Mickey Connolly – Stop the Witch Hunt of CJ and SGM!

"Brothers and Sisters, we must not allow this witch hunt of C.J. and other SGM leaders to continue. . . The other pastors and I have sensed for some time that we are on the brink of some great things here."

Mickey Connolly, Pastor of Crossway (Charlotte)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch-hunt

Burning of Three Witches in Switzerland (1585)


In case you haven't seen it, Jim over at SGM Refuge has posted a Letter to Crossway members from senior pastor Mickey Connolly, who has led the church since 2002.  Perhaps you will remember that Brent Detwiler, who had been a member of Crossway, helped plant a church in nearby Mooresville.  I have relatives who live there, and I have enjoyed family reunions at their Lake Norman home. 

According to a previous SGM Refuge post entltled That's That, Detwiler resigned in July 2009.  In the three years that have transpired, there has been considerable turmoil in this 'family of churches'.  Now Sovereign Grace Ministries has moved (fled) to Louisville, Kentucky, and so far one church (Redeemer) has publicly announced its departure from SGM.  Based on Connolly's remarks to Crossway members, there must be quite an exodus taking place.  Here is how Connolly began his communication:

   "Brothers and Sisters,

    I’ve been made aware that Brent Detwiler has emailed a document to many of you regarding what he calls the “ethical demise” in SGM.  While I’m not surprised by this development I am saddened and angry.  This is what we would have anticipated when, in November, we marked Brent as a divisive man because of his persistent gossip, slander, scoffing and threats.  If you had any doubts whether this was just, I hope this latest development will put them to rest.  He has now, in a sense, invaded your home and workplace with his campaign against SGM and Crossway.  Now that that door has been opened I will not be surprised if he continues to do so.  So while I’m not planning to respond every time Brent may send something I think it is important to respond this first time."

As you continue to read the letter, remember that Brent was closely aligned with the Charlotte church.  Connolly continues:

    "Let me be very frank with you.  His claims of love and concern aside, in my judgment (and it is a pastors sacred duty to make judgments in situations like this) Brent is driven by a sinful lust for vindication and vengeance.  The charges that Brent has brought against C.J. Mahaney have been thoroughly examined by respected pastors in SGM who, having all of Brent’s documents, other pertinent documents and the first-hand testimony of many witnesses had access to more evidence than any of us will ever be privy to.  Their findings were published and are still available on SGM’s Plant and build Blog.  Nothing was hidden, nothing was kept back.  And considering all this evidence they found C.J. fit for ministry.  Let me quote to you from the SGM board’s recent endorsement of CJ."

Mickey Connolly, who is currently serving on the Board of Directors for SGM, lauds C.J. Mahaney, emphasizing how fruitful his ministry has been over the last 35 years.  Connolly then explains that CJ . . .

"has been rigorously examined over the past year (both through individual examination of accusations brought against him and through a comprehensive evaluation of our entire ministry). This comprehensive process has clearly confirmed C.J.’s fitness to lead and his exceptional character as he has graciously endured major trials. Through all of this he has been found to be a man and a minister of fundamental integrity.

    In addition, SGM has undergone a rigorous examination by AoR, a report that is also available on the blog.  SGM recently published our response to the recommendations in both those reports on Plant and Build and we welcome anyone who hasn’t read it to please do so.  SGM and the individuals involved have confessed and apologized where appropriate and as you will see in our responses are taking steps to correct the areas that these reports have noted."

You may recall our discussions about the three individuals who declared C.J. fit for ministry.  These 'objective' individuals were Kevin DeYoung, Ray Ortlund, and Carl Trueman.  Who did they think they are fooling?  We have documented how these individuals are affiliated with SGM and C.J. 

Connolly also mentions the Ambassadors of Reconcilation report, which we discussed in our post entitled:  AoR Report – Just How Unhealthy is SGM?  Then Connolly opines:

    "Brothers and Sisters, we must not allow this witch hunt of C.J. and other SGM leaders to continue.  We can’t stop Brent from his writing but we can and should refuse to read or listen to the divisive speech he and others continue to spread.  To do otherwise is to poison your soul, damage Crossway and displease God.  I would not be a faithful pastor if I didn’t tell you so.

    Sadly, many people have already left because they have been affected by this.  I appeal to you not to let this continue.  I love Crossway.  I think we are a solid biblical church.  By God’s grace we faithfully preach the word, care for one another and have a heart for the lost.  Like Paul I feel like a fool talking this way but for the sake of this church I believe I must.  So please join me, the pastoral team and many faithful members in fighting for Crossway. Please stir the love and loyalty I know is in your heart and pull together to weather this storm that we find ourselves still in the midst of.   Please don’t let Brent or any other divisive man or woman destroy the unity that scriptures command us to be eager to maintain.  Please don’t let the devil have his way in this.  Please don’t let gossip, slander and divisiveness have their evil effects.

    The other pastors and I have sensed for some time that we are on the brink of some great things here.  I am excited about our future together.  Please don’t let these issues distract us from what God is doing right here, right now.  I am eager to work and fight to pursue our mission to make disciples of Jesus.  Please continue to work and fight with us.  Thanks to the many of you who are already doing this."

Isn't it incredible that a ministry which has promoted itself so staunchly via the internet is now attempting to control the flow of information by trying to impose a gag order on the rest of us. 

Is this a 'witch hunt' or a long overdue proclamation of the truth? 

Is the devil having his way? 

Are our souls being poisoned? 

The SGM 'storm' was self-induced, and now the leaders are reaping what they have sown.  They have sown to the wind and are now reaping a whirlwind.   

Lydia's Corner:  Genesis 20:1-22:24   Matthew 7:15-29   Psalm 9:1-12   Proverbs 2:16-22

 

Comments

Mickey Connolly – Stop the Witch Hunt of CJ and SGM! — 119 Comments

  1. Hmm….this sounds exactly like the letters my former pastor used to send out to the membership whenever things were getting a little hot and some of the ‘staff’ were getting uneasy and maybe even a few had left. Always putting out letters with the ‘we’re enduring the storms’ and ‘pull together with us a we aim for the vision God has given us’ blah, blah, blah….guilt, guilt, guilt, to bring everyone back in line.

    As one of those who was a co-leader with me at the time I walked away said (he was addressing the other leaders, some of whom were asking a few questions), ‘This matter has been dealt with and is closed. As leaders, we need to support our pastor, shut up and get in line.’ Sigh. Same old thing, everywhere you look. Hmmm….you know, for pastor appreciation month, the other leaders each took a day and made sure the pastor and his wife had beautiful gifts every day of October. Ick. It got ridiculous.

  2. Brent as a divisive man because of his persistent gossip, slander, scoffing and threats.

    Is this phrase plagiarism? Remove the name “Brent” and replace with the name, “Julie Anne” and someone is stealing my former pastor’s words about me.

    Spiritually abusive pastors all graduated from the CSAS – Creepy Spiritual Abuse School. They speak the same language, use the same bible verses out of context, same control tactics, same threats, etc. blah, blah, blah So predictable. I need some new material, please.

  3. Too many people have fled from SGM due to their wacky control methods. You have to think after a while that maybe just maybe things are a little off there. Have you heard of such an exodus even in a very conservative SBC church? I haven't. But, in their world, I suppose C.J. is fit to carry on his sin management program called SGM. I mean as long as C.J. has never molested anyone or had any sexual exploits outside of marriage he is good to go.

  4. “The other pastors and I have sensed for some time that we are on the brink of some great things here.”

    How long can you be on the brink for? Is it, or is it not happening? Funny, this is a desperate letter to stop the hemorrhaging attendance, and they say they are on the brink of something great. A great loss of members perhaps?

    Why do so many pastors sound like CEOs and company directors talking about company growth, not a body of believers coming together to share their gifts? The pastors have sensed they are on the brink, what about the congregation? What do the prophets feel/sense about the brink? If it is only the pastors, that is hardly a body of believers, that is a hireling shepherd and sheeple.

  5. I actually find the language rather triggering — it’s all come straight from the spiritual abusers’ secret handbook! It’s amazing how this stuff all sounds the same after a while, and that, in itself, is a flashing red light “beware, you are entering truth-bending territory1” I guess they do it with mirrors! (distorting the facts whilst staring at their own reflection)

  6. I quickly skimmed over the text of the letter and there’s at least one thing that stood to me: the language used to try to create “blocking mechanisms” in the intended readers and then trigger some sort of response from them.

    For example, in the last section quoted by Deb there’s a part where the writer says that people should stop reading or listening to those “divisive” materials because “to do otherwise is to poison your soul, damage Crossway and displease God.”

    Yes, it’s possible that those texts may “damage Crossway” and, at times, it might not be advisable for everybody to read everything you come across… But I find that what he said is going a bit too far, especially the “displeasing to God” point. Once that card has been put on the table by the pastor, it stops any possible conversation between the different sides… Because you, as a loyal member of our congregation, you don’t want to displease God, do you?

    Not very different to when I was told that to read books produced outside my former denomination would open a door for Satan to deceive me and lead me astray, most possibly getting lost in the way.

    There might be other parts of the letter that attempt to trigger similar responses, but I haven’t got the time to dig deeper into it.

  7. I don’t know much about the actual case (I’ll read through the other posts later) but that letter is concerning, even looking from the outside. The tone is very controlling – we’ve made the decision for you, don’t you listen to anybody who says anything different to us, because we’ve decided he’s bad. There’s no trusting people’s ability to make up their own minds. There’s also little reference to God, either in general or in relation to how the allegations have been dealt with.

  8. Important factor in their little speech here: Lack of humility

    I would run far away from a church like this now. I see nothing here that resembles how the disciples and Paul treated the church. Just compare the salutations of Paul to the church to how these men treat theirs and the rest of the victims that have unfortunately passed through their doors. These Calvinistas are so in love with their doctrine made by a man named Calvin they are willing to sacrifice others at the altar of their own arrogance.

  9. Garland,

    Regarding buzzwords, the lingo is so predictable that many here could have written that communication. Look at what has happened with the hand-picked trio (DeYoung, Ortlund, and Trueman) who endorsed Mahaney. And the Ambassadors of Reconciliation process was an absolute JOKE!  Now Connolly is upset because people are sick and tired of the charade and are finally voting with their feet.

     

     

  10. Eagle,

    Keep hammering SGM for their cover-up of Mahaney's reprehensible actions.

    The law of sowing and reaping is being demonstrated in Sovereign Grace Ministries:

    1. You reap what you sow

    2. You reap it later than you sowed it

    3. You reap MORE OF IT!

  11. Martin Romero,

    Yes, that correspondence is full of triggering language.

    I hope SGMers will listen to the Holy Spirit and ignore the SGM leadership which has failed them over and over and over again. How many chances do they get? This is ridiculous!

  12. Exactly, Pam. Don't think because we think for you. It is about control and ownership. They want to own the congregation and word things in such a way that it keeps people thinking they made the choice when in fact it was made for them.

    Attn SGM people: if you get that pang of guilt when you visit a website you are not supposed to visit or pick up a book you are not supposed to read, that is called ownership. You are allowing your leaders to own you and your independent thinking and reasoning skills. Take that back. That belongs to you!

  13. Pam,

    We have quite a few posts about C.J. Mahaney and SGM. If you are interested, just check those categories.

    A few years ago a theologian whom I trusted told me that since Piper, Mohler, Dever, Duncan, MacArthur yadda yadda yadda, endorse C.J. Mahaney – that the one with the problem is…

    ME!!!

  14. “We can’t stop Brent from his writing but we can and should refuse to read or listen to the divisive speech he and others continue to spread. To do otherwise is to poison your soul, damage Crossway and displease God.”

    In other words, if you don’t like SGM, you’re lost.

  15. “gossip, slander, scoffing” – Do these people have an “Preferred Phrases for Panicked Patriarchs” dictionary or something?

  16. SGMers, If you haven't read about Julie Anne Smith's challenges with her former pastor, you need to. He sued her (and others for 1/2 million and LOST! It was covered WORLDWIDE!

  17. “we marked Brent as a divisive man”

    Who is the we? I’m sure Brent was not invited to those meetings. I don’t think any amount of “heart for the lost” will want people to be involved in an oligarchy.

  18. What irritates me to no end is that SGM used the internet to propel its ministry into the 21st century. Now that truth is being disseminated via that same mode of communication, they want to keep their followers ignorant and blindly following them.

    It's a new day, and people will no longer be easily deceived…

  19. All this comes right before a visit by CJ Mahaney to CrossWay. He is preaching there this Sunday, the 12th.

  20. The fox is accused of raiding the chicken coop. He is brought before a group of foxes to see if he is fit to continue being a fox. The foxes all agree, he is fit. He continues to be a fox.

    Looks like a stacked deck. And when the chickes continue to protest, they are told they are, “…driven by a sinful lust for vindication and vengeance…”

    Time to fly the coop, me thinks.

  21. Jeannette

    One of my good friends, a deeply devoted Christian was told by one of the Baptist pastors “I am the father; you are the child.”  To quote Luke Skywalker “Noooooooooo, you are NOT my father.” (fall through trap door into the universe…)

  22. Just chiming in to say that it’s so good to see Eagle commenting again! Glad you’re feeling well enough to do so. 🙂

  23. Eagle

    They claim they are making some changes. AoR has hurt themselves by their involvement. They will now be looked at as a tool for the pastors. But heck, maybe one of them will write a book and get CJ’s endorsement. Guess it was worth it.

  24. Robin

    So true.He does not even need to live up to his own standards which, to me, spells “charlatan.”

  25. Val

    That statement reminds me of the song “Edge of Glory” by Lady GaGa. Whatever you think of her, she is definitely not on the edge of glory. Money, prehaps, but not glory.

  26. Martin

    Excellent observation. Today’s Calvinistas also use the words “biblical” and “gospel” to stop the conversation. For example, The Council for “Biblical” Manhood and Womanhood. If you disagree that women are “gullible” and “easliy deceived” (as opposed to men) then you are not “biblical.” This is a game. I find it interesting that he claims to know the mind of God. From my reading of Scripture, this is a big “no no.” We do not know the mind of God except in what he has directly revelaed to us. I could say “God is displeased” with SGM and CJ. What makes him right and me wrong?

  27. Pam

    Did you know that there are tons of reports that members were not encouraged to do Bible study and instead study the books of CJ and friends? 

  28. Moniker

    I believe that CJ has come sleepless nights but would never admit it. It is hard to keep pedaling so fast for so many years. Eventually he will wear out.

    I have a prediction: CJ will one day land in something like the Mayo Clinic (or whatever Al Mohler’s fav treatment center is) like a certain other famous individuals, dealing with some unresolved issues. 

  29. Randall

    There is life after SGM. In fact, there is much freedom when people finally free themselves from expectations imposed by men who want to “command” the lives of everyone else.

    I far prefer the give and take of loving Christian brothers and sisters who are there for you, propping you up, through thick and thin, etc. and do not feel the need to control you.

  30. I have come up with a plan for many of these churches before they choose a pastor or elder. I suggest we use profiling.
    Since this spiritual abuse is becoming so rampant, we should use this form of technique to safeguard the church. Maybe if we screen these guys we could start weeding the bad ones out?

    One question to ask:

    Do you EXPECT to get paid by your congregation?

    What is your church growth plan?

    Feel free to add more questions 🙂

  31. Cal –

    The “we” was the elders of Crossway church. They marked Brent as divisive because he had gone public with issues that he had been trying to bring to the forefront for ten years. He had been gone from Crossway and SGM for several years when marked. He had been in the upper echelons of SGM for 30 years before he was marginalized by CJ and Co. because he had some theological differences with the direction that CJ wanted to go and because he had been trying to address character and sin issues with CJ and others. (Brent was not innocent in all this either).

    It is ironic that they “marked” Brent at the same time that CJ was FLEEING his own church and running to Dever’s church to take cover. So Brent, who had been one of the upper three in the SGM organization, was marked and CJ, who is the leader of SGM (despite what they say about boards and presidents) didn’t agree with the pastors of his church and left with his family and closest supporters. It was hypocrisy at its best. This was just a small part of the last year in SGM.

    The AoR report was paid for by SGM and the panels that were set up to review three major issues were all set up by CJ and those acting on his behalf. There was little impartiality. Through the process CJ has not made public comments to the people in the churches who have been part of SGM. He uses others (Harvey, Dever, Mohler, Ortlund, his board, etc., etc.,) as mouthpieces and he stays behind closed doors feigning humility, blogging, and speaking at conferences (because he has so much to say and everyone is just dying to listen).

    Exhale . .

  32. Just to add to what Bridget said, Brent was one of the founding pastors of CrossWay, along with Bob Kauflin. They planted the church in 1991. Ironically, after a few years, Brent brought Mickey to Charlotte to be the “Executive Pastor”, and eventually Brent made Mickey “Senior Pastor” so that he could devote more time to his responsibilities in SGM. Then, of course, Brent left CrossWay to plant the church in Mooresville, and, I guess, we’re all pretty familiar with what has happened since then.

  33. I am not an expert on the SGM controversy, but have not liked what I have seen or read about Mahaney.

    But having said that, this letter is creepy. The language is bad. Suspecting other people’s motives is bad. It’s all bad.

    He could have written a different letter. Like this –

    Other people still believe that C.J. Mahaney is not qualified for ministry and that the SGM Board and others have decided wrongly about him. It is certainly their right to think that. I do not believe we will see eye to eye on this issue in this lifetime.

    We believe differently and have made a different judgment, and are trying to move forward in ministry here.

    That leaves us with the choice of whether to continue to argue about our differing judgments on this subject, or whether to invest our energies in ministry oportunities that the Lord has given to us. We believe that the Lord is calling us to do the later. That is not meant as a put down to others who disagree, but it is simply an expression of what we believe God is calling us to do.

    We appreciate the love you have shown for our congregation and your continued commitment. We look forward to working with you for the Lord.

    We expect that criticism of C.J., SGM and our church will continue in various forums for some time to come. We are not trying to censor those or push back against those. Everyone has a right to their opinion and everone has a right to express their opinion. You may come upon those criticisms in the future from time to time. When you do, we pray that God will give you the strength to move forward as He would lead you. But we are not going to give significant energy to continuing to address this matter.

    Thank you for your continued love and support.

  34. Anonymous on Fri Aug 10, 2012 at 10:50 AM:

    That would be the letter that a Christian pastor would write to end a controversy, which is why you will not see it coming from an SGM or hyperCalvinistic church.

  35. Bridget wrote-

    “…and CJ, who is the leader of SGM (despite what they say about boards and presidents) didn’t agree with the pastors of his church and left with his family and closest supporters. It was hypocrisy at its best.”

    I don’t know which would take first prize, (although I think I know how Eagle would vote 🙂 and am tempted to agree) for blatant hypocrisy:

    The blackmail- I mean, coercion “attempt” (must remember to use the least offensive sounding words…maybe sinful mistake would be better), or the abandonment of CLC by CJ by his not remaining there (as he required other pastors to do who had disagreements in their congregations), and taking refuge at his good friend Dever’s church to receive “care” and counsel.

    And then to have the nerve to preach about “the local church” at John MacArthur’s Resolved conference recently. Amazes the mind.

  36. Mara said:

    “It’s not a witch hunt.  It’s a wolf hunt.  Or, to be more specific, it is a wolf in sheep’s clothing, revealing”.

    Incredible comment, Mara.  Wish I had thought of that!

  37. Correct me if I’m wrong, Bridget and Moniker, but didn’t Brent also set Mickey up as “Senior Pastor” at Solid Rock Church prior to this? When Apostle Brent degifted the founding pastor and Mickey’s mentor “Friendly Fire”? So Brent is doubly Mickey’s “leader”. “Obey your leaders” Heb 13:7 🙂

  38. Correction: Heb 13:7 says to “remember” and 13:17 to “obey” (well, not quite). Anyhoo, Mickey should remember which aPostle set him up on his pedestal.

  39. Witch hunt? This from the man who presided over his own witch trials in his tiny, little cult? As someone who left the cult of SGM long ago, I am not at all surprised. These guys will do anything to protect their bud Ceej and the “reputation” of their “church”. They have proven over and over again that “protecting” the image of SGM is more important than doing the right thing. They are all about the perception of SGM.

    To elaborate on Eagle’s Sandusky comment, SGM is just as guilty as all those involved in the Penn State. Where PSU put winning as the absolute most important thing (above doing what is right), SGM puts the perception of their organization above all else. Protecting CJ is just part of it. The timing of the letter is extremely suspect – CJ’s coming to speak this weekend? Well, time to send out a letter backing him and use a few choice words to describe anyone who dare to question the all knowing and all seeing CJ and his cult SGM.

    Witch Hunt is an interesting choice of words, especially considering that SGM considers the puritans (the original US witch hunters and source of the term “witch hunt”) writers as heroes.

    Thankfully more and more people are catching on to what this organization is really about. In the future, SGM will be dead a buried and all that will be left is a footnote in Christian history about a small cult (or cult like organization) that was one of the many churches that practiced spiritual abuse.

  40. Diane –

    It amazes the mind even further that CJ is supported by so many in the mega/reformed/Calvinista realm. The Christian world we are “seeing” has become more about some “men” keeping their kingdoms than about the Good News of Jesus Christ.

  41. Dave A A –

    But then a bigger aPostle came along to cheer Mickey on and bigger aPostle also gained a cohort for himself 🙂 Mickey went to the big leagues. He does not remember his humble beginnings 🙁

  42. We have not heard the end of SGM, that is for sure.

    John MacArthur shared a platform with CJ Mahaney at the Resolve Conference. Someone (I think Paul Dohse) challenged Fred Butler (blogger and Bible teacher who works at Grace to You) about this. Fred brought up the Brent documents and how Grace Community does not find them credible at all. This is not surprising.

    So, this is my conclusion. If you are a woman, (even if you have your husband’s permission to blog), if you are a man, if you are a former pastor, your words don’t matter, period. You must be a pastor for your words to have any validity. You cannot reason with people like this. They won’t even consider your words. They will shift it around to discuss about your marriage, your family, your issues. Anytime you try to discuss the real issue, it will be shifted back to your issues. This is the pattern I have experienced many times with these folks and others like them. I now understand what Brent has been going through and Larry T. It is a sick system.

  43. “To do otherwise is to poison your soul, damage Crossway and displease God.”

    Hm. So he knows for a fact that God would be displeased? That right there makes this sound less like a genuine entreaty and more like scare tactics. I don’t remember Jesus or the apostles EVER tying God’s displeasure to the idea of which specific community you choose to be a part of. I seem to remember them tying God’s pleasure and displeasure to how one behaves in one’s life, and whether one embraces faith.

  44. ‘Divisive’…how they love that word! Funny how ‘slander’ only goes one way, yet elders can gossip about troublesome church members all they like.

    If you’ll forgive me the silliness of quoting myself – this made me think of what I wrote in response to the ‘How to save your church in three weeks’ post some time back, ‘How to lead your church in three weeks’:

    “Respond to another email from the concerned and ‘hurt’ church member. Tell them that you’re concerned about their grievances, and are saddened to hear about their loss of confidence in you as their leader. Tell them, though, that this list of concerns is worryingly detailed and suggests a vindictive spirit. Tell them to be aware that unfounded charges against you, a pastor, are not only dangerous and divisive, they are sinful and slanderous. Tell them you’re going to pray about this and will ask God to show you if there’s any deceitfulness in your heart. Tell them you’ll get back to them and let them know if they have been hurt or if any spiritual damage has been done.

    Arrange to meet with the elders (and the eager intern) to discuss the church’s direction. Mention that you’ve received another troublesome email. Explain the content of the message and show how you have been completely biblical and faithful in all your dealings with this member. Share how concerned you are for this member’s walk with the Lord, because slander is a serious sin. Then share your own concerns about this member’s personal history, and issues which this member has brought up to you during pastoral counselling. In order for your elders to keep you accountable, it is necessary that they have the full details about your (consistently ‘biblical’) actions as well as that information that the member has shared with you in confidence. Nod in sombre agreement when your elders confirm that you have been consistently faithful in your dealings with this member.

    Send a brief email to the member, co-authored with your elders, stating how you value reconciliation and unity. Tell them, however, that neither you nor God can condone sinful slander and that the member will need to be church-disciplined. Tell them that this is for their ultimate good so that they might learn to submit, repent of their divisiveness, and be restored to unity.”

  45. Diane

    It is a great pity that CJ didn’t exhibit grace when under pressure but acted in the most offensive way! He obviously responded out of what was in his heart and the fruit was dark and nasty.

    First prize for hypocrisy? The blackmail gets my vote and his cowardice in abandoning CLC (then preaching about the local church at the Resolved Conference!) comes a close second. How does the man live with himself?

  46. Freedom wrote-

    “The timing of the letter is extremely suspect – CJ’s coming to speak this
    weekend? Well, time to send out a letter backing him and use a few choice words to describe anyone who dare to question the all knowing and all seeing CJ and his cult SGM.”

    I have never been in SGM, but have been reading about it since the docs came out and have seen this tactic before via the comments at Refuge and Survivors. So predictable. Praying more eyes are opened to this form of abuse by manipulation.

  47. Why do so many pastors sound like CEOs and company directors talking about company growth, not a body of believers coming together to share their gifts? The pastors have sensed they are on the brink, what about the congregation? What do the prophets feel/sense about the brink? — Val

    “The wildest fantasy fiction ever written appears in a wartime country’s news media the day before that country loses the war.”
    — James Dunnigan

  48. @ Bridget-

    “It amazes the mind even further that CJ is supported by so many in the mega/reformed/Calvinista realm.”

    Amen to that. And beware that you question why this is happening lest you become labeled as a gossip, slanderer or character defamer.

    I think Deb above wrote either here or another thread (too lazy to check so please forgive me if it was someone else) that you are the problem if you question because all these godly men cannot see a problem. (Or- do see somewhat of a teeny tiny problem here and there, but since you are such a sinner too–who are you to bring it up.) So – a huge YES–you/we are the problem because we like to see actions matching words from our professing Christian leaders…too much to ask?

  49. So, this is my conclusion. If you are a woman, (even if you have your husband’s permission to blog), if you are a man, if you are a former pastor, your words don’t matter, period. You must be a pastor for your words to have any validity. — Julie Anne

    Especially if you are a pastor who has shaved his head to look more like The Ceej.

  50. Deb said, “A few years ago a theologian whom I trusted told me that since Piper, Mohler, Dever, Duncan, MacArthur yadda yadda yadda, endorse C.J. Mahaney – that the one with the problem is… ME!!!”

    These men are all enablers in a very sick system. Jesus was seen as a problem in His day too 🙂

  51. I have a question for those of you who have actually been in Mahaney’s church or one of his family of churches.

    Is it your impression that C.J. really does have a following within his church or family of church of lay people to whom he has ministered? In other words, is he really loved in his own church? Not by the staff or fellow ministers, but by the people?

    If so, is the love “a mile wide and an inch deep?”

  52. Hm. So he knows for a fact that God would be displeased? That right there makes this sound less like a genuine entreaty and more like scare tactics. — Sad Observer

    Or he thinks he has God on a leash as his personal enforcer.

    Come to think of that, wasn’t that the original/primary intent of the commandment about “Taking God’s Name in Vain”? Claiming God as cosmic backup for your own will or cosmic justification for your own dirty work?

  53. MM wwrote-

    “It is a great pity that CJ didn’t exhibit grace when under pressure but acted in the most offensive way! He obviously responded out of what was in his heart and the fruit was dark and nasty.

    First prize for hypocrisy? The blackmail gets my vote and his cowardice in abandoning CLC (then preaching about the local church at the Resolved Conference!) comes a close second. How does the man live with himself?”

    Since CJ preached so much, from what I have read by commenters and his own writings, about one’s devotion/submission to one’s own local church, it is amazing to me that he could be so hypocritical in this particular area. And then teach about the local church (that he split) at Resolved!!

    He deliberately chose to NOT place himself under any type of authority from his own local church (the one he started and declared the happiest place on earth), like he declares we all must…but instead he chose another. A friend’s church. Not his own.

    I cannot know with 100% accuracy his motives for doing so, but that particular move is not something that I have read and heard (from him) is “biblical” for others to do. Yet, he does it.

    I can surmise from this action that he must feel superior to the ones paying his salary- his own CLC, and cannot be bothered with CLC’s counsel. Instead, he split the church and moved.

    Horrible as that all is, and seeing it to be the very height of hypocrisy, the blackmail/coercion/sinful mistake/misunderstanding which would prevent the going forth of the gospel-(there-that’s a nice phrase to describe it) wins my vote as well. If I understand the whole deal, his intent was to hurt a child in this “misunderstanding” and worded it under the guise of saving his organization-that wins my vote.

  54. Anonymous –

    I have not been in his church. The main people that I hear extolling him are other leaders and the Pastor’s College attendees. I was in his presence a few times, but didn’t see him interact with the regulars. His preaching and humility? (because he wrote a book about it?) were the things lauded about him. This lauding was done by other leaders before he preached in churches and at conferences. He never appeared to me to be a “people” person. He seems more like a CEO. Not that education qualifies or disqualifies an elder, but he has no degrees. When he left CLC maybe 200 hundred left out of 2500 to 3000. Many of those who left were immediate, and by marriage, family members and those who have been with CJ for 30-35 years.

  55. Bridget:

    Do I read you correctly?

    When CJ left his Maryland Church recently, it was down to 200 people out of 2500 to 3000?

  56. Anonymous – CJ has a cult of personality going on with SGM members – it’s something that was re-enforced by SGM leadership. It used to be that Larry T and CJ were a tag team cult of personality, until CJ blackmailed Larry out the door and took over, then Larry’s name was rarely spoken and CJ was the supreme cult of personality leader across the entire organization. It was expected that the members would love and adore CJ, especially since he was put on the pedestal for the “shining” example of humility. He even wrote a book to show how humble he was. CJ’s humility was an example to be followed – to the point of pastors across SGM shaving their heads in adoration of his humility.

    Unfortunately, even after he was exposed for what he is – a narcissist who wants nothing more than control and power over people’s live (and the big paycheck to go with it from “tithes”) – people like Mickey still bow at the altar of Ceej. I guess the old saying that if you tell a lie enough you start to believe it is true – at least in this case.

  57. Wait there just a second. Did he just say it was a pastor’s “sacred duty” to make judgements in “situations like this”?!?!?

    Because the rest of us laity are ignorant imbeciles awaiting the pontifical proclamation of some super apostle?

    Anyone who has any experience in church politics should be able to see right through this. I don’t know hardly any of the back details of the story because I didn’t have the time to do all the reading and sort it out. I was going through a situation of my own that was remarkably similar, though on a much smaller scale.

    But as I read this document, here’s what I hear: “These people have these accusations made against us. But we shouldn’t have to defend ourselves from it. We already told you they weren’t true, and you should trust us because we’re your spiritual leaders. We even hopped through a kangaroo court just to prove it! So don’t listen to anything that might legitimately make us look bad, because it’s bad for you. We are what is truly good for you. You need US! We are your Savior, and you are nothing without our leadership and organization. Apart from your cooperation with us, the Kingdom of God will fail! So put your fingers back in your ear and do what we say.”

  58. On second thought, even if Brend Detwiler IS “driven by a sinful lust for vindication and vengeance,” doesn’t that very accusation mean that he has legitimately been wronged? He wants things set right, and we’re more concerned about him not sinning than we are about righting our own wrongs? For pete’s sake, this is a PASTOR condemning a fellow Christian for desiring justice! Apparently, we ought to rather lay down our life for the institution and its leaders, allowing them to trample us like a doormat on a good day. There is no greater sin than to hold our leadership to the standard of integrity. Christ brings justice for the oppressed, but the church says, “shut up and stop yer whinin! You’ll take what you get, and you’ll like it!” Sorry, but that is not the body of Christ in action. At this point we can be certain that the human institution has usurped and replaced the divine one.

  59. Having left a church with a Board where truth and honesty was sacrificed and/or manipulated for the bottom line-more members, more money, more power- it looks to me like that cult-like archetype is becoming epidemic.

    Then to imply that speaking out is gossip, slander and divisiveness? I thought the truth would set you free? WOW…message received loud and clear: Think like me (SGM leadership) or you’re doing the devil’s work.

    Whatever.

    I’ve got to say it again,”Jesus came to wash away our sins not our minds!!!!”

  60. Anonymous –

    I should have said “left with him” to be clear. There is still a large congregation at CLC. The large majority stayed and are making some major changes.

  61. Miguel –

    You’re getting the picture pretty clear. And it has happened with many others before Brent. The others weren’t able to make quite the noise that Brent is able to make. He was part of it for 30 years and kept copious records. The problem is people believe what “Pastor and aPostles” present to them and don’t question. Well — for some it’s easier to leave quietly than to question. Others get abused and often kicked to the curb for questioning. The internet has really changed the secrecy aspect and the ability to keep things swepted under the rug. SGM is not liking it much. It would be interesting to get your perspective on the AoR report. It might still be on the SGM website, buried a bit I imagine.

  62. Bridget:

    I assume that you are or have been a member or have folks close to you who are, that’s why I am following up with you.

    Nothwithstanding the declaration of “fitness for ministry”, is this change in leadership at Covenant Life Church and C.J.’s departure seen as a loss or rebuke to C.J., even if it is not stated as such?

  63. Let’s make up a generic letter to help them the next time:

    Dear

    It has come to our attention that has been spreading stories about . Those stories are very harmful (omit because they are true), and we are asking that you spurn and not listen to him/her or read anything he/she produces. Doing so will defile you, and will be displeasing to God. Besides, we had earnest men (omit who happened to be good friends of or monetarily bound to our pastor/leader/saint/apostle) look into the matter and they proclaimed that they are satisfied with his ability to lead (omit: especially if they continue to make money and have power and authority because of it). is clearly living in sin. You can tell because he wants to be vindicated (omit: tell the truth about what has happened and clean the reputation we have smeared) and that is clearly the sin of pride. Just keep those tithes coming in, because God clearly is doing great things here, though we are having to weather the storm (OMIT: caused by our own actions of sin against our brother). So please SHUN or you will be sinning too. (Omit, but imply: because if you don’t, we will shun you too).

  64. somehow some things were left out. Second try:
    Dear

    It has come to our attention that ____has been spreading stories about _____. Those stories are very harmful (omit because they are true), and we are asking that you spurn and not listen to him/her or read anything he/she produces. Doing so will defile you, and will be displeasing to God. Besides, we had earnest men (omit who happened to be good friends of or monetarily bound to our pastor/leader/saint/apostle) look into the matter and they proclaimed that they are satisfied with his ability to lead (omit: especially if they continue to make money and have power and authority because of it). _____is clearly living in sin. You can tell because he wants to be vindicated (omit: tell the truth about what has happened and clean the reputation we have smeared) and that is clearly the sin of pride. Just keep those tithes coming in, because God clearly is doing great things here, though we are having to weather the storm (OMIT: caused by our own actions of sin against our brother). So please SHUN or you will be sinning too. (Omit, but imply: because if you don’t, we will shun you too).

  65. Anonymous –

    CJ was no longer a pastor at CLC. He turned the leading of that church over to Joshua Harris about 5 or 6 years ago. He turned his attention to leading SGM and spent more time on the conference circuit. He was a member of CLC (as he had been for 30 years) and was supposed to be accountable to the pastors at CLC. When the rubber hit the road, he didn’t like how CLC leaders were handling the release of Brent’s documentation (and there were differences arising before this time I believe) so he left CLC and said his family could not be cared for at CLC. (As it turns out from Brent’s documentation, CJ was really not being accountable to anyone.) He went to be a part of Dever’s church. Then he started playing the victim (if you can believe that) because of how he says he was treated by CLC and because of Brent’s gossip and slander. (This is evidenced in sermons that he and other pastors of some SGM churches
    gave after his departure.) He has not refuted what Brent has written, only disagreed with how Brent judged him and the events. Of course, there were others before Brent (Larry Tomczak being one of many) who have had similar experiences with CJ and other leaders of SGM. Oh, yes, the blogs. They are making everything so much worse — especially the four that have been exposing some of this nonesense for the past four years.

  66. In their dulusional minds, it is considered gossip instead of the truth. This is the norm with most so-called ministries and churches today.

  67. Anonymous – CJ has a cult of personality going on with SGM members – it’s something that was re-enforced by SGM leadership. It used to be that Larry T and CJ were a tag team cult of personality, until CJ blackmailed Larry out the door and took over, then Larry’s name was rarely spoken and CJ was the supreme cult of personality leader across the entire organization. — Freedom

    Just like Comrade Stalin did to Comrades Kirov and Trotsky?

  68. It was expected that the members would love and adore CJ, especially since he was put on the pedestal for the “shining” example of humility. He even wrote a book to show how humble he was. — Freedom

    Did he have his Armorbearers blow trumpet fanfares to point out his Humility to the masses?

  69. Awww poor SGM is being persecuted by evil people who are out to get them!

    Of course the problem doesn’t stem from within SGM. Nooo, of course not. The problem stems from those outside SGM who are trying to tarnish SGM and CJ Mahaney’s Pastor/Athlete Fitness Image!

    CJ wants the red carpet treatment as he premieres his new role as “pastor,” working behind the scenes to prime people’s minds with press releases like Micky Connelly’s letter, aimed to create an impression of CJ as the suffering servant.

    I’m not buying a ticket to that show. No way. Nor should anyone else. What a waste of money. CJ is a fraud!

    Obviously self-delusion is very much alive in SGM. CJ reminds me of Uncle Andrew in The Magician’s Nephew:

    But of course you must understand that rules of that sort, however excellent they may be for little boys—and servants—and women—and even people in general, can’t possibly be expected to apply to profound students and great thinkers and sages. No, Digory. Men like me, who possess hidden wisdom, are freed from common rules just as we are cut off from common pleasures. Ours, my boy, is a high and lonely destiny.

  70. Deb, Wow… but typical that others would side with Piper, Mac Arthur,etc and say that it’s your problem. People think that these guys walk on water and they themselves think so to.

  71. “How does the man live with himself.” By being dulusional. Nothing bothers his conscience.

  72. Anonymous asked:

    “Is it your impression that C.J. really does have a following within his church or family of church of lay people to whom he has ministered? In other words, is he really loved in his own church? Not by the staff or fellow ministers, but by the people?”

    This won’t directly answer your question and I have shared this before but one observation I have is that the leaders of CLC aren’t standing up and supporting C.J. Mahaney. They were in the dark and upset with what Brent’s document revealed about C.J. Mahaney, especially the blackmailing/coercion Mahaney did.

    The leaders of CLC were those that were around C.J. Mahaney and saw him in action all the time. Most of the other leaders of SGM, especially the board members, only interacted with Mahaney at meetings and conferences. Thus the CLC Leaders were the ones that saw C.J. Mahaney in action on a day to day basis.

    Had C.J. Mahaney been an example of a servant and showed a servant’s character then one would think they would be strongly standing up and defending C.J. Mahaney but they aren’t. My guess is that these leaders sensed or new for a while that there issues with C.J. Mahaney that needed to be addressed but didn’t know how to go about forcing this.

    To put this another way, it is easier for someone to stand up on stage and speak and appear humble and say all the right things. It is even fairly easy to give that appearance when you meet people at various conferences etc. It isn’t so easy when you are dealing with people on a daily basis.

    From what I understand a strong majority of the members of CLC didn’t want to see C.J. Mahaney return in leadership, especially after they found what C.J. Mahaney did to Larry Tomczak.

  73. Nicholas, I just read his response. This is typical with people whos main concern is only for themsleves. Just like the pharasees, these people like to be seen and known with the so-called “Christian elite.” The way pastors and leaders think today is that if you’re not one of the known elite who has “done” so much work for the gospel(gag…NOT), then your opinion and the truth doesn’t matter. Those who don’t stand up for the truth always have a hidden agenda themselves. It’s not because they are ignorant of the truth. Are they delusional, yes. What I’ve witnessed is that as they age, they become even more delusional and self entitled. Therefore there is no turning back to reality.

  74. Nicholas –

    I couldn’t read it. The initial quotes by Piper and the pushing of CJ’s book shut me down.

  75. Also, what really ticks me off is the blatant worship of these so-called great theologians(I saw where one person was refering to these guys), who also get a free pass. Like these theologians are so right in their beliefs in what scripture says. They are men, not gods. It's funny how these Calvinists can point out other peoples sin and how they need to confess it(like our sin will be completely gone), but in their own arrogance refuse to see their own blatant worship of these MEN who are dead. Not to mention other sin.

  76. Redo – “like these men are so right in their interpretation of scripture.” I know, my spelling sucks.

  77. Stormy

    I heard one of these pastors explain that they understand the gospel better than everybody else because they spend 30 hours a week "unpacking" Scripture and some have studied for PhDs. That's exactly what Jesus said "Blessed are the educated." Hmmm….

    Said pastor's role model, Mark Driscoll, commented that he wrote one of his sermons in a few hours while watching a Seattle Mariner's game. Also that disqualifies people like Corrie Ten Boom. Poor, stupid us.

  78. Post: Read this great book by CJ!
    Comment: CJ isn’t all he’s cracked up to be.
    Reply: Your comment was deleted because it’s off topic.

    I noticed Bob has 4 pictures at the top of his blog. A Bible with cross, and 3 dead reformers. One would think we’re to give all 4 equal weight/respect. Ok, being picky….

  79. Dave A A –

    Mary Kassian seems to be having a writers block . . . how will we ever be educated now?!?!

  80. Keep in mind that, according to the theology she espouses, if her blog is read by adult men (over 12 y.o.??), she is failing to be sufficiently submissive to the males of the world. So she is theologically obliged to post all comments that come from males or she is IN SIN for defying her theologically required submission to men. I suspect that her last deletions have caused her to come to the attention of some pastor somewhere who has told her that any more blogging without letting men post comments is SIN. So she has a struggle between her desire to blog and the instruction of her theology.

  81. Bridget,
    Yes. 12 days since we… Strike that… you ladies were promised the final educational installment. On second thought, Mary K is off-topic on this thread, so blog queens should delete this comment.
    Seriously, the one sure fire way to get comments deleted on many blogs is to mention CJ with anything less than adulation.

  82. Stormy,

    “Gossip” does not mean that it is not “truth”. Even truth told by a non-pastor about a pastor is “gossip” by the Calvinista dictionary. And “gossip” told by a pastor is “truth” BECAUSE the pastor told it, even if it was a bald faced lie when they heard it. Besides, it was God’s will that they said it, so it was clearly within God’d will that they said it, whereas, a non-pastor is always in sin, so everything they say is “gossip”.

    And if that makes sense to you, then let me recommend a therapist.

  83. “Gossip” does not mean that it is not “truth”. Even truth told by a non-pastor about a pastor is “gossip” by the Calvinista dictionary. And “gossip” told by a pastor is “truth” BECAUSE the pastor told it, even if it was a bald faced lie when they heard it. Besides, it was God’s will that they said it, so it was clearly within God’d will that they said it, whereas, a non-pastor is always in sin, so everything they say is “gossip”.

    lol—oohhhh, that’s why my comments were deleted at Challies’, Ortlund’s and Jared Wilson’s blogs…I get it…off topic plus- they pastor, me not.(Not to mention a woman as well…I should use Dan instead of Diane.

  84. Robin writes:

    Too many people have fled from SGM due to their wacky control methods. You have to think after a while that maybe just maybe things are a little off there. Have you heard of such an exodus even in a very conservative SBC church? I haven’t.

    Actually, I have. I saw it happen in the SBC church in which I grew up. The pastor essentially attempted to convert church governance from the traditional SBC model to the hyper-authoritarian Calvinista model. It got him ousted and split the church four ways. The original church, once among the fastest growing in the SBC, is now at about a quarter of its peak membership, the remaining members rattling around its mega church campus like ghosts.

  85. This example of *gossipy* Diane being gently reproved 😉 by “Pastor David” comes to mind:
    Challies Article:
    “He (Mahaney)  is exactly the kind of man we want to stand with—together for the gospel.”                              
    David Kjos (moderator): Memo to those who want to bring up the Mahaney/SGM situation: We’re not going there. Period. (Ed. Note: Didn’t they just go there already?).
    Diane: What does that even mean? Why not?
    David Kjos: If you don’t know, you probably don’t need to know. Because this isn’t the place for that. And that’s all I have to say about that.
    Personally, I don’t think changing to “Dan” will help. After all, I went by “David” in the same thread and got deleted as well. I forgot to go by “Pastor David” when I quoted scripture, which turned the scripture from truth into gossip.

  86. Dave and An Attorney –

    LOL!!

    And what good does it do if only half of the “one flesh” can read her theology anyway. I guess there’s no point in her blogging since she nor I could pass on anything of value to my other half . . . logic failure!

  87. Bridget,
    Likewise “believers” have nothing of value to pass on *up* to “church elders”. The prayers of the church and the intercession of Christ are likewise pointless. Sigh…….

  88. @ Dave AA–

    lol–to which I also replied:

    Diane 1 comment collapsed CollapseExpand

    I do know–genuinely wondered why a subject was off limits for inquiry.

    I think this is the place for that-esp. if people have sincere questions/concerns.

    What you had to say about “that” was nothing that helped me at all- but it is your comment thread.

    •ALike
    • Reply
    • 0 minutes ago
    •0 Like
    •F

    October 18, 2011 10:33 PM

    He (Dave, Challies) did not respond to that part-(while briefly there).

    I am just an uppity wimmin I guess…but my hub loves me! All 32 years!

  89. “Actually, I have. I saw it happen in the SBC church in which I grew up. The pastor essentially attempted to convert church governance from the traditional SBC model to the hyper-authoritarian Calvinista model. It got him ousted and split the church four ways. The original church, once among the fastest growing in the SBC, is now at about a quarter of its peak membership, the remaining members rattling around its mega church campus like ghosts.”

    Interesting. Over at the Calvinist pastors blog, SBCVoices they claim that no churches have split over Calvinism. In fact they even had a blog post demanding names of agressive Calvinists who have split churches and claimed that since no one commented with a name, it has never happened!

    AS if people are going to name names on the internet! These Calvinists are amazing.

  90. @ Dee,

    “Diane
    Were the same comments deleted on all three blogs?”

    Three different comments were deleted on three blogs.

  91. Pingback: Mickey Connolly – Stop the Witch Hunt of CJ and SGM! | The … | churchgrowthissues.com

  92. Stormy, I told him to delete my comment. I believe I was wrong in accusing him of having a double standard. I don’t know why he left his up.

  93. Deb, The Redeemer church in Virginia is the first church to leave the SGM fold, and Grace Community in the Bradenton/Sarasota Florida area was the second. These are just the first of many, many churches I believe that will depart from SGM before the end of the year.

  94. Patrick,

    Thanks for the info.  We will be doing an update at some point.  Please keep us informed either through commentary or e-mail.

  95. Patrick

    i am glad to see some churches leaving SGM. It shows some independent thought which is necessary to evaluate the seriousness of what has happened. I am still very concerned about the number of Calvinista big boys who are propping up Mahaney. If he was Arminian, he would have been thown to the wolves. 

  96. Dee –

    He used to be Arminian . . . Makes me sick that “all is well” for him according to the RBDs just because he is one of the “Remormed.” I don’t remember “reformed” being one of the fruits of the Spirit.