Christlike, too.
Lydia wrote:
Ha, a delightful quip
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Take A Ride Christian: “You May Be Turned Into A Calvinist, And Not Even Know It?”
hmmm…
You can not just walk into a 9 Marks ™ church today and declare that ‘Jesus is the Christ’ and have that be the f’inal word’ for your Christian salvation experience, and BE BELIEVED.
huh?
Excuse me, you will have to PROVE IT.
What?
What they do not tell you is that you must be a Calvinist in order to be ‘truly saved’ (R) .
Skreeeeeeetch !
Once they have your consistent attendance, then begins the process conversion, a spoonful at a time. Yes, little by little, the Calvinist ‘pie’ is administered by stealth a spoonful at a time. They do not care how long the process takes, only that you are consistent in the transitional phase. They have a proven track record, they have a successful systematic transformation process.
bump.
Stamp um Calvinist, N’ fit 4 service?
Surprise!
One day you will simply wake up, and have their complete blessing without you even being aware of the changes that have been quietly made in your religious belief system. The ‘doctrines of grace'(R) [1] will be well incorporated.
All’s well that ends well?
“Dever frames all church teachings and examples set by the leaders as ‘formative discipline.’ Think about how these guys perceive you! You are such a spiritual loser that the only thing that will keep you from getting excommunicated is training you up in the way you should go. You are not being taught as a fellow heir, you are perceived to be a petulant little sinner poised to wreak havoc on the church at any moment. Everything modeled and taught to you is ‘preventative’. ” – Paul M. Dohse Sr. [2]
(sadface)
Sopy
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[1] http://www.gotquestions.org/doctrines-of-grace.html
[2] https://paulspassingthoughts.com/tag/mark-dever/
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Serving Kids In Japan wrote:
No, I don’t mind. I appreciate the communication and a chance to hear how you feel about these matters. I totally agree that those people who are profoundly and rabidly dangerous to others need to be restrained to keep them from harming innocent people. It may be that they can never be salvaged, or rehabilitated, or healed, or recovered, or made whole enough to re-integrate into society. And as to malevolence, ‘evil’, yes, there are those among us who, for the present time, are willing servants of the ancient enemy of mankind.
No, we can’t let these people ‘out’ to rape and kill.
But what IS a Christ-follower called to do in response to ‘these people’??? What IS possible?
I give you the story of aged Sister Antonia Brenner, who voluntarily moved into a cell and spent thirty years inside the worst prison in Mexico to care for the inmates, as one example of what IS possible in the Kingdom of Our Lord. She bandaged wounds, ran a hospice within the prison, quelled a riot by walking into the middle of it and when the rioters saw ‘La Mama’ as they called they halted, she washed the dead in preparation for burial, she visited families of the inmates, she cared for the prison guards who had difficulties. She never excused the bad things the prisoners had done, and yet she called them her children and they called her ‘Mama’. She was on call to the prisoners twenty-four seven. She also was able to get the guards to stop beating prisoners and throwing them into the pit cells they called ‘the tombs’.
What IS possible when one person crosses over the boundaries that isolate those who live in darkness in order to bring the love of Christ?
@ Gram3:
I find 9marx view of baptism confusing.
I’m not really sure how reformed fits with baptist on this point anyway, at least not as the neos practice. Was it Leeman who said he couldn’t assure his child they were saved??
Serving Kids In Japan wrote:
Very interesting study. I too wanted to respond but was a bit frustrated.
Lundy Bancroft said of abusers that they don’t change not because they can’t but because they know they don’t have to. The only ones who change tend to be the ones with real consequences, can’t keep a relationship, maybe get thrown out of the church or social repercussions…I think that is a good thing to remember.
@ Lea:
Similar to what once I learned when doing a drug counselling course that change only occurs once the pain of staying the same becomes greater than the pain of changing. I think that is true in many areas of life.
@ Christiane:
At least they were in prison. It is very hard to convict the Masters of deception who are pedophiles. Most people wouldn’t believe a kid anyway when it comes to a pastor or priest.
Serving Kids In Japan wrote:
As someone who has had the misfortune to have to deal with a few personality disordered individuals, I second your opinion. Until someone has been involved with such a person, they have no idea how fruitless and naive the hope of “recovery” may be. Until you have looked deep into the cold, blank eyes of a person who has no conscience whatsoever, with their mask off, you just do not get it. Remorse and repentance are child’s play for such a person to fake.
Preying on a child is not giving in to forbidden love! It is an exercise of the most cruel form of power over one who is utterly helpless and vulnerable. It is a desire to wound and deflower someone innocent in the most private and sacred part of their selfhood, in secret. If you really contemplate it, it will make your blood run cold. To be able to practice such a thing secretly while wearing a veneer of normal or even godly in public is not something a normal person can do. One has to really come to grips with the reality of what we’re talking about here.
We can show love and decency to such people but it must be with realism, wisdom and with NO opportunity given them to offend again. NONE.
Somewhat off-topic, but…
For anyone who hasn’t heard yet, it appears that, once again, Aimee Byrd has stepped out of line. Although she still identifies as gender comp, her review of Ruth Tucker’s book not only doesn’t dwell on the author’s mutualism, but focuses on her abuse and the twisted teachings that made it so much worse. Aimee even calls out — by name — two Comp Big Dogs whose infamous quotations on domestic abuse helped to keep Dr. Tucker in slavery to violence and hopelessness.
http://www.alliancenet.org/mos/housewife-theologian/black-and-white-reviews-black-and-blue-complementarianism#.V4UhWjehjzI
Such a contrast to Mary Kasshing-in.
The cracks are forming…
Serving Kids In Japan wrote:
The cracks are forming because the Female Subordinationists have been getting a free ride on fear of Egalitarianism and accusations of “Feminism” and “blurring distinctions between the genders.”
Their true doctrines and the ferocity with which they are held are being exposed to sunlight. I hope that this will be an opening for many to look deeply into the clobber verses with the thought that perhaps they have been misinterpreted just as other certainties were due to misinterpretations of the text and not abandonment of the text.
Serving Kids In Japan wrote:
Good for her. I do like Aimee and root for her to truly get it. Which I realize sounds a bit condescending, but I think there are folks who aren’t personally affected by the negative aspects and until they are they just can’t see them.
Lea wrote:
I think I’m going to start splitting them up into two groups. A lot of my Christian friends are complementarians like Aimee. They have fairly mutual marriages, and use the idea of headship more as a tiebreaker when they are uncertain which way to go.
Patriarchists like Piper, Grudem, Ware, Mohler, and Kassian have a totally different theology and really are not in the same category.
ishy wrote:
I think they really need to come up with a different name for themselves, though.
This is from a complementarian site, but I think they are a little more sympathetic to Ruth Tucker’s book than Challies and Kassian:
Black and White Reviews, Black and Blue Complementarianism
http://www.alliancenet.org/mos/housewife-theologian/black-and-white-reviews-black-and-blue-complementarianism#.V4VLotQrLGh
The Mary Kassian version of Wayne Grudem’s 83 rules for women:
From May 2016, by Mary Kassian:
Women Teaching Men — How Far Is Too Far?
http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/women-teaching-men-how-far-is-too-far
Snippets:
————
by Mary Kassian
Where is the line when it comes to women teaching men? May women preach on Sunday mornings? Teach a Sunday school class? Lead a small group? Instruct a seminary course? Speak at a conference? At a couples retreat? Or on the radio?
…The “family” part is key. The Bible teaches that in the nuclear family unit, as well as in our corporate church families, the father — or multiple fathers in the case of the church — have the responsibility to lovingly lead and humbly govern the family unit.
…God wants us to value and honor this pattern and cherish it as he does.
…God gives us a clear boundary for how we ought to honor the principle of male headship in the church. We honor it by letting the church-fathers govern and teach the church-family…
….Can Women Teach Under Male Authority?
Some churches have women regularly preach at their corporate gatherings. They skirt 1 Timothy 2:12 by saying the women are teaching under the authority of the church-fathers. In my mind, this is highly inadvisable.
…Does It Officially Set the Bar for the Family?
I try to pin down where the venue sits on each of the following eight continuums:
2. Nature: exegetical ⟶ testimonial/inspirational.
Am I forcefully interpreting a text of Scripture or sharing from my life and experience with biblical support?
6. Obligation: obligatory ⟶ voluntary.
Are the listeners obliged to listen to the teaching that takes place in this context? Can they be disciplined and corrected for failing to obey?
8. Maturity: sister ⟶ mother.
Does my age and spiritual maturity create a situation where I am speaking as a mother would to her sons?
….For example, in the instance of having me give a co-ed address at a national religious conference, I may regard the activity as appropriate based on the following analysis:
1. Context: Non-congregational. National religious conferences are outside of the context of the local church (although denominational meetings may more closely resemble a congregational context).
2. Nature: Testimonial or inspirational. Depending on the content, the message may be more testimonial-inspirational than exegetical.
6. Obligation: Voluntary.
There is no obligation on the part of the listener to attend the address. It is totally discretionary and voluntary on his part (unlike the obligation of a church member to attend weekly church services and obey that teaching).
8. Maturity: Mother.
I have found that as I get older I have more freedom to instruct younger men as a mother instructs her sons. A middle-aged woman instructing a group of 17-year-old men is a far different situation than a young woman instructing them.
…In the final analysis, I can’t give you a cut-and-dried list of what is and isn’t permissible.
Daisy wrote:
The listing of rules is an endless endeavor! Pretty soon there will be volumes on the subject and the end result will be the same- no one can exactly define it. A woman could just end up living in fear at all times that maybe she is transgressing something somewhere- safest just to do nothing!