"No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and wealth."
Matthew 6:24 (NASB)
(Update 10/12: We have posted a video of Sun's "artistry" at the end of the post. *trigger alert* You will see far more of this pastor's wife than others.)
Are you familiar with a pastor named Kong Hee? He hails from Singapore and is heavily involved in the Charismatic Movement. Hee founded City Harvest Church (in Singapore) and serves as senior pastor. He is married to Sun Ho, an aspiring pop music singer. (more on that in a bit…)
City Harvest Church has experienced astronomical growth according to the church website. There you can also read about City Harvest DNA.
You may also be interested in checking out Hee's ministry website called Kong Hee Ministries. That website states:
Reverence and relevance. These two words are at the heart of the life-changing message Kong Hee Ministries proclaims through international broadcast media, social media, print media, humanitarian outreach, missions, and conferences: to love God wholeheartedly and love people fervently.
As founder of Kong Hee Ministries, Kong encourages people to engage their culture with the same servant heart Jesus showed, and as a result, impact the norms, values, and belief systems of our world today.
Hee sends out a ton of Tweets via Twitter, and he is also on Facebook. Why has Kong Hee come into the TWW spotlight? Take a look at this comprehensive report that aired in June 2012:
Sun Ho, Kong Kee's wife was not charged, and she is reportedly standing by her man (link).
According to a report by the Associated Press, the trial began on May 15, 2013. The AP article stated:
Singapore opened a long-anticipated corruption trial Wednesday of six church leaders accused of embezzling more than $40 million to fund the pop music career of the wife of their evangelical movement's founder.
City Harvest Church faithful queued at a Singapore court overnight and packed the public gallery to show support for the accused who prosecutors say diverted the congregation's funds into "sham" investments to advance the career of aspiring star Ho Yeow Sun, popularly known as Sun Ho.
The church with affiliates in neighboring Malaysia and other countries is one of Singapore's richest and biggest, with membership of more than 30,000. It is known in the region for staging large-scale, elaborate services resembling pop concerts which are conducted by Ho's husband, Kong Hee.
Channel News Asia reported that:
After 20 days and six witnesses, the second tranche of the trial involving six City Harvest Church leaders ended on September 20. The trial will resume in January with at least five prosecution witnesses slated to take the stand.
When the trial resumes, we will be sure to provide an update. If you'd like to read further, we recommend the following article that was published in the UK's Daily Mail earlier this week.
Singapore megachurch founder on trial for 'stealing more than $40million to fund his wife's American pop star dream' (link)
After his arrest last year, Hee and his wife came to the United States to attend Ed Young's C3 Conference. An interesting piece – Megachurch Pastor in Singapore Charged with Fraud, Funding Wife's Singing Career – highlights that visit.
The article explains:
"While free and awaiting his trial, Pastor Hee has apparently gotten permission to travel overseas, which he has been doing. He stopped by this weekend at Texas Pastor Ed Young’s C3 conference, who posed for a photo with the Singaporean pastor and his singing wife.
If found guilty, Kong could face up to 20 years in prison or a fine for each charge."
Photo: Twitter/@konghee (link)
Not only does Kong Hee get around to conferences, but so does Steven Furtick. Check out this video in which Hee uses the 'power of confession' over Furtick.
Apparently, the power of confession worked because a concerned individual posted this video to protest Steven Furtick's visit to City Harvest Church (CHC) in April 2013. Can someone confirm that Furtick traveled to Singapore to speak at CHC?
Birds of a feather?
Update:10/12/13 10AM
Sun's video
*trigger alert* (more for poor taste than nudity)
Special thanks to Nicholas for pointing this out.
Pastors encouraging Kong and Sun
Lydia's Corner: Job 4:1-7:21 1 Corinthians 14:18-40 Psalm 37:30-40 Proverbs 21:27
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We need a “Commission on Charities” in the U.S. It would probably quash the antics of Young and Furtick.
Honestly, the appeal of these mega-church pastors is just beyond the scope. Even when I attended Fellowship Church, I could only roll my eyes at Ed Young’s blatant me-centeredness and materialism. Unfortunately, these pastors play to the banality of our culture.
I am surprised they don’t have the equivalent of the Academy Awards for preachers each year where they can get together and pat each other on the backs. Oh, yeah, that’s C3?
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Here’s the music video Sun Ho did: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ya3Hqu_-cg
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Here’s another one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GgxsfODXrI
And here’s a bunch of Word-Faith “pastors” endorsing and defending Kong and Sun in the midst of the criminal investigation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JATWoAiBzJk
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To our readers:
An update to the post
With Special thanks to Nicholas: We have just posted the *revealing* video of this pastor’s wife! Such transparency!
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No wonder Christianity has become the object of mock and ridicule. It has nothing to do with the Gospel and everything to do with the blatent greed and hypocrisy of its most public faces and the gullibility of those who follow them. These charlatans must have a union because they sure do stick up for one another no matter what egregious acts they have committed.
You know, when you boil it all down, these guys are nothing but sophisticated panhandlers spewing a religious-sounding line to flush the chumps.
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That video of his wife says it all!
I’m not judging it for it’s content or style, but for the fact that such is unbecoming of a pastor’s wife.
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JeffT wrote:
I better not hear ONE WORD from these protestants about Tetzel or indulgences…
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The Kill Bill video points to a pornography problem of the supportive husband. You can’t convince me that he respects his wife as an equal human being but rather has fantasies of his wife..well..just look at the ‘husband’ in the video…I won’t go on. He should be protesting her video not supporting it.
Hmmm…. But then again maybe if all wives started mopping and scrubbing with the hips like that they would get more respect, at least until they’re too old and break a hip.
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I am astounded. For the past two days I have been troubled by information I received from a member of my former church. The financial report indicated that with an annual budget of $300,000 (and no mortgage), 80% goes to payroll with the sr and jr pastors receiveing about 200,000 which includes benefits. There was no further breakdown but my estimation is that the sr pastor receives at least 150, 000 in a rural community and a small to medium congregation (probably less than 100 families)
in which the mean income cannot possibly exceed $40, 000. And this church is currently in the middle of an 8 week beg-a-thon to raise 1 million dollars to purchase land to build a nouthetic counseling center (not a shelter for our burgeoning homeless population, or to increase the 11% it currently gives to missions),
ur
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But to build what appears to be a shrine to the sr pastor… who of course is the chief counselor. the wife of his good friend (an elder) is the second in command counselor and is on the payroll. I was considering this degree of fleecing of the sheep and realizing our community is knee-deep in muck when I read this post this morning and felt the floor drop out from under me. Truly the church as we know her is in huge peril.
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@ Dr. Fundystan, Proctologist:
My thoughts exactly. I often think of Tetzel when listening to these guys and their supporters. History is funny like that.
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http://www.tremeritus.com/2013/05/24/sun-ho-the-woman-at-the-centre-of-the-chc-storm/
Just as I suspected, Sun Ho is a victim of childhood sexual assault. She needs help, not exploitation.
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@ Janet Varin
Is there a good reason not to mention the name? Public figures, public scrutiny.
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http://reknew.org/2013/10/a-godless-congregation/
Based upon many of the blog posts here, I thought this article was timely and makes us ask ourselves some very important questions about “church”.
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The Devil Wears Prada
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Nicholas does not disappoint!
These videos are not my thing. There’s some cultural gap that keeps me from appreciating it fully, I am sure. Do they have that much hip hop influence in Singapore?
The way a lot of Charismatic churches are run the pastor probably could have just told the congregation that God was leading him to tell the church that people needed to give to help her career. That would probably fly. He had a “word” from the Lord. And he could have said it in tongues to really give it authenticity. Wouldn’t want to put God in a box, now. Would we?
I did not get to watch all the videos about the trial. Singapore is not known for a clean justice system, either. So I am going to reserve my comments on the legalities until I can watch all this stuff, if I can get to it.
I think that we could use some pastor’s wives here in the States that have some cultural cache and verve. But I think this is a bit much.
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Hip hop is poplar all over the world, but… Sun Ho’s vid looks (trigger alert) racist to me, in many respects.
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@ numo: Good grief – Wyclef Jean (of the Fugees) produced this vid and has been going concert with her.
they didn’t hire just anybody – they hired one of the most successful hip-hop writer/producers of the past decade to make her look good, and decided on a “Kill Bill” vibe to go with it.
Gah!!! Well, money might buy notoriety, but that’s about it.
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@ numo: “Giving concerts,” that is.
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@ numo:
Yes that and and several other bothersome messages in her videos, I have a couple of comments in moderation that I thinks addresses the disturbing nature of her videos regarding morals more sinister than her just wiggling around in skimpy attire.
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@ Patti: I think the vid is supposed to have a “Kill Bill” (action movie by Quentin Tarantino) vibe, which means that yes, it’s pretty tasteless.
Like you, I’ve got a comment in moderation that will explain a bit more of my thinking…
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Janet Varin wrote:
Bad news. That is the case for the majority of churches these days.
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Muff Potter wrote:
Funny comment of the day!
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Next Big Box post is up. Extra disturbing this week…
http://scarletlettersblog.wordpress.com/2013/10/12/sleeping-beauty-and-the-five-questions-part-1-blurring-the-lines-tbb/
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This is part of Sun’s bio on her church’s website.
Sun’s calling into the marketplace began with a distinct word from God to “cross over” from the Christian music scene into the secular pop arena. This word was substantiated with the Bible passage from Mark 4:35, where Jesus says to His disciples, “Let us cross over to the other side.”
I
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Anon 1 wrote:
It’s come full circle, hasn’t it. Protestantism was born out of opposition to the wretched excesses of the dominant church of the day. Now Protestantism is littered with ‘ministers’ infected with the same disease. Time for a Second Reformation?
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I first heard of this Sun Ho fiasco a few months ago.
She and her husband claim that her music career (with songs about ‘China Wine,’ apparently her songs are all disco, with no mention in the songs about Jesus – not that I think every single Christian song has to be about Jesus only, but at least could mention other aspects of the faith) was to attract Non Christians to
a. Jesus Christ
and/or
b. their church.
I doubt point (a), but point (b) could be possible if they mean they wanted more tithers (more $$$$) for them.
Naive me, I used to think when preachers talked about wanting more church members, they meant point (a) (tell more people about Jesus, so more people could be saved).
However, it really seems to be more about ((b), $$ more tithers $$, which = more cars and big houses for the preacher, not to help those in need).
I watched the Sun Ho “China Wine” video a couple of months ago and thought it was rather cheesy, except for the Jean Wyclef parts.
I mean, ironically, if they cut Sun Ho’s dancing/acting part and her singing out of the video/song, it might be a half decent dance tune to work out to.
I think one article said their church funds (which were meant to go to help poor people and such) went to pay for Sun Ho’s apartment in New York City, whenever she visited the USA, and about two million was ear marked for that.
Two million! I know NYC C.O.L. is high, but can’t she just stay in a fifteen (or $20 or whatever) dollar a night Motel 6 like the rest of humanity?
Even a Holiday Inn would be a few hundred a night to possibly up to $1500, which is still staggering but a heck of a lot less than TWO MILLION! After a quick look, I found a few places online that charge $150 – $450 per night in NYC.
City Harvest trial: $2.2 million New York apartment for Ho Yeow Sun
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This is off topic but addresses a post someone made on an older thread here a couple of weeks ago, who complained that RHE’s book about womanhood “misrepresented” complementarianism:
“A Year of Biblical Womanhood” Genre Cheat Sheet (RHE Blog)
RHE wrote that is only a brief rebuttal, that she will do a longer one next week or sometime. She said she is writing a longer rebuttal in response to a complementarian person who said RHE misrepresented comp’ism.
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@ Dr. Fundystan, Proctologist:
Excellent comment!
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You know, as long as the books were aboveboard and the taxes (as needed) were paid properly, any church here in the USA could get away with this as a “ministry expense.”
For example, Ronald Weinland, “prophet” of one of the many Worldwide Church of God outfits, is currently cooling his heels in the federal penetentiary, not because he was overpaying himself a salary, but because he paid himself a relatively tiny salary and then had the church pick up the tab for his other personal expenses. Had Weinland actually just paid himself $100K a year (instead of the $32K/year he claimed) and then paid the proper taxes on that amount, the IRS would have had no problem. He got in trouble because he was stiffing the IRS on taxes due!
All these big ministries have tax people on staff or at their beck and call, they know that to keep themselves out of the IRS’s hair they have to keep their church and personal expenses from being commingled and to pay the proper taxes. The IRS is not going to question why you’re being paid $500K to run a church, not at all.
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@ numo:
I thought very racist as well, in a number of ways. I felt a sadness for the dancers/backup singers. A raw deal for them in a few ways.
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@ elastigirl: You do know that some of the folks in the vid – plus Wyclef Jean, who produced it – are up there in the hip-hop world, right?
It makes me sad, too. And I totally agree with you on a number of different types of racism going on in the vid itself.
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Mark wrote:
Senator Chuck Grassley (R Iowa) tried to revamp the tax laws that protect these charlatans but it went nowhere. His constituency is hard-core-Midwest-Bible-belt-salt-of-the-earth-folk who don’t take kindly to having their favorite TV preachers (who they send money to) investigated. Senator Grassley quickly realized that it’s better to back off and not do sacred cow tipping (so to speak) rather than wind up not seeing even dog-catcher at the next election cycle.
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dee wrote:
“Revealing” as in “show your ****”?
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Patti wrote:
Sounds like that woman who divorced her husband and hooked up with her Edward Cullen claiming justification with the Bible passage “Put on the new man”.
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numo wrote:
Never mind Killing Bill, somebody kill that video?
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I would have a little bit of respect for this pastor couple if Sun Ho merely did this worldly hobby for herself and claimed that she didn’t think it was any more wrong than speeding or drinking,etc. But there are way too many blatant anti biblical themes in her videos to claim it as some sort of ministry. I think their claim is taking the Lord’s name in vain.
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Thanks, WW. I now have that terrible Kill Bill song stuck in my head. The video baffled me. Never mind her being from Singapore, calling herself a geisha (wrong country!), and counting in Chinese towards the end of the song. I wanted to remind her that geisha count, “Ichi ni san shi go…” not “yi er san si wu…”
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dee wrote:
Er…”majority”?
The average sr. Pastor package for a church with ~$300k in receipts is around $70k and average staff is about $50k. The church in the example above is far above average. This is among SBC churches.
Careful with the “majority”‘please but keep exposing the outrageous, and outliers, among us.
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William wrote:
This blog deals with more than the SBC whose stats, BTW, are amusingly questionable. They cannot even measure (or is is report) the number of people in SBC churches.The leaders quote 16 million but they mostly agree in the back rooms that the number is somewhere around 8 million.
I am referring to the broader swath of evangelical land and am using a number that has been quoted by many groups. However, I will get you some articles to read when I have a moment today.
Bg salaries are becoming the norm. i receive an email from an elder in a church who claimed that a former employee of Ed Young applied for a job as a music minister. He asked for a 6 figure salary. He was told to take a hike.
I do not believe that the “outliers” are that rare. Getting back to the SBC, they are publishing lists and extolling those “fastest growing churches.” The techniques, or should I say “tactics” used by these churches are being extolled by SBC leadership. I guarantee you that these pastors are making bank in terms of their compensation.
Piece of insider info: When approached by an investigator, a well known SBC leader, whose name shall be published when this stuff comes out, thinks it is “jim dandy” that Furtick is building such a fine cottage. This is today’s SBC and it makes me sad.
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androidninja wrote:
This is why I love blogging. We have some smart readers. Thank you for sharing this info.
Sorry about the song. We almost didn’t publish it but felt the full impact of the craziness of this debacle would not be felt unless we did. In other words, her definition of cross over is not Taylor Swift singing about the latest breakup.
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Patti wrote:
You should see some of the other videos! Good night! My husband and I had a few good laughs eating breakfast and viewing her missional efforts.
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Muff Potter wrote:
There is a reason people buy it-be it Benny HInn or Sham Wow. We cannot protect people from themselves.
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@ William: I realize that I left out an important area and so I must do a mea culpa. 80% includes salaries, church building and administration.
In other words, my criticism of the budgets has to do with both salaries and internal money as opposed to actually ministry outside of the church. *Dee bangs head on table*
The average PASTOR’s salary makes up, on average between 38%-52% of the budget. You can see the danger here. There are many other costs in running a church, including other salaries (church secretary, etc).
http://media.leadnet.org/2010-Large-Church-Salary-and-Benefits-Report.pdf
We spend too much money supporting an infrastructure and too little on actual ministry.
Please forgive my oversight. Sometimes i write faster than my brain thinks.
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Dee, the SBC stats for ministerial compensation are not questionable save for a reporting bias that likely means average salaries are actually lower than figures given. Other SBC stats are questionable, certainly the reported membership numbers. Numbers of church starts used to be a very soft and unreliable number. This has been tightened considerably.
There are 47k SBC churches and the vast majority display nothing noteworthy in the area of compensation. I certainly join you, tom rich and a few others in exposing the new generation of religious racketeers which number includes some SBC mega pastors. One aspect of this is that any high dollar minister in America is cashing much of his or her mega checks income tax free through the housing allowance. That is a tax policy scandal, perfectly legal.
I note your correction of the basis for the 80% figure and do not dispute that.
Keep up the good work.
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JeffT wrote:
“Don’t trust anyone over twelve.”
— last line of dialog in the Sixties movie “Wild in the Streets”
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Dee wrote:
A fool and his money are soon parted.
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b>@ William:
and just because it is legal does not mean it is the right thing to do.
(not implying you don’t agree)
With regard to the fact that all other taxpayers have to cover the cost for what pastors don’t contribute in taxes, I have observed many pastors who are good, honest human beings say unashamedly “it’s perfectly legal”. With the facial expression and tone as if they had just said “it is absolutely moral”.
There is some disconnect going on. That good and honest men who make God and truth and holiness their business can say this with such ease. Blind to the compromise.
I think they have been primed with rhetoric (and have perhaps been afraid to think it all through on their own, for fear of what they might lose), and when the topic comes up, it’s like someone has squeezed their tummy and the recording is activated.
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Elastigirl, an average SBC minister may avoid $1000-$2000 in income taxes each year, a modest tax benefit. The same benefit is shared by military personnel and is available to clergy of any type. I have a problem with the HA at higher ministerial income levels and favor a cap. I don’t have a problem in principle with it any more than any other tax policy feature that benefits a given segment of the population. Do an overall tax reform that eliminates all loopholes and tax breaks and I will support that.
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@ William:
I can understand military personnel. But why clergy? I imagine originally it had something to do with clergy sharing a social role in providing help for those in true need. But truly, it seems to me that the purpose of church is, and has been for quite a while, to exist to perpetuate itself. Helping people in need and/or crisis seems to me to be an afterthought, or perhaps a nice idea but really not on the agenda at all.
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William wrote:
Me too. And I take every single break I can find. I wonder how folks would feel if they paid in a few hundred but got 3-4 thousand back.
The tax code is bizarre, Byzantine and inexplicable.
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dee wrote:
Looks like the “pastors” and “ministers” are living very ‘high on the hog’ these days. Just look at the other perks and benefits they get, besides the salaries that are probably higher than most of those in their congregations. Pretty sweet deal, wouldn’t you say? No one seems to be “sacrificing” too much fer Jesus.
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Elastigirl, the HA is almost a century in the tax code, a vestige of that earlier time’ and the history is complicated (we’re talking about government tax policy here). If it helps, most clergy pay SECA taxes on the HA and most have a far larger bill for that than income taxes.
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Interestingly, David Yonggi Cho (in the bottom video) who pastors Yoido Full Gospel Church in Seoul, was indicted in June for breach of duty and tax evasion.
He is accused of instructing church officials to by stocks from his son at higher rates than market value (losses 14 million US)
He is accused of evading taxes to the tune of billions His son was indicted in December 2012, he was charged in March.
http://tinyurl.com/l96b3rn
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It isn’t very instructive to look at a pastor’s salary any more than it is to look at a CEO’s. You have to look at total compensation package. Add 7.5% to most pastors’ salaries since they don’t pay fica; add in any housing allowance or – even better – a free parsonage; add tax-deductable “ministry expenses” such as travel, include extra income (book sales, etc.) or other revenue streams (paid board position etc.), and then you will begin to get an idea of pastoral compensation.
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dee wrote:
Completely off topic, but this is why Evangelical Christians can NEVER take care of all of the people on welfare in this country, as some people are wont to claim…
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Dr. Fundystan, Proctologist wrote:
Never heard of this. I just did some searching and can’t find any exemption for the FICA.
Can you back this up or is it one of those things passed around so much it must be true?
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NC Now wrote:
Allow me.
Both employers and their employees pay the FICA tax, which as of 2010 was 7.65 percent of an employee’s taxable wages, according to Clergy Tax Net. Self-employed people pay another tax, which is 15.3 percent of their earnings. Pastors have dual status. They are considered self-employed individuals in performing their ministerial services, but they can be considered employees for tax purposes. Because of this dual status, they can stipulate that a church pay half of the 15.3 percent tax liability, which is a common practice, according to Clergy Tax Net. The website warns that this amount paid by the church to the pastor must be included in a W-2 or 1099 form as compensation for Social Security purposes.
Read more: http://www.ehow.com/list_6862514_tax-benefits-pastors.html#ixzz2hwK2hxyy
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@ NC Now:
The SE tax, that ministers can apply for an exemption from, is the self-employed version of FICA. (From what I understand.)
http://www.irs.gov/publications/p517/ar02.html#en_US_2012_publink100033541
There’s a link for “Exemption From Self-Employment (SE) Tax”
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NC Now wrote:
Dr Fundy usually gets it right. Perhaps a kinder way to approach the question is “Could you please show me where you found that info?” If he was then proven wrong, you could then add “is it one of those things passed around so much it must be true?”
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Still laughing at those ridiculous videos. My first thought was, “Oh my — their copy of the SGM modesty checklist must’ve gotten lost in the mail.”
Seriously –have they no shame? Are these people truly so clueless? Millions of dollars later, is the woman a star? Hardly.
This is pure-tee nuts. She’d probably have had much better success emulating Sandi Patty or Amy Grant on a shoestring budget with a pure heart. I’m so sorry that people have been suckered in by this circus. PT Barnum had it right.
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@ BeenThereDoneThat:
Well that’s a clear a mud. Which means almost anyone who tries can get excused from FICA. I wonder if they get to draw from it in old age.
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@ NC Now:
So sorry that wasn’t clearer. Perhaps this site will help: http://www.ministrycpa.com/?q=tax/topten/9
“If you choose to opt out, then you must provide for your own adequate retirement funds, long-term disability savings or insurance, life insurance or survivor savings, and retirement era health care.”
There are many websites with tax info for clergy.
One of our former ministers opted out, and said he would not be able to collect. I often wondered if that’s why some of them stayed in that “church.” Some of them were retirement age, with nothing to retire on.
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@ BeenThereDoneThat:
I was referring to the IRS rules. Not you. Sorry.
I think I can start a church and exempt myself. 🙂
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BeenThereDoneThat wrote:
No other person can claim an objection, on religious grounds, to paying the SE tax and then be legally exempted from paying it, EXCEPT professional clergy – another perk enjoyed by the professional clergy that the unwashed masses are not allowed to have.
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What Steve F. hasn’t figured out yet is that if Christ is behind something you are doing you will receive everything in Christ to accomplish what He wants. When you take training from the world and try to do something in Jesus name you end up an emotional out of control person with a microphone trying to justify their actions. I’ve search the scriptures to find a rant similar to what Steve does quite often with the microphone and I must have the wrong translation cause I can’t find the example.
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TedS. wrote:
So, we do E Church on this blog. Can Deb and I claim clergy privileges? I would be happy to command everyone to start calling me Pastor Dee if it would save me a few bucks! 🙂
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Dee,
you would have to be making money from your “ministry”, and my understanding of you and Deb is that you do not, but rather, “lose” money on the operation!!!!
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@ Arce:
Can I deduct the loss? Can I write off my three rescue pugs as part of my mission?
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Sorry, but either would be disallowed and might subject you and hubby to criminal prosecution for tax evasion.
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dee wrote:
Are you going to form the “Church of Lost Dogs”?
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Keep your kids away from those places
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I am so humbled to see the amazing objectivity of this writer and the comenters. Guilty, guilty, guilty until proven innocent. Keep it up, gossip mongers! It’s you we need in the church.
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Charles
Welcome to TWW. You are correct. The church does need people to expose this nonsense. And, proof is proof. Furtick admits to building the mansion and Kong Hee is in a heap of trouble. I am impressed to find anyone who would misinterpret gossip to mean potential crimes and extravagance all in the same sentence. Since you like them so much, keep giving them your hard earmed money. They need it and they are blessed to have such a supporter in their midst. You probably won’t get rich like they have. In fact the more you give, the less you will have even if they say you will become rich the more you give. Let us know when this nonsense doesn’t work for you any longer. I give it about 3 years.
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Charles wrote:
Silencing techniques at it’s finest.
Protect the Elephant in the room at all costs. If someone points out the Elephant (the sin issue, like alcoholism or a greedy money grubbing preacher) then whoever points out the sin problem is labeled the sin problem.
Nice try Charles, but this is a sinful tactic that you have employed against those who see righteousness and justice to get them to quit pointing out the sin in the camp. This shaming tactic works less and less with each use because it gets easier to see through it as time goes by.
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Mara wrote:
Should say, “Those who SEEK righteousness and justice”